DJ
Well-Known Member
Hello peeps, just a quick one, are Tiger Oats good for putting on condition as well as having the vits/mins in them ?
Cheers
Cheers
Tiger Oats for condition ?
- Thread starter DJ
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Sugar_and_Spice
Well-Known Member
I don't know tiger oats specifically, but any feed given in excess of what is being used by the body for fuel will result in weight gain, including oats. Hope this helps.
Fintan
Well-Known Member
If you mean this
http://www.gwfnutrition.com/prod_equine_tigeroats/index.htm
In regard to vitamins and traceelements there is a build in deficiency. It is only cosmetics but miles away from a covering rate.
The horse cant eat as much for to cover his requirements in this regard.
http://www.gwfnutrition.com/prod_equine_tigeroats/index.htm
In regard to vitamins and traceelements there is a build in deficiency. It is only cosmetics but miles away from a covering rate.
The horse cant eat as much for to cover his requirements in this regard.
PapaFrita
Well-Known Member
Oats are highly digestible, and make an excellent feed. However, they are very high in potassium and you will need to balance this with some sort of calcium-rich feed/supplement. In Argentina oats are fed EVERYwhere and they are balanced with alfalfa. A rough ratio oats-alfalfa is 1:2 but you can also buy special (expensive) balancers.
Oh, in response to your original question; calorie/energywise, both barley and maize will put weight on quicker (if we're just talking about straights) but a lot of horses react to maize as if it were crack and I had one horse that broke out in hives when I fed her barley. Oats are safer, IMO, but no, not really great specifically for weight gain unless you feed a LOT.
If you want weight gain, have you thought of oil?
Oh, in response to your original question; calorie/energywise, both barley and maize will put weight on quicker (if we're just talking about straights) but a lot of horses react to maize as if it were crack and I had one horse that broke out in hives when I fed her barley. Oats are safer, IMO, but no, not really great specifically for weight gain unless you feed a LOT.
If you want weight gain, have you thought of oil?
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Fintan
Well-Known Member
Sorry, don`t hit me.
The average content of potassium in oats is about 4,1 gram per KG. As well this is an elektrolyte and this is not really in major parts connected to calcium
There is more potassium in hay.
Alfalfa is far to high in calcium and can destroy the whole balance calcium - phosphorous - magnesium.
Unless you have a lack in calcium you should avoid feeding alfalfa as a major ingredient.
I believe you where talking about phosporous and not about potassium.
But for this we have to consider the hay in, this is different in Argentina, different soil and climate.
Horses react to maize and barley because it is hardship to digest unless it is processed (steamed).
The average content of potassium in oats is about 4,1 gram per KG. As well this is an elektrolyte and this is not really in major parts connected to calcium
There is more potassium in hay.
Alfalfa is far to high in calcium and can destroy the whole balance calcium - phosphorous - magnesium.
Unless you have a lack in calcium you should avoid feeding alfalfa as a major ingredient.
I believe you where talking about phosporous and not about potassium.
But for this we have to consider the hay in, this is different in Argentina, different soil and climate.
Horses react to maize and barley because it is hardship to digest unless it is processed (steamed).
maccachic
Well-Known Member
I love oats they have been the best thing for my hard keeper, who is now not so hard to keep. Middle of winter he was round on two scoops middle of summers I had no need to feed them which was the first time in two years.
I tried almost everything and for this horse he simply cannot get sufficient calories from fibre, oil didn't really help either.
Straight all the way for me and a good multi vit. His diet is balanced for this.
This is a good artical: http://www.thehorseshoof.com/oats1.html
I tried almost everything and for this horse he simply cannot get sufficient calories from fibre, oil didn't really help either.
Straight all the way for me and a good multi vit. His diet is balanced for this.
This is a good artical: http://www.thehorseshoof.com/oats1.html
AMW
Well-Known Member
tiger oats arent the same as normal oats, I have used them off and on over the years, usually to show animals who needed condition and a bit more energy. The oils and added vits are great for their coats and if i remember rightly they are good for the stomach. they dont pile the weight on but hold it nicely whilst giving more energy.
this link explains all
http://www.gwfnutrition.com/prod_equine_tigeroats/index.htm
this link explains all
http://www.gwfnutrition.com/prod_equine_tigeroats/index.htm
Fintan
Well-Known Member
Sorry for stealing an illusion.
There is an old saying, If you can`t convience them, confuse them.
What is descriped here is nothing than marketing language.
There is different types of oats, some with a higher starch contend and for this lower fiber content, some with a lower starch content but for this a higher fiber content.
On the other hand side, if you want less starch and more fiber, just feed less oats in general and more hay.
This depends on the seed and the climate where it is grown.
Named ingredients:
oligosaccharide : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oligosaccharide
Tocotrinol: this is an absolutely natural ingredient in nearly any plant and not in relation to a single brand
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tocotrienol
ß Glucan: this is simple the opposite of ogliosaccharide an absolute normal ingredient of oats
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beta-glucan
Oatinol delivery system is nothing and only a marketing name for these ingredients and nothing else.
Also the added vitamins and minerals are in a insufficient amount, nothing more than a pinch of salt on the soup.
With this it looks more important but it is not in a relation to what the horse will need.
Marketing, marketing and marketing again.
This is how the battle in the feed industrie does work.
If you don`t have something extraordinary, poke in the costumers head and make him believe that the new Messias is born.
