To re-brake my horse or not?

lillyem

lillyem

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I've had my horse 8 months and shes always been pretty headstrong. She has no breaks, patience, manners or respect to whoever handles or rides her. She had a foal at 3 and broken at 4 then turned away and "broken" again at 6 nearly 7. Shes 8 now and to be honest she isn't very good at anything i.e she leaves you behind when being led, shuffles on the yard and has no brakes. My dad (who is defiantly NOT horsey) said "it seems like she hasn't been trained properly". Then it got me thinking, should I re-brake her and if so do I turn her out for a couple of months to 'forget' everything. Shes in a three ring rubber dutch gag with roundings on the snaffle and bottom whole. I am not a fan of over-bitting a horse so I dont really want to put her in anything harder and she just has tons of energy. Also I know how to brake horses as I've broken many last year including a 12.2hh pony who is now an amazing show pony. So my question is; Should I re-brake her? Is there any bit recommendations? Should I invest in some bonding sessions for us?
Thankyou, awaiting your helpful answers as you always deliver. Please no snobby comments.
 
Well, she ain't going to 'forget everything' in a few months. However, maybe a good idea to turn her away for the winter and then start her again with the basics in the spring.

Meanwhile you might want to do some ground work with her.

You say you've 'broken' ponies, but this is a horse. Have you had much experience with horses? They are completely different beasts; maybe get some help with someone experienced with quirky horses?
 
Okay thanks. Yeah I've broken a 14.2hh and 15hh but they were welshies so not as fizzy as my anglo-arab! My instructor said she think she's okay however I had a very bad scare with her this year so she said it might be worth trying some natural horsemanship.
 
I'm sorry and I'm not being snobby but your post is really confusing.

To train an unbroken horse is to break it, a bit in a horses mouth is often referred to as the brakes.

When you say re-brake the horse are you talking about training or trying a new bit?

As you've had a scare with her this year you need to work on building trust and bond back up again before starting any serious training so lots of in hand work and make it really fun for both of you. You could always ask for an assessment by a Natural Horsemanship trainer too. I do agree with Slightly Foxed, I think it's best to have some bonding time over the winter and look at things again in the spring when it's not cold, wet and miserable.
 
Why do you feel it is necessary to re break her at all? I agree that perhaps a few winter months off, then slowly bringing her back into work might be beneficial. Coming up to 8 years old would suggest to me that there are big holes in her education rather than she needs totally breaking again?

Rather flummoxed by your trainers suggestion about Natural Horsemanship? Did she clarify why she feels this might be of benefit as opposed to anything else? Is she a registered practitioner or just throwing some ideas out there for a horse that she also finds difficult to deal with?

Are you sure you have the experience and competence for a brood mare that is objecting to coming into work? They can be extremely difficult if the mood takes them, so not always a good prospect for the back yard amateur trainer IMO. It would be a great pity to send this mare off on the wrong path through taking on something you haven't the experience or aptitude for.
 
I mean if I re-brake her then to start a fresh and try and get her accepting the bit, not fighting me and behaving as her last owner was v. horrible to her
 
You need to restart her work in consistent and calm fashion from the start .
Working her six days a week seven if necessary even twice a day if she needs it until she's settles and learns to work with you.
At the risk of sounding snobby nothing in your posts make me think you have the experiance to retrain a large spoilt horse you must get experianced help if you are going to embark on this project .
 
Oh MrsJingle, I haven't owned her all her life so don't speak to me about braking in a brood mare. By what you say about not being experienced enough for a brood mare my other mare has had two foals and she's amazing and I broke her myself and she's been winning endurance rides up to 50 miles. My instructor is BHS approved and she suggested natural horsemanship as in the end I'm the one who needs the confidence on her as I'm going to be the one riding her. She'll ride her but she has a lot more confidence on her and my mare will behave relatively well with her. I am dead set on keeping her I'm simply asking for someone who is not going to suggest I've bought the wrong horse and 'don't know what I'm doing'. I wants to someone to see if I'm being paranoid or I should re-brake her.
 
Not saying I was the most experienced, always things to learn just don't want 'know it alls' trying to tell me that in doing everything wrong. Last time I let someone do that Lilly ended up being smashed in the head.
 
lillyem said:
My instructor is BHS approved and she suggested natural horsemanship as in the end I'm the one who needs the confidence on her as I'm going to be the one riding her. She'll ride her but she has a lot more confidence on her and my mare will behave relatively well with her.
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If the mare behaves relatively well with your instructor - and not with you - that suggests you're the one who needs 're-training' (and isn't that what your instructor is meant to be doing??) Maybe you need a new instructor to help develop your skills and build your confidence, but I don't see why your instructor has suggested 'Natural Horsemanship' - that's changing the boat mid-stream!

If you're riding her in a Dutch Gag, she obviously needs re-mouthing and some basic schooling - but hardly re-breaking. Having been a brood mare, she's never had long enough to get the basics established.
 
Exactly - know it alls are intensely irritating aren't they? But I am sure someone will come along soon and tell you that you are obviously doing all the right things, as I am sure you must be. Good luck.;)
 
I'm afraid I'm just getting all confused with your usage of break and brake. They're two different words, you know, with very different meanings.

To be honest you need to get some help in. She sounds like she's got massive gaps in her training and much of it pre-riding work. Start with re establishing pressure and release and giving to pressure, as well as respecting personal space, and build from there. If you don't know how, get lessons with someone who does.
 
Kallibear said:
I'm afraid I'm just getting all confused with your usage of break and brake. They're two different words, you know, with very different meanings.

To be honest you need to get some help in. She sounds like she's got massive gaps in her training and much of it pre-riding work. Start with re establishing pressure and release and giving to pressure, as well as respecting personal space, and build from there. If you don't know how, get lessons with someone who does.
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Thankyou so much, someone whos not snobby finally! Sorry was typing fast and made a typo - all the time it happens - will go to my nearest riding school.
 
Lilyem you had an earlier thread where you talked about jumping her. You need to stop that until you have the basics right. And if your avatar is you jumping her, or another horse, then it does look as if you need a bit more training of your own riding before you try to teach a novice horse to jump.
 
lillyem said:
Oh MrsJingle, I haven't owned her all her life so don't speak to me about braking in a brood mare. By what you say about not being experienced enough for a brood mare my other mare has had two foals and she's amazing and I broke her myself and she's been winning endurance rides up to 50 miles. My instructor is BHS approved and she suggested natural horsemanship as in the end I'm the one who needs the confidence on her as I'm going to be the one riding her. She'll ride her but she has a lot more confidence on her and my mare will behave relatively well with her. I am dead set on keeping her I'm simply asking for someone who is not going to suggest I've bought the wrong horse and 'don't know what I'm doing'. I wants to someone to see if I'm being paranoid or I should re-brake her.
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You have just admitted its you and not the horse so why restart her.Afraid you are paranoid and its breaking as opposed to braking!!!!
 
You can't re-break a horse as such (especially after two months off, she won't have forgotten anything) and I think more work rather than less is the answer here. Horses are very different to ponies, and you do sound a little out of your depth. It is good that you have an instructor to help you, and you should discuss these things with