Those of you with small acreage...

[AutumnDays]

How do you manage land maintenance after winter? The other harrow and roll threads got me thinking, and after talking to the other half about his plans, I have 6 acres less going forward, so left with 4 acres for 2 horses and 5 sheep. It's a temporary loss, as he's doing drainage ditching, scrub clearing (it looks like a willow and bramble plantation!) and will be building a shed and hard standing yard (so excited about this it's unreal!).

The 4 acres are currently all potched, really muddy, and have surface water galore. I'm hoping that will drain a bit in the couple of dry days promised so I can roll it etc. I know ideally it needs resting for a few weeks etc after, so my question is do you just do sections and fence off, of just do your thing and put them back? I've only had proper paddocks before, so easy to rest and rotate, but any fencing etc now is all temporary tape and plastic posts. It's all awkward at the moment due to the state of the land when we go it a few months ago, the state it's in after winter, old fencing that needs to come up (weird layout, no gates) and the other work that needs doing to it, is making me miss livery big time!

 

[HollyWoozle]

We use a chain harrow but flipped over instead of poo picking and we don’t have enough land to rest/rotate. We never roll. I realise this is not recommended but somehow it seems to work for us without major issues and it allows my parents to manage (in their 70s). We try to do it when it’s frozen or hot and sunny.

I think it is helped by the fact we have a lake in the middle of the field and get a lot of birds, there are currently wild geese grazing the field too and lots of birds picking around in there. The horses tend to poo in specific areas anyhow and with the harrow flipped over, it breaks it up but doesn’t drag it all over the place and they can continue grazing the rest. Our grass has always been very poor which works in our favour as we don’t have to restrict them, we just add hay to feed them up.

We have around 3 acres primarily used by 4 horses/ponies 24/7 (and then a mini on a track). We worm test and our appy does need worming sometimes but he is a “high shedder” who has always been more susceptible and we have not seen any changes since we started doing this instead of poo picking.

As I say, I cannot recommend this maintenance in good faith, knowing that resting is always suggested, but it works for us and the horses (retired) are all thriving. The rutted/muddy areas just get flattened naturally as the weather dries out through them walking and rolling on it themselves.

 

[poiuytrewq]

I haven't been harrowing as when we moved here my harrows dissapeared! It gets rolled, possibly a few times as it always seems to turn bad and get messed up again after the first roll!
I do poo pick religiously every day. Mine are out over night, probably 4/5- 6.30/7 depending on my work so they do have a fair time off it.
I do in theory get to rest. Last summer the one field had a decent long rest and we actually made a little bit of hay off it (more to let it grow, cut and get rid of it really) that did it a world of good. However i do switch and swap a bit, one field is significantly easier to get them in and out so i use it if I'm being lazy or have an early start even if its "resting"

I think the main advice i would give Is shut your eyes a bit when its bad, It does come back and it recovers surprisingly quickly. I never keep mine in and in spring it all looks fine again.

 

[SEL]

I don't roll because there's a lot of evidence it damages the soil structure. Chain harrow, aerator this year and then the track goes up so the middle gets a good rest but the horses keep moving.

 

[AutumnDays]

Thanks for your replies guys. Reassuring to hear others don't poo pick, I bought the sheep to cross graze and keep scrub down, and so far everyone is testing clear (regularly done), so hopefully this will continue when (if!) I get access to all back and can rest and rotate. Unfortunately I'm going to have to roll, at least this year, as it's heavy clay soil, and the heavy plant that has gone through already has created gorges a track is in the planning to go up too, so yes, I can see that bit would get rested. At the moment it's free access because it's easier for them to pick a way around the worst bits, they've been "in" on a shed and concrete yard space I've managed to borrow for 2 weeks with a couple of hours turnout added for the last week. Mud fever adds to the fun of it all

 

[poiuytrewq]

I'm not totally sure how big my field is but I get a barrow full of poo per night, so it would be 1.5-2 if they were out 24 hours. If i didn't it would be absolutely covered i think within a few weeks. I totally don't understand how people can get away with it on smaller fields!
I *thought that the temps needed to be consistently over a certain temp to kill eggs even if harrowed which it rarely is in the UK. However i have several friends who don't poo pick and always have clear FEC results.
I have however noticed that one friend who never poo picks, even though she lives less than a mile away and isnt near water has significantly more flies in summer than I do here. Her horses are covered in them and i always put that down to the amount of poo Maybe I'm wrong, when my horse was there his fly rugs got covered in poo stains (which definitely attracted flies) but when he's here he'd never roll or lie in poo.
I'm very jealous because I'd love to stop, I just don't see how its possible!

