This makes me so angry!!

FlorenceBassey said:
That is nothing seriouse i have seen much much worse, please, does the horse really look bothered? no, does he/she looks scared? no, does he/she look uncared for, lame, over or under weight? no, If you wish to cause an uproar find something worth roaring about.
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I wasn't 'roaring' when I posted this! I was concerned over a rider's behaviour towards their horse.
 
flamehead said:
Could people please READ what I'm saying? I'm NOT saying he was right to do that. I'm saying I don't think people should jump on him because you don't know the back story (although we now do). See above about sobbing for week xxx
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I see your point, really I do :), but at the end of the day as far as the nature of this post is concerned, it's about the clip and the way he acted at a competition, that it made the OP feel angry hence they title of the post, so obvioulsy people who think the same are going to reply on that clip, of course we can't judge his standard of horsemanship or the welfare of how he keeps his horses (which I'm sure is top notch) that wan't the issue. :)
 
jemima, I read it before you deleted it. wont say what it said but i think we can all agree thats a MUCH more serious situation. xxxx
 
All I will say is..........

Its never the horse, its always the rider

and

There is no place for violence around horses

Both quotes from very fine horse people!
 
I don't understand. I thought under BS rules (formerly BSJA) you were only allowed to hit your horse three times. My OH works at a large equestrian centre where they have BS on a regular basis throughout the winter and he saw a woman rider fall off at a BS comp, she got back on in the collecting ring and he knew what she was going to do as he followed her into the collecting ring and she asked if anyone had a long stick to teach the horse a lesson. When she started laying into it he told her if she wanted to do that she did it off these premises. Showing her up in front of everyone in my opinion was the right thing to do, I am sure it would make her think twice about her actions next time.
 
applecart14 said:
When she started laying into it he told her if she wanted to do that she did it off these premises. Showing her up in front of everyone in my opinion was the right thing to do, I am sure it would make her think twice about her actions next time.
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No not at all, if/when someone chooses to give their horse a thrashing someone else having a word will make no difference at all,

This really doesn't make me feel one way or another, Its when certain well known showjumpers hang a pony from the rafters of its stable, really beat it and then leave it hanging for 24 hours because it bucked their child off, that i get annoyed/upset. Action was taken against the person and the pony was rescued by my ex boss, he is now in a very nice home as a companion as he had so may issue's left by this ordeal it was the kindest thing for him.
 
FlorenceBassey said:
No not at all, if/when someone chooses to give their horse a thrashing someone else having a word will make no difference at all,

This really doesn't make me feel one way or another, Its when certain well known showjumpers hang a pony from the rafters of its stable, really beat it and then leave it hanging for 24 hours because it bucked their child off, that i get annoyed/upset. Action was taken against the person and the pony was rescued by my ex boss, he is now in a very nice home as a companion as he had so may issue's left by this ordeal it was the kindest thing for him.
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Wow. That got you 'annoyed/upset'. I can see why you think we are all brainless but I'm glad I'm not numb to cruelty. I guess I have been fortunate over the years as to the yards I have been on. We'll have to agree to disagree on this one.
 
FlorenceBassey said:
No not at all, if/when someone chooses to give their horse a thrashing someone else having a word will make no difference at all,

This really doesn't make me feel one way or another, Its when certain well known showjumpers hang a pony from the rafters of its stable, really beat it and then leave it hanging for 24 hours because it bucked their child off, that i get annoyed/upset. Action was taken against the person and the pony was rescued by my ex boss, he is now in a very nice home as a companion as he had so may issue's left by this ordeal it was the kindest thing for him.
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Indeed.

I think some people seem to think due to how proffessional they are, the name or what level they are competing at that when they act in such ways, it gets brushed under the carpet...everyone knows its wrong, but still its quietly forgotten about.

I've seen a few eye openers on a well known SJ's yard, stuff their own liveries didn't even know about (behind the scene/out of public view) and things are not always as they seem.

To some (not all), horses are there to make money...end off, if not they are treated very differently!
 
Yes, people do much worse - but that doesn't make this any less wrong, just as the fact that lots of people act in this way makes it no less wrong.
 
The dog is wet in the picture and being restrained by a person holding a hose.

The horse didn't jump a jump first time around, and is smacked more times than the allowed 3 times.

All of us who watched it were not comfortable with the rider's behaviour.

I don't think anybody said "that horse is clearly beaten regularly" (although one suggested it wasn't due to its lack of fear response) or "he obviously went out of the ring, spent 21 days begging for forgiveness from the devine god almightly, gave up competing and became a nun so that he could teach hamsters to ride horses by means of feeding them mullberies as a reward, rather than beating them".

HHOers were simply displaying a range of emotions from disappointed to sad to shocked, at this behaviour, in the moment it was shown. Horses live in the moment - their survival used to depend on it - and the horse wouldn't relate the incident to the rider kneeling on a prayer mat later that day and singing Ho-o pono pono with incence sticks burning til the hamsters came home.

Therefore perhaps the best way to view the incident is that, regardless of whatever else did/diddn't happen, in that moment it was wrong to hit the horse as many times as the rider did.
 
Spudlet said:
Yes, people do much worse - but that doesn't make this any less wrong, just as the fact that lots of people act in this way makes it no less wrong.
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^^^ Couldn't agree more.

