Tips for self-injecting medication particularly Cartrophen

[olop]

Vet has just started my boy on Cartrophen and is currently on the once a week loading dose. She came out last week and did the first one. She showed me how to do it… tap tap jab and it looked pretty simple so I said I’d continue to do them myself.

It was my turn yesterday and it was not simple! We had bronching and it was really quite difficult.

Can I ask for tips please? She has said to do it in the rump as she has seen some nasty reactions to it in the neck but I think I’d prefer to do it in the neck?! If I get problems next time I’ll probably have to bite the bullet and get her to do it.

Thanks all!

 

[Pinkvboots]

I've got a needle phobic horse and the best way I find is you need 2 people and an element of surprise and be quick, I never do it in the stable as mine will rear and he will hit his head.

We tend to put a bridle on lead him out of the stable I often have treats then person with needle just does it before he realises what's going on.

If my horse suspects a needle he just continually goes up and you can't get near him then.

 

[millitiger]

Practice with an empty syringe on an orange or similar- not too ripe!
It will give you an idea of how much force to use for needle to pierce well, as too much or too little force is what makes it painful.

If you are struggling with injecting quarters I definitely wouldn't recommend you try the neck.

 

[Fransurrey]

I had to inject antibiotics daily and the needle was WIDE! We also had broncing the first time I tried (the needle and syringe both flew across the shelter!). After that I went down the rough massage route. I used a rubber curry comb to give him a good deep rub to numb the area and quickly went in with the syringe. In my case I couldn't just inject, I had to thump the syringe in due to its gauge. We managed 5 days like that, alternating rump sides. I was mightily relieved to switch to powder!

I agree that if you're struggling with rump to not try the neck, as you just get a rear instead and you'll be directly in the firing line. What's the needle gauge for cartrophen? Hopefully narrower than the one I used!!

 

[ihatework]

I have seen reactions to Cartrophen (actually one year I have a feeling one of Harry Meads had to w/d from Badminton due to a cartrophen injection site reaction)

As a novice if you are jabbing this yourself I'd stay away from the neck. Rump is easiest for sure. Don't be shy about it and faff - very quick hard stab before the horse anticipates. The one thing I found about the rump is because of the muscle mass it's imprtant to keep the needle at a true 90 degrees

 

[SEL]

I wouldn't inject in the neck if you're a novice - too easy to miss the muscle. Shove a likit in front of your horse, rub the area firmly and then needle. No faffing.

Between injections try some clicker training. We did a huge amount with my needle phobic horse and it really does work (replace needle with poking with a ballpoint pen)

 

[olop]

Thank you all for the advice it’s really appreciated!

My other half tried to distract him with treats but once I’d got the needle in I then had to go back to push the syringe down and of course the bronching started again. Even when I took it out he bronched!

The needle isn’t so much wide it’s quite long and when my vet did it she practically had the whole length of it in which was the difficulty I was having.

I will definitely try stabbing some oranges to get a feel for it

 

[planete]

The BEVA have put 'Don't break your vet' videos on Youtube, one is about desensitising your horse to injections. I used it with my pony who used to rear and, much to my surprise, it has worked. I had never done proper clicker training before either.

 

[dorsetladette]

In all honesty I'd get the vet to do it.

We have zone visit days with our vet for routine stuff - I'd assume weekly injections would come under that criteria.

 

[zoon]

Thank you all for the advice it’s really appreciated!

My other half tried to distract him with treats but once I’d got the needle in I then had to go back to push the syringe down and of course the bronching started again. Even when I took it out he bronched!

The needle isn’t so much wide it’s quite long and when my vet did it she practically had the whole length of it in which was the difficulty I was having.

I will definitely try stabbing some oranges to get a feel for it

When you say you had to “go back to push the syringe down”, what do you mean?

It should be one smooth movement with needle into muscle at 90 degrees and then depress plunger at about 0.1ml per second

 

[ihatework]

When you say you had to “go back to push the syringe down”, what do you mean?

It should be one smooth movement with needle into muscle at 90 degrees and then depress plunger at about 0.1ml per second

See I put the needle in first.
Then when horse settled go and attach syringe and administer.

 

[Errin Paddywack]

See I put the needle in first.
Then when horse settled go and attach syringe and administer.

That is how I do it as well, for sheep as well as horses.

 

[zoon]

I inject people not animals, but I’d always attach needle first as it’s far quicker and easier

 

[NinjaPony]

I was advised to inject into the pectoral muscles and found that much easier. My boy was very good to inject, and I would prepare the needle first. I would also get someone to give him one of those tub licks as a distraction.