I think its partly because the first lady i worked for absolutely drummed it into me when i was young and its really stuck!

 

[dorsetladette]

I have 5 acres of poor grazing which I keep 3 ponies (around 14hh) and 2 sheep (to cross graze, remove weeds and reduce worm count) It's usually works. 3 paddocks, 2 for summer and a larger one for winter. This winter has been very different. although I did chain harrow (upside down harrows so it didn't pull everything out) at the week end we are back to being under water again today.
My ground is well draining sandy soil, but even I am struggling this year.

I poo pick round the hay feeder, waters and in the shelters, but the rest usually gets harrows once a week. My worm counts are low and the ground is improving. Grazing has lasted most of the winter to be fair and the boys have managed on adlib hay and a balancer all winter, with minimal rugging.

 

[AutumnDays]

I'm not totally sure how big my field is but I get a barrow full of poo per night, so it would be 1.5-2 if they were out 24 hours. If i didn't it would be absolutely covered i think within a few weeks. I totally don't understand how people can get away with it on smaller fields!
I *thought that the temps needed to be consistently over a certain temp to kill eggs even if harrowed which it rarely is in the UK. However i have several friends who don't poo pick and always have clear FEC results.
I have however noticed that one friend who never poo picks, even though she lives less than a mile away and isnt near water has significantly more flies in summer than I do here. Her horses are covered in them and i always put that down to the amount of poo Maybe I'm wrong, when my horse was there his fly rugs got covered in poo stains (which definitely attracted flies) but when he's here he'd never roll or lie in poo.
I'm very jealous because I'd love to stop, I just don't see how its possible!

I think its partly because the first lady i worked for absolutely drummed it into me when i was young and its really stuck!

I am usually a stickler for poo picking, but I cannot get my barrow or the quad on there the state it's in at the moment! Once we are up and running it'll be back to normal routine, I agree with the fly control aspect, my Appy x seems to attract them enough without any assistance

 

[windswoo]

I've got 9 acres split into two with permanent fencing and then when in I split with electric so they don't have the whole lot in one go.
I've got three 16hh on it at the mo, two are mine and one is a friends. We muck out every day and get two barrows off it. The land is also really heavy soil and I've really struggled to get in harrowed the last few years as its either swamp or bone dry.
I've got someone on speed dial and I'm going to try and see if they can come out in a couple of weeks hoping that the weather might have improved.
The grass in the first field looks really old so think it needs a spruce up, but the bottom is so poached you could loose a foot!!!
Did get my hedge done last week which made the field look loads better and the tractor didn't make that much of a mess of the ground.

 

[Lucky Snowball]

I also poo pick religiously. Currently massive divots , mud and water everywhere. I’m having to walk to and fro with a skip, slipping and sliding! 3 horses on 9 acres split into 4 paddocks.

 

[bouncing_ball]

I'm not totally sure how big my field is but I get a barrow full of poo per night, so it would be 1.5-2 if they were out 24 hours. If i didn't it would be absolutely covered i think within a few weeks. I totally don't understand how people can get away with it on smaller fields!
I *thought that the temps needed to be consistently over a certain temp to kill eggs even if harrowed which it rarely is in the UK. However i have several friends who don't poo pick and always have clear FEC results.
I have however noticed that one friend who never poo picks, even though she lives less than a mile away and isnt near water has significantly more flies in summer than I do here. Her horses are covered in them and i always put that down to the amount of poo Maybe I'm wrong, when my horse was there his fly rugs got covered in poo stains (which definitely attracted flies) but when he's here he'd never roll or lie in poo.
I'm very jealous because I'd love to stop, I just don't see how its possible!

I think its partly because the first lady i worked for absolutely drummed it into me when i was young and its really stuck!

To OP - avoid rolling if you can, and harrow harder, rolling really compacts soil.

Poo picking - I have one horse on just under an acre. (He has neighbours but he eats a LOT more than they do).

I have perimeter track and 5 small internal paddocks. I rotate to new internal paddock every 3 weeks. Each then rests for 12 weeks. I poo pick into resting paddock and us a large rake to harrow and spread poo out so doesnt kill grass. I worm count every 8 weeks and no issues so far. I also worm for encysted and tape.

I have no machinery to double handle the poo and build a muck heap and spread it. My soil desperately needs the benefit from the poo. It does break down pretty well in 12 weeks and my horse doesnt seem to find grass sour.

IME just leaving it will kill the grass underneath. It needs to be clearer or harrowed or kicked about or broken up in some way.

