Thoughts on a Training Idea?

~ Clear Light ~

~ Clear Light ~

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Firstly Risby got his photo in the H&H this week!!!

I am in a bit of a dilemma what to do with him… I bought him 4 years ago with the intention to only keep him for a couple of years to produce as a young horse then sell on. Somehow he’s stayed a bit longer :D As some of you know he went on loan to Julia while I was abroad and whilst she’s more than happy to keep him now I’m back and let me ride when I like, she is 55 miles from my house!! She does have the perfect set up to allow him to compete at his best.

I have a 2 brand new stables at home (awaiting a new arrival from Germany next week!!) but very limited turnout, possibly I could rent my neighbour’s grazing. Really he is a bit too big to keep at home, especially as my Mum helps with the horses and she would find him a bit daunting. Only in terms of size though, as he is good to handle, and no doubt she will not be too impressed with how much mess a bigger horse makes ;) But I think we *could* do it with some planning. But the question is what to do with his training from here.

I was wondering if I toned him down a bit to use as a schoolmaster would people be interested to have lessons on him? I have used him before for teaching lunge lessons and he is good as gold for nervous riders. But he is also established at Medium and has big, elastic paces, so ideal for dressage enthusiasts who wanted a bit more experience on a correctly schooled horse. I could still keep up his training and compete him when I feel like it. Basically he would be on a less demanding routine with less competition emphasis. What price would people expect to pay for a 30 minute lunge lesson or a 45 minute flatwork session on a horse like this? Bearing in mind I am not some big shot famous trainer with an ex GP horse lol, but I can say that I am the only German qualified instructor in the area and place big emphasis on correct training, not on teaching tricks! If you want tricks, I can point you in another direction hehe. Alternatively, do you think people would be keen to loan him say 2-3 days/week with a price that included lessons with myself? Maybe a whole training package with the opportunity to compete and have some support and guidance along the way, knowing the horse was being kept ticking over with no worries about maintenance? I know its something I would have benefited from.

Thanks for reading, any thoughts welcome :) And as I finish my tax return, thank you to my poor accountant who can't keep up with all my madness :D
 
In a hurry now but just a quick thought. Risby is a very big mover and has always been ridden by very good riders (either very good serious amateurs or pros), right? Would a pupil who is not really used to a big-moving warmblood, but rather more used to a flat-paced/non-dressage horse find his movement quite "surprising" and end up bouncing up and down thereby freaking him out?
The only reason I ask this is that Rauti is a total saint of a horse and would never, ever do anything nasty as you know but I let a couple of friends ride him last year (both showjumpers) and they just couldn't ride him and he freaked out, because he wasn't used to having people "being passengers" on his back if you know what I mean. The more novicey of the two friends almost fell off just going round the arena in a working trot, she totally lost her balance as she wasn't used to a "dressage horse trot", oops! And Rauti is not a 'big mover' by any means.
So maybe that's something to keep in mind, I know people get used to the movement quite quickly but would the interim period upset Risby??

Maybe the loan to include lessons with you would be a better option? I bet loads of people would jump at the chance. You could offer lessons / eye on the ground most days too, something that this country definitely needs more of ;)

ETA Congratulations on the photo *rushes out to buy a copy*
 
congrats on the photo, i need to go and re-read my H&H obv!
ummm, good idea, but i share the concerns FB has raised... can you stop him with your voice at a distance if it comes to it (tall order i know). good schoolmaster lessons would be fantastic to offer, maybe you could ask for videos of prospective riders?
would Julia be utterly gutted to lose the ride, or does she have plenty of other lovely ones? i guess seeing him occasionally isn't enough for you (which i can understand).
will your mum grow in confidence with him when she realises that although he's big he's a very nice gentle person? i have the same problem with my mum, there are some of mine she could barely pluck up courage to put a feed over the stable door or in the field (and they were all angelic, just big...)
tricky. a loaner is a great idea IF you can find the right person. maybe the odd schoolmaster lesson too?
 
Thanks FB, you are definitely right about the bounce factor. The funny thing is I taught a really nervous rider last year on him (like, too nervous to canter her own, placid, average type horse and has only competed at walk and trot level) and she felt really safe on the lunge on him and even cantered! I was actually very surprised. She did find him bouncy yes, but he doesn't do anything if the rider is unbalanced, he tends to just go round and round quite consistently. This is why he is such a saint, I think he was a school horse in his past life :D Off the lunge she only walked and trotted, but it did a huge amount for her confidence all round to have ridden him. She still mentions it now, bless. And if little things like that can make someone more interested in dressage... Alternatively, if it can put someone off buying a totally unsuitable, big moving horse and make them realise there's a bit more to it ;) Risby does have slow donkey mode as back up :D

For flatwork and even loaning I would be very picky as I know the kind of rider that can't get a thing out of him ;) To get him at his best, he needs someone who can really keep him in front of the leg and has quiet hands.
 
Thanks Kerilli. He is surprisingly placid, so much so Julia won't even feed him a banana (his favourite!) incase the magnesium acts as a calmer lol! He is currently on high energy food and haylage with her. In the school I trust him more than my 25 yo retired horse :D. He does not take kindly to the type of pro riders who ride through force, but for an amateur he is fine.

Its tricky as I'm trying to avoid livery at all costs after awful experiences, and I am not as competitive as Julia. So it seems a bit of an ego trip just to keep him as a competition horse as I don't just want to be an owner. Julia's other competition horse has just come back into work now. It was due to her being off that she took on Risby, but she is happy to keep him, but I have to contribute to his costs now, which is the issue as I have no horse to ride :(
 
I would be more worried about the insurance and your house getting classed as business property and getting charge business rates etc.
 