Don`t get me wrong, it was not an argument against you.
The quality of the "Tiger oats" might be fine but it is nothing than a type of oats with a low starch content.
Branded for marketing
If you want to know a bit more about oats read here:
http://www.saaten-union.com/index.cfm/nav/693.html
And there are many other companies doing the same.
There is an old saying, If you can`t convience them, confuse them.
What is descriped here is nothing than marketing language.
There is different types of oats, some with a higher starch contend and for this lower fiber content, some with a lower starch content but for this a higher fiber content.
On the other hand side, if you want less starch and more fiber, just feed less oats in general and more hay.
This depends on the seed and the climate where it is grown.
Named ingredients:
oligosaccharide : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oligosaccharide
Tocotrinol: this is an absolutely natural ingredient in nearly any plant and not in relation to a single brand
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tocotrienol
ß Glucan: this is simple the opposite of ogliosaccharide an absolute normal ingredient of oats
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beta-glucan
Oatinol delivery system is nothing and only a marketing name for these ingredients and nothing else.
Also the added vitamins and minerals are in a insufficient amount, nothing more than a pinch of salt on the soup.
With this it looks more important but it is not in a relation to what the horse will need.
Marketing, marketing and marketing again.
This is how the battle in the feed industrie does work.
If you don`t have something extraordinary, poke in the costumers head and make him believe that the new Messias is born.
Don`t get me wrong, it was not an argument against you.
The quality of the "Tiger oats" might be fine but it is nothing than a type of oats with a low starch content.
Branded for marketing
If you want to know a bit more about oats read here:
http://www.saaten-union.com/index.cfm/nav/693.html
And there are many other companies doing the same.
PapaFrita
Well-Known Member
Thank you Fintan, that's very interesting. In my part of Argentina there basically is no hay; it's too dry and even alfalfa has to be trucked in from elsewhere. This is pretty much ALL they eat (although TBF not of v good quality; ie quite brown) all the time. Mine live out so are able to eat (nibble, actually) grass and other plants, but competition horses ONLY get alfalfa as forage, although hard feed varies (is generally oats).
Can you recommend any literature on feeding horses? I'm v interested in finding out more
Can you recommend any literature on feeding horses? I'm v interested in finding out more
Fintan
Well-Known Member
@ Papafritta
For to be honest, I am now since 25 years in this business and there is no final bible.
Some "bibles" have been written in a country with fully different climate conditions and growth conditions than your country.
As well the supply is different. You will get other things in Germany than in UK and this is everywhere else the case.
I have done a couple of polo ponys in Argentina for a costumer but for to be honest, the problem is we have to deal with what we can get.
Many times the wish list is far longer than the reality.
The easiest thing would be analyse what you have constantly and work from this point on. It is easier when you know where on the map you are for to come to the final destination.
Annother thing is, Alfalfa can have a couple of variations, depending on the seed and when harvestet.
For to be honest, I am now since 25 years in this business and there is no final bible.
Some "bibles" have been written in a country with fully different climate conditions and growth conditions than your country.
As well the supply is different. You will get other things in Germany than in UK and this is everywhere else the case.
I have done a couple of polo ponys in Argentina for a costumer but for to be honest, the problem is we have to deal with what we can get.
Many times the wish list is far longer than the reality.
The easiest thing would be analyse what you have constantly and work from this point on. It is easier when you know where on the map you are for to come to the final destination.
Annother thing is, Alfalfa can have a couple of variations, depending on the seed and when harvestet.
DJ
Well-Known Member
Brilliant thank you
Thanks all for the replies, definitely makes some interesting reading
He is already on Fast fibre, Salt, Magnesium and 250g of Micronised linseed. I have to give him less in order for him to get more ... he is an absolute nightmare when it comes to eating, and he throws it everywhere, gets it in his mouth and then throws it about (puts.throws his head up to nosy about everything else going on), uses his nose to push it out of the bucket, paws with his front hoof and then either tramples it in, or won`t eat it once it`s been on the floor. I`ve started giving him less, and holding his bucket still and he`s been getting a lot more into him that way, but it`s still a nightmare
... corner bucket didn`t work, feed bucket in a tyre didn`t work, and doubt a door bucket would work (same as a corner one didn`t).He has true adlib hay ..... i just want him to have something a bit extra that will help with vits and mins, help with condition and not break the bank ... Tiger Oats seems to hit the spot ?
Forgot to say, he`s had his teeth checked by the dentist last month, everything was fine, he watched him eat and says he`s just a messy ******. I don`t want to be paying out a fortune on food when most of it ends up either in the mud or slung half way across the field ... My other lad gets the same and is doing brilliantly this winter.
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PapaFrita
Well-Known Member
maccachic
Well-Known Member
Can you recommend any literature on feeding horses? I'm v interested in finding out more
Hi
Some reading I have found interesteing is:
Dr Getty http://www.gettyequinenutrition.com/ Her book is also a good read.
Feed X L newsletters (for some reason I cannot post the link but google will find it)
KER publishes some interesting stuff but they are in the business of selling products so read it objectively.
maccachic
Well-Known Member
https://www.coursera.org/#course/equinenutrition
This is also useful the course has just finished but looks like they maybe running another at some stage, it also has suggested reading at the bottom.
This is also useful the course has just finished but looks like they maybe running another at some stage, it also has suggested reading at the bottom.