Not clearing it, and not managing worm & horse population would seem pretty risky.

 

[SEL]

I'm not totally sure how big my field is but I get a barrow full of poo per night, so it would be 1.5-2 if they were out 24 hours. If i didn't it would be absolutely covered i think within a few weeks. I totally don't understand how people can get away with it on smaller fields!
I *thought that the temps needed to be consistently over a certain temp to kill eggs even if harrowed which it rarely is in the UK. However i have several friends who don't poo pick and always have clear FEC results.
I have however noticed that one friend who never poo picks, even though she lives less than a mile away and isnt near water has significantly more flies in summer than I do here. Her horses are covered in them and i always put that down to the amount of poo Maybe I'm wrong, when my horse was there his fly rugs got covered in poo stains (which definitely attracted flies) but when he's here he'd never roll or lie in poo.
I'm very jealous because I'd love to stop, I just don't see how its possible!

I think its partly because the first lady i worked for absolutely drummed it into me when i was young and its really stuck!

You sound like me!

I take a full barrow am and pm and when we went away for the weekend and I decided not to pay to have it removed the field looked grim on our return (its just under 3 acres for 3 horses). I was on a yard with a redworm problem many years ago with no poo picking and the vet advice was not to harrow unless you know its going to be hot otherwise you just spread worm eggs everywhere and the horses can't avoid them.

I also have much better grass coverage since poo picking. When I bought the land there were huge patches of nettles and grass the horses wouldn't touch in the toilet areas.

I do spread it back when well rotted though on paddocks which are going to have a fair few months without horses. Mainly by hand too - I don't need a gym membership

 

[tda]

I have not rolled for a couple of years but one paddock is so trashed that when it dries I am going to lightly roll it, i will have to harrow to spread the poo , my reasoning being it's already churned up .
I don't poo pick in the winter, its too wet to get the quad and trailer in

 

[paddy555]

even if it had nothing to do with worm control I would poo pick because otherwise it looks awful and I am the one who has to look at it. You end up with "roughs and lawns" and the "roughs" just grow in area and you lose grazing to the roughs., The roughs also then just became nettle, dock and coarse long grass areas.

I roll but possibly one of the problems with rolling is if you use a contractor/farmer their rollers are pretty large and heavy. We have a granite roller which is a lot lighter and that doesn't cause the problems a "proper" roller could do.

 

[tda]

I only have a quad and smallish roller, which I will not weigh down with extra water to give a lighter roll.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

We find that the sheep take care of the land for us. They walk the ruts out and the birds helped then by the sheep and the weather deal with any muck left on the fields over winter. We have a small field vacuum which we use in summer where the horses leave the most muck. The sheep soon eat down weeds as they appear but we do have a kind of push along petrol driven strimmer (I'm sure it has a proper name) if the weeds get away from the sheep.

 

[The Xmas Furry]

OP, I have 4.5 acres with 1.5 fuzzies on. Split into several small paddocks with interlinking gates between each and every one which means I can let B have more grass when required when little A is in during the day. They get a fair amount of moving about as I dont have water tanks up the fields, for the last 15 yrs I've only had tanks by the yard gates.

I've probably rolled half of it twice in the last 30 years. I try to get it harrowed each spring but when one half is ready, the rest is too wet, or the final half dries enough and then the rest is too dry! Very occasionally I've taken my car in a gateway and used it to roll drying muddy bits to level it out again.
Poo picked daily, it takes 10 mins morning and evening.

 

[paddy555]

We find that the sheep take care of the land for us. They walk the ruts out and the birds helped then by the sheep and the weather deal with any muck left on the fields over winter. We have a small field vacuum which we use in summer where the horses leave the most muck. The sheep soon eat down weeds as they appear but we do have a kind of push along petrol driven strimmer (I'm sure it has a proper name) if the weeds get away from the sheep.

a modern version of the old allen scythe possibly.

 

[poiuytrewq]

even if it had nothing to do with worm control I would poo pick because otherwise it looks awful and I am the one who has to look at it. You end up with "roughs and lawns" and the "roughs" just grow in area and you lose grazing to the roughs., The roughs also then just became nettle, dock and coarse long grass areas.

I roll but possibly one of the problems with rolling is if you use a contractor/farmer their rollers are pretty large and heavy. We have a granite roller which is a lot lighter and that doesn't cause the problems a "proper" roller could do.