CL I used my (now sold) horse who was a fairly big moving horse trained to PSG as a lesson horse for a while, I also gave lunge lessons on him. He seemed to really enjoy it. The only thing I did do was keep side reins on him pretty much the whole time because the people I was teaching didn't really understand the concept of correct contact for a dressage horse, and the way he'd been trained meant that I really didn't want him getting upset by floppy reins. That seemed to work and he was never bothered by people losing their balance on top - in fact if they did, he'd just stop! Bless him. I got huge pleasure out of teaching on him, as you could really see people learn to understand feel and have "lightbulb moments" when the aid was correct and they got what they wanted. I remember training one lady who could barely canter properly when we started, and after six months or so she was able to ride collected canter on a 20 m circle with simple changes into and out of counter canter. A fantastic achievement.
 
Your loan idea sounds fantastic, I for one would jump at the chance as my horse is currently off, not sure when/if he will be able to come back to dressage. Only I am a long way from you! You get to control the training/riding of your horse and someone else will benefit massively.
 
Thanks Dieseldog yes I am aware of that and will look into it :)

Halfstep I totally agree about the side reins, contact is just so important on a well schooled horse. Sounds like your efforts really paid off, and that is the feeling I'm talking about.

Feisty Mare thanks for your reply. I think there needs to be something to bridge that (bigger than expected) gap when people go from ordinary horse to owning a dressage WB. The market seems inundated with cheap WBs that haven't been produced all that well, amateurs struggling without proper help then giving up etc.
 
I think there is definitely a market for schoolmaster lessons. I've got 2 seven year old mares that I've had since they were 6 months old. I'm ok with the basics but I realised the other day that I don't think I have ever ridden a 'proper' medium trot so goodness knows how I'm going to teach my horses. I have lessons as often as I can but I don't think anything beats being able to feel what it should be like in order to then teach the horse.

I don't know anywhere nearby that has horses of a suitable standard and personally I think it would be more beneficial to have a schoolmaster lesson regularly, alongside working with my own horses rather than something like an intensive course at somewhere like Talland, which obviously would be great but sometimes I think little and often works better.
 
I think the loan with lessons idea is great! I am very much an amateur as I have only been able to find part loan horses for hacking usually no school etc for the past few years, I do enjoy it for fitness and fresh air and whatnot but I feel like I'm not going to get any further in any discipline until I buy my own, and then I will need to fork out even more money for lessons and show entries, it seems like a long time before I'll ever get anywhere!
 
A lot of people will pay for lessons on an established schoolmaster - how much will depend on your area, facilities etc. However as well as insurance and rates considerations you will also need to have a riding school license from your local authority and be inspected each year by them.

You may already be aware of this but if not it is a major consideration and may mean that financially your plan is not viable with one horse. Many people are not aware of the Riding Establishment Act - anyone that teaches at all on their own premises should be licensed. The main things required apart from suitable facilities will be a First Aid qualification and kit, risk and health and safety policies, fire risk assessment, safety signs around premises to name a few. Without a license any insurance is likely to be invalid.
 
Cara04 thank you for your feedback. I agree, there aren't enough schoolmasters around. Talland would be nice!

mandwhy yes it all gets so expensive if you want to do it properly. I've paid around £70 for show entries this month alone :eek: Then he had his teeth done in 2 sessions, the physio, 2 lessons as well as the usual stuff. Not a nice month!

EventingMum don't worry I know Health and Safety inside out ;) However, there seems to be a large number of dressage riders I know who use 1 or 2 horses to teach on. They even advertise saying "schoolmaster available". Are they really licensed? If not, how do so many get away with it?

FrodoBeutlin thank you, I'm a bit disappointed they didn't put the percentages in though!
 
CV My daughter who u taught last week has had lessons on the lunge on a friends big moving dressage horse. He had competed to a high level but is now in his older years, daughter benefitted so much from the lunge lessons as said horse operated when she got it right but didn't throw his toys out when she didn't ! This 'allowed' her to get the right feeling that her own horse could not provide from such a novice. The horse has now been sold so we have lost that training.

I know quite a few people who would jump at the chance to learn through lunge lessons on getting the right feel, does that make sense and then would look for it on their own horse. Know nothing about insurance etc. we paid for the lesson and a bit to livery yard owner for the school. Not sure it helps ;)
 
p.s. she got her dressage score down by 2.5 marks today:rolleyes:, 1st half of the test was lovely got a 7 for her free walk then lost it on medium walk and it fell apart on 2nd canter but much better !
 
~ Clear Light ~ said:
EventingMum don't worry I know Health and Safety inside out ;) However, there seems to be a large number of dressage riders I know who use 1 or 2 horses to teach on. They even advertise saying "schoolmaster available". Are they really licensed? If not, how do so many get away with it?
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I'm sure some do play by the rules but a large number either don't or have no knowledge of the legal requirements. I think a lot of them probably genuinely think what they do does not constitute a riding school. However this is a direct quote from the BHS Register of Instructors certificate of registration:

"Please note that use of your own horse for instruction on your own land constitutes a riding school and therefore a licence under the Riding Establishments Act 1970 will be required to comply with this legal requirement. Your freelance policy will be insufficient for these purposes and further insurance cover must be arranged."

Many people also think there is little chance of them being caught out and tbh many local authorities probably won't ever check up however at my last council inspection I was asked if I knew of anyone operating without a licence and whilst I wasn't willing to divulge names I could think of at least 4 places locally that do - the majority are livery yards but one is a very similar set up to your idea.
 
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