 

[mavandkaz]

I inject my boy in the neck with cartrophen. I could do his rump, he's very good and not a kicker but am aware the muscle is much denser so will be more resistance.
What colour needle are you using?
I draw up with a pink, and inject with a green (narrower) and it goes in pretty easily - very little resistance.

Keep needle attached to syringe, in at a 90 degree angle (IE straight) pretty much to base of needle. Slow and steady push the plunger. Then withdrawing the needle I placed my other hand on his neck to stop the skin sticking and moving with the needle.

I do t like doing it, but touch wood it's been good so far. The first time I had the needle at an angle rather then straight in, so some fluid got stuck just below the skin and there was a small raised 'lump', but disappeared after 24hrs.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Really useful tip I was given by a vet nurse.

The needle gets slightly blunted when inserted into the vial through the rubber stopper. Withdraw the Cartrophen from the vial with the first needle, then remove and safely dispose of that needle and replace with a fresh and sharp second one for the injection.

I go into the bum - a few light taps on the site with a clenched fist then in with the jab.

 

[Auslander]

I find it much easier to inject into the neck. If you go into the bum and they move, the needle waggles around, and it's much harder to get the needle in bum than neck.
I hold the needle between thumb and forefinger, like a dart, and just pop it in with a quick but firm poke, then connect the syringe, draw back to check I've not hit a blood vessel, then depress the syringe.
This is my preferred method. Not saying its how others should do it-just that it's the method and location that I find easiest

 

[olop]

See I put the needle in first.
Then when horse settled go and attach syringe and administer.

Yes this is what I did but he thought I was going to put the needle in again and starting to bronc again.

 

[olop]

I inject my boy in the neck with cartrophen. I could do his rump, he's very good and not a kicker but am aware the muscle is much denser so will be more resistance.
What colour needle are you using?
I draw up with a pink, and inject with a green (narrower) and it goes in pretty easily - very little resistance.

Keep needle attached to syringe, in at a 90 degree angle (IE straight) pretty much to base of needle. Slow and steady push the plunger. Then withdrawing the needle I placed my other hand on his neck to stop the skin sticking and moving with the needle.

I do t like doing it, but touch wood it's been good so far. The first time I had the needle at an angle rather then straight in, so some fluid got stuck just below the skin and there was a small raised 'lump', but disappeared after 24hrs.

She has only given me one needle and one syringe per vial, the needle is pink. It doesn’t look that wide it’s just quite long!

 

[Tarragon]

The thought of doing my own injections scares me silly!

 

[mavandkaz]

She has only given me one needle and one syringe per vial, the needle is pink. It doesn’t look that wide it’s just quite long!

Should be using two. One to draw up, and one to inject.
The green needle is narrower then the pink, and so goes in really easy. I dont have to do the whole tapping and darting it in. I can just slowly push it in in one smooth process.

 

[saalsk]

Needle choice can be six and two threes - thinner needle goes into the skin more easily, wider needle makes injecting the liquid easier. Thinner needle means you have to press harder on the syringe to get the contents to go into the tissue, and the *squirt* effect on the tissue is more painful, even if the initial needle entry isn't as bad. Antibiotics are thick, so need a bigger needle, and are normally a larger volume which takes longer to inject. Steroids are like water, and a lower volume, so much easier. Cartrophen and other analgesics are often gloopy/oily, even if they are not so much volume, which can make them uncomfortable/painful to be injected to a muscle. 30 years of injecting people and animals, and getting feedback of various types - I made sure my horses have all had training to get used to the idea of both injections, and worming/oral dose medication. Part of my daily grooming includes the patting of hind quarter with a hand, three times, then on the 4th pat, they are poked with a biro case (no ink insert, just the outer - ink ran out years ago !) so they expect the change from a hand smack to a pokey/sharper object, that doesn't actually hurt, but is a different sensation. I use a 50ml bladder syringe (has a wide nozzle) to squirt watery apple sauce into their mouths - they happily open mouths for it - when it comes to worming they then have wormer mixed with apple sauce, and although they do get the nasty taste of wormer, and are not impressed, they quickly go back to opening mouths for the apple sauce and forget that on one day, it didn't taste that good. It gets them used to the experience, and the process, and means it is an everyday occurrence, just like rasping hooves, brushing, mane plaiting etc. It also helps the person to be confident in handling the syringe/needle. I'm sure we can all remember the time we put a rug on a horse for the first time, or a new rug on a youngster, and how awkward it felt !