Tiniest miniature I've ever seen - experience?

Box_Of_Frogs

Box_Of_Frogs

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I've just taken on a tiny rescued shetland gelding. Miniature doesn't even begin to describe him, he is labrador sized - 6hh and rug size 2ft 6in. We think he's about 2yrs old. A nearby county Animal Welfare Officer was driving around and spotted a bundle of rags at the side of the road. Thank god she got out to check. It was a tiny, almost dead pony collapsed in a heap. She scooped him up and put him on the back seat of her car and took him for emergency veterinary treatment. He's been at the yard the Council use for seized and abandoned/neglected horses and ponies since last November. Dunno what care he had there, if any, but he's still desperately thin - condition score about 1 to 1.5 - and hasn't got the normal shetland's waterproof outer guard hairs, only the fluffy undercoat. This may just be a result of his desperate state. He was transferred to my local horse and pony rescue 6 days ago and they urgently wanted 1-to1 care for him so they've trusted me with him.

I've done some early research and it seems very tiny horses and ponies can't be seen as simply small horses because there's a minimum size that all the organs etc will work properly the smaller and smaller the miniaturisation. I understand gut and liver function in particular can be trouble which is why I don't want to feed him oil. He has a bit of a parrot mouth that doesn't stop him grazing but might mean chewing problems, which in turn could be part of the explanation of why he isn't putting weight on. I'm desperate to know how to get more calories in him SAFELY. Vets out Monday for jabs and if they've got a tiny enough gag I'll get them to check his teeth. Even finding him rugs is a nightmare but amazingly he's a little sweetie with people. Bit mouthy like young geldings can be so I think he isn't older than 2. Hope his liking for people is exactly that and not an indication of an underlying problem coz I don't know if he's been deliberately bred that tiny or if he's a genetic accident.

Anyone got any experience at all of ponies this size? Any advice please? Can give e-mail for longer replies or copied documents. Thanks x
 
Sorry absolutely no experience but just wanted to wish you all the luck in the world with him and fingers crossed. People are just heartless dumping animals at the side of the road, whatever there circumstances even pts would have been better :-(
 
No experience with them, but wanted to wish you luck with him. What about a dog rug, would you be able to get one small enough, you could amend it to add appropriate straps? Well done you for taking him on, fingers crossed for the tiny little man.
 
Fast Fibre.
You will be amazed how quickly he will start to pick up once he has unlimited hay and decent feed.
Stiggy was a rising 3 yr old, and he went onto very small feeds every 3hours to start with. Obviously if he is a wee chap he will need smaller than usual feeds, so its a case of little and often I think.
A damn good course of pro and pre biotic, and a gentle wormer will help too.
Cant help with the smaller size issue but perhaps PM Varkie who would likly be able to give you some good answers.
If you cant get her on here pm try here:
http://www.varkiesstud.co.uk/
 
poor little mite - I don't have any useful advice for you as have no experience of minis but I wish him a speedy recovery under your care. It might be an idea to post this in Veterinary as well. Would love to see pictures.
 
joeanne said:
Fast Fibre.
You will be amazed how quickly he will start to pick up once he has unlimited hay and decent feed.
Stiggy was a rising 3 yr old, and he went onto very small feeds every 3hours to start with. Obviously if he is a wee chap he will need smaller than usual feeds, so its a case of little and often I think.
A damn good course of pro and pre biotic, and a gentle wormer will help too.
Cant help with the smaller size issue but perhaps PM Varkie who would likly be able to give you some good answers.
If you cant get her on here pm try here:
http://www.varkiesstud.co.uk/
Click to expand...

Agree, with this, with his parrot mouth a 'mushy' feed may be easier for him to eat - you say he can crop grass, is he able to eat hay? If not, I would treat him like an oldie with bad teeth, ie, give him a tub trug full of Just Grass (or something similar) to pick at as a hay net and soak maybe speedibeet (more calories than Fast Fibre) and fibre nuts as his 'hard' feed, little and often.

I also agree re the probiotic and gentle wormer.

Would he fit into a foal rug?
 
I don't have any real in depth experience or knowledge about this. I'm no expert, but I had one (just 7hh) who had come as a rescue, having been starved by someone who was terrified of laminitis. He was nowhere in as bad condition, I'd say a 3.