Agree with this too! I like my fields to look clean, I don't get weedy areas as its all pretty evenly grazed and somedays i ride before I poo pick and always think "eugh" at the piles of poo as i ride past

 

[paddy555]

and always think "eugh" at the piles of poo as i ride past

I think this about other people's fields as I go past. We cycle past one, very well grazed so you can see every pile and they never clean it. You almost have to stop me getting off my bike to go and sort it. Obviously I need to get a life

 

[AutumnDays]

Thanks again guys! The roller I have is a light one, to be towed behind the quad. I'll only do the gateways based on your advice, purely because of the mess the digger has made and I want to lay hardcore! I'll run my quad harrow over to start, and hopefully once it's drier I can get the tractor on there to give it a better going over. I too am like many of you for not liking poopy fields! I had to abandon it this winter though after getting the barrow stuck and loosing both wellies in the same session! I'm hoping once I can get up permanent fencing, hard standing, shelter and equicentral/track system set up and a new routine going, next winter will be a bit more manageable. Much appreciate your replies

 

[rextherobber]

I never roll, but I harrow several times a year to pull out thatch ( I poo pick daily) then spread the well rotted poo back on the field, and leave for 6 weeks before grazing. I have them on the Equicentral system, and have to top the fields, which also helps fertilise them. I think I should have been a tractor driver, as I absolutely love harrowing etc!

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

I only pick up poo in summer and mine tend to do most of it in the hardstanding in winter so that is cleared daily, I haven't rolled or harrowed it in years and it always looks fine by April.

This year its being sprayed for weeds because they have got worse over the last few years.

 

[94lunagem]

I have two on six acres. They spend end-October (after the clock change) to March on 4.5 acres and April - end-October on the summer 1.5 acre. They are both good doers and that works best keeping them slim in the summer but allowing me to rotate around various winter paddocks over the wet months without trashing anything, although with how wet it has been this winter that has been hard. Generally, I don't have mud. I don't take a hay cut nor do I usually top, so the winter fields tend to have a good length, albeit not overly rich, covering of grass which also helps on the mud front. My land is on a gentle slope, and I have got to know the wetter v drier areas. My internal fencing is post and electric tape, 3 strands, although most of the time I don't turn it on (only when they are looking like they might be up to something, and it's also on the mains so it's not cheap!). I have never moved the internal fence lines, they are what they are now.

I have it harrowed and rolled every year, as soon as it's dry enough to get on and whenever my guy feels like turning up to do it! I also fertilise every other year.

I am a stickler for poo picking and do mine every morning. Without fail. They live out and I consider it an important part of worm control. I chuck a lot of it into the hedgerows (making sure it is clear of fence posts etc so it does not cause them to rot) as I own the hedge boundaries outside my post and rail. The central field that doesn't have a boundary gets a pile made in one corner which is then spread when harrowing guy comes.

I spend a couple of years dealing with ragwort when I first moved in but seem to have eradicated that. Docks get dug up with a ragwort fork.

 

[GoldenWillow]

Does anyone worry about grass sickness and harrowing without being able to keep the horses off it for a couple of weeks? We used to harrow in two parts so that we could rest harrowed bit as we did it ourself but now not able to do that as a neighbour does it for us. Do need to roll at least the worst bits.

 

[cauda equina]

Yes to worrying about grass sickness, I always rest a harrowed bit

 

[SEL]

Does anyone worry about grass sickness and harrowing without being able to keep the horses off it for a couple of weeks? We used to harrow in two parts so that we could rest harrowed bit as we did it ourself but now not able to do that as a neighbour does it for us. Do need to roll at least the worst bits.

I rest after harrowing / aerating.

This year my summer fields has had so much water sitting on it I'm going to ask the contractor to aerate the middle - I track it so it'll keep any mud away from the horses.

 

[canteron]

Aren’t sheep amazing for keeping worming under control - I have 5 and love them! They are also great at evening out the levels with their ‘golden hooves’ so no rolling needed!

If you have heavy soil then aerating is probably much more valuable than rolling after harrowing. On my light sandy soil it isn’t really necessary.

The only bit I do roll is the field I use for riding on in the Summer.

 

[poiuytrewq]

I think this about other people's fields as I go past. We cycle past one, very well grazed so you can see every pile and they never clean it. You almost have to stop me getting off my bike to go and sort it. Obviously I need to get a life

Right!

 

[windswoo]

Can I just ask in relation to harrowing - I also want to put some grass seed down.
Do I do before or after harrowing?
I'm thinking just before so the birds don't eat it all and that it goes into the ground, but would the actual harrowing damage the seed?
I'll be leaving the field a few days before I move the horses to have some poo going back into the ground, but I hate the fact it looks so untidy!!
Ta much.