It's like when people say " oh there is far much worse going on in the world" Of course there is! that is a truism. But it doesn't make this right, or acceptable.

Just because there are far worse levels of cruelty, this IMO is still cruelty. This is why there are rules in place.
 
I was always taught that when a horse refuses, give it a smack on the shoulder BEFORE turning away from the fence, if you smack it after the horse won't know what the smack was for, what this guy did was purely wrong, top showjumper or not he is supposed to be a role model for the younger riders, he was clearly taking his frustraion out on the poor horse, i have felt the same at times (who hasn't), but will never take it out on my horse, i prefer not to ride with a whip, but i accept that some horses will try and get out of jumping without a little reminder. I also agree with whoever said about racing, i can't stand to see the horses running their a**e off and getting a few whacks, i think it should be banned. My first ex-racer actualy had scars on his bum from the whips.:(
 
Naturally said:
The dog is wet in the picture and being restrained by a person holding a hose.

The horse didn't jump a jump first time around, and is smacked more times than the allowed 3 times.

All of us who watched it were not comfortable with the rider's behaviour.

I don't think anybody said "that horse is clearly beaten regularly" (although one suggested it wasn't due to its lack of fear response) or "he obviously went out of the ring, spent 21 days begging for forgiveness from the devine god almightly, gave up competing and became a nun so that he could teach hamsters to ride horses by means of feeding them mullberies as a reward, rather than beating them".

HHOers were simply displaying a range of emotions from disappointed to sad to shocked, at this behaviour, in the moment it was shown. Horses live in the moment - their survival used to depend on it - and the horse wouldn't relate the incident to the rider kneeling on a prayer mat later that day and singing Ho-o pono pono with incence sticks burning til the hamsters came home.

Therefore perhaps the best way to view the incident is that, regardless of whatever else did/diddn't happen, in that moment it was wrong to hit the horse as many times as the rider did.
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Nail - Head. Accompanied by a bit of humour :D
 
You can't KNOW from one video of one situation, the definitive truth on what the story behind this is. You don't know the person (well, I'm assuming you don't anyway), and you don't know the horse.

Hannah xx[/QUOTE]

There is NO situation or story that calls for him to beat his horse, horses can be nappy and have bad days, thats all part and parcel of riding, i don't know him or the horse but there is no need for that.
 
If that's what he'll do to his horse in public I hate to think what he does in the privacy of his own yard. I'm amazed that the judges didn't just ring the bell on him and eliminate him before he was even at the fence. They are as much in the wrong as him as they did not uphold the rules in place to disuade riders from behaving like this. Poor horse, he would have known that horse was going to stop the first time, why not smack it on the shoulder then and re-present it with another warning smack.
 
Can I asks what everyone on this thread has got against hamsters? Don't make me ring the RSPCA hotline!!!! :D
 
You can't KNOW from one video of one situation, the definitive truth on what the story behind this is. You don't know the person (well, I'm assuming you don't anyway), and you don't know the horse.

Hannah xx[/QUOTE]

There is NO story or situation that calls for him to beat his horse, horses can be nappy and have off days, thats part and parcel of riding, i don't know him or his horse but can clarly see he was taking his frustration out on the horse, which is totaly unaceptable.
 
I'm not condoning it, but there is a much bigger picture here.

T_G whacking the cob over a cross pole would be questionable in the extreme. A horse who can clearly jump huge, technical fences, getting every assistance (and no hinderance) from its rider suddenly chucking it at a known 'issue' which can't have been a constant one or the horse wouldn't be jumping at that level... The authorities have it under control, and I hope the horse isn't now shot or sold for meat since its occasional misdemeanours in the showring can't now be addressed so it may continue its career and (I would hazard) privileged lifestyle in between shows.

Articulate as you are T_G, I think you are getting out of your depth on this one.
 
brighteyes said:
I'm not condoning it, but there is a much bigger picture here.

T_G whacking the cob over a cross pole would be questionable in the extreme.

Where are you getting this from? Do any of the pictures I posted (in a completely seperate thread) show me whacking the sweet cob who I was riding?

A horse who can clearly jump huge, technical fences, getting every assistance (and no hinderance) from its rider suddenly chucking it at a known 'issue' which can't have been a constant one or the horse wouldn't be jumping at that level... The authorities have it under control, and I hope the horse isn't now shot or sold for meat since its occasional misdemeanours in the showring can't now be addressed so it may continue its career and (I would hazard) privileged lifestyle in between shows.

What? I've never said the horse is at fault. I simply posted saying that the riders repeated smacks were, as I and others have felt, inappropriate.

Articulate as you are T_G, I think you are getting out of your depth on this one.

I simply made a post speaking my view, not once have I said I'm a good SJ (which I'm clearly not!), but I stick by my opinion that the riders repeated use of the whip was wrong.
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indiat said:
Can I asks what everyone on this thread has got against hamsters? Don't make me ring the RSPCA hotline!!!! :D
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We might have to call WHW!
(WorldHamsterWelfare:D)
 
Why out of depth? I'm not a show jumper or any kind of competitor in any way shape nor form, OP just posted a video that made her angry, it made me and - judging by other posts - others, angry too. Does it mean I am out of my depth by also commenting?

Not having a go . . .just wondered why you thought this :confused:
 
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