I just did what one would do with any (normally) good doer. Treat him as a native, feed him low calorie BULK. Little and often. Mine had four feeds a day of low cal nuts (he was having a scoop per feed), plus pink powder. I gradually upped his hay intake and kept him off of grass - because a vet friend had told me too much grass too soon could do more damage. You need to get him built up properly, but not fattened. He bagan to go out for walks daily, and is now being lunged daily. He goes out for two hours a day, and is kept on shavings as his body isn't used to alot of bulk and I worry about him eating straw.

Good worming programme and obviously teeth done. My EDT had no issues doing his teeth.

He will never be anything other than a mini pony. But he's used as a companion to much bigger horses and behaviour wise is treated like a horse. He has to realise he is no longer a dog kept in someone's garden and fed on toast :(

Rugs wise, mine has a couple of old sleeping bags cut up and with buckles stitched to them. I never had turnout rugs because he didn't go out as such. But now he's been with me (and currently with a friend) a few years he no longer needs rugs anyway.
 
A friend of mine rescued a miniature so hopefully I can give some advice.

First of all, BE VERY CAREFUL WITH THE WORMER. I cannot stress this enough as I know two miniatures who died as a result of being overwormed. Please consult your vet on this and find the gentlest wormer you can. Too little is far better than too much.
Feed wise my friend started off with unmollassed chaff (so essentially chopped hay/straw). This made it easier for him to eat and was the most natural thing for him so easier on his gut.
Good luck with him, stay in very close contact with your vet and keep us updated :)
 
Firstly it depend on whether your mini is just "small" or whether he is a dwarf. There are small miniature horses/shetlands that have perfect conformation and perfect organs and can be treated just like a larger horse but obviously in smaller amounts. However if the mini is a dwarf then his diet and care will need to specifically adjusted for his needs.
A dwarf mini is not just a small horse. Its a deformed horse and the deformaties can be minor to severe. It is quite unusal to have a mini that size at 2 yrs old.
I cant comment on his feeding unless i see a picture of him. If you want to pm me one rather than it go on here i can advise whether i think he is a dwarf or not. If he is then i can put you in touch with people who have experience of dwarfs and their care.
One thing i will say is DO NOT worm with any wormer that contains moxidectin eg equest. it has a verly low overdose threshold and can very easily kill a miniature if the correct dosage is not given. Not worth the risk in my opinion.
With regards to rugs let me know what kind you need and i will either try and sort something for you or let you know the best place to buy. If you try measuring him to the wither that will also help!!!

Feel free to pm me x
 
Stinkbomb has given really good advice.

Except that we have had some youngsters through our doors who were 24" as youngstock - if he is not 2 until this year, it is quite possible he is this size and not a dwarf. However, if he is older, and particularly with his jaw not straight, dwarfism is a strong possibility. But I would say even if we see a picture, it may not be possible to guarantee whether that he isn't a dwarf - you can get some quite minimal dwarf ponies, whose problems come to light later on.

If he is not a dwarf, then I would feed him much the same as any other starved youngster. We use Top Specs condition cubes, soaked, with alfalfa chop, for those in that kind of condition that we take on.

Rug wise, I'd suggest dog rugs. There are some lovely dog rugs out there nowadays, and quite honestly, they're often cheaper than the pony rugs! And yet made by the same makers of pony rugs! Particularly if he is growing - this will make it less financially painful when he outgrows them!

Wormers - as has been said, please be very careful on this front. Worm him only according to his actual body weight (get him on a horse scales) and with wormer as recommended by the vet. Definitely do not use Equest or Equest Pramox - while they are very good wormers, they are processed through the body using body fat - if he has none, they are going to be potentially quite dangerous for him. Definitely worm him only under vet supervision.

Liver wise, the main danger with livers is about ponies having their food suddenly restricted, and contracting hyperlipaemia. For more information on the condition, please read here: http://www.varkiesstud.co.uk/Hyperlipaemia.pdf
 
hi

I work at a horse charity.. we have a quite a few shetlands and miniatures in...
We tend to feed spillers hi fi cubes soaked as this is easy to eat, a small amount regularly and then gradually increase. you could try supplementing this with happy hoof or similar in-between. hope this helps good luck xxx
oh and dog rugs are good too :-)
 
I agree with varkie about Hyperlipaemia. Thats why i would not like to comment on feed until i see a picture. Weight increase need to be slow and not rushed.

varkie- Is dwarfism seen much in shetland ponies? I more thought it was prevelant in miniature horses? I know miniature horses are often bred from shettys ( Inky mums a shetty ) but ive only ever really heard of it in miniature horses rather than full shettys? Although to be fair when you hear about a dwarf you rarely hear about its breeding thesedays do you!! :rolleyes:

And yes if he is young dwarfism may not be apparent. Sometimes it takes for a dwarf to mature before the signs can be seen. However it depends on how "minimal" the features are.

However the point is that is he is quite obviously a dwarf, his care will differ than that of just a small mini :(
 
My Daughter and I bought a mini at the end of last summer. He is only about 30" so also quite tiny. He had been kept in a back garden and had only the lawn to graze and a little barley straw to eat. When I asked what they fed him his previous owner replied "bread roll, peanuts....he'll eat anything"
He wasn't so much underweight as lacking fitness and muscle. And his hooves were in very poor condition. When picking his feet out one of his frogs literally fell out! He also was extremely depressed which I think was from being kept without other equine company. I had the vet and dentist look at him and they made his age about 2. On the vet's recommendation I wormed him with Panacur 5 day which is given according to weight. He weight taped about 70Kg's.
I put him in a tiny bare paddock so as not to allow him too much grass too soon but fed him plenty of hay which had been soaked from a tub trug.
I started him on 2 very small feeds of a handful of Alpha A with soaked speedy beet and 50g of spillers balancer. This worked beautifully and he very quickly picked up.
After a few weeks like this we gradually introduced him to turn out with 2 other ponies. An hour a day to begin with which we eventually increased to all day out and then into his tiny paddock with shelter overnight.
I am really pleased with how he looks now. He's not at all fat but looks more muscled and much healthier. His hooves are fab and all four frogs have now recovered. He's also really full of life and extremely cheeky and is a real menace chasing his friends around the field!
We have slightly changed the way we feed him now, he gets 3 Dodson & Horrell equibites a day for his vits and minerals and 2 feeds a day of low sugar chaff and a good dollop of speedy beet which he loves.
All that said (I know more info than really needed!) I have recently had a chat with Allan & Page feed helpline and I will soon be changing him onto Fast Fibre. This I feel will do the job of the equibites and the speedy beet/chaff mix all in one feed.
Good luck with your little man. I hope he picks up soon and gives you as much joy as our little man does us xx
 
I also came by my mini the same way, was in a terrible state when he arrived, we took him to the vets and he stood on the dog scales and weight 40kg.
He's pulled through just fine, but i did have problems finding rugs for him, he's in 2ft 9" now and they fit just fine but in the process of finding his size I bought 2 Dinky's which you are more than welcome to have (pm your address and I'll pop them in the post) They are 2"3 I think .
Good luck with him xx
 
This is Tinker shortly after he came to us. It's not a standing picture but you can still get an idea of how skinny he was.
296572_10150288495701849_754891848_7853294_1567649_n.jpg

These were taken after about 2 months.
296698_10150359484481849_754891848_8307258_443159688_n.jpg

298979_10150366033986849_754891848_8344499_1472912399_n.jpg

More recently he resembles a bog dweller as he likes nothing more than rolling around in the deepest mud and I'm too embarassed to post pictures of such a dirty creature lol!
 
Stinkbomb said:
varkie- Is dwarfism seen much in shetland ponies? I more thought it was prevelant in miniature horses? I know miniature horses are often bred from shettys ( Inky mums a shetty ) but ive only ever really heard of it in miniature horses rather than full shettys? Although to be fair when you hear about a dwarf you rarely hear about its breeding thesedays do you!! :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Yes, it's in full shetties, and far more than people admit to, I think. I've seen a good few over the years while visiting studs & going to sales. Even seen some advertised for sale!

Part of the problem being that I suspect minimal dwarfs sometimes go unnoticed - I've seen a couple that were being used as broodmares, and were really popular because they were small!

I think some dwarfism gets swept under the carpet - the foals disappear, or are kept out of sight. There is a policy of if there is a dwarf, just don't breed the two parents that created it together - which worries me a bit. I suspect it's highly possible that dwarfism is a recessive trait - so both parents pass on the gene - one gene means it's just carried, two means it is a dwarf. If that is the case, if neither parent were bred, the gene would stop there. But if they are bred to other ponies, while they may not create further dwarfs, the gene potentially gets passed on to the next generation.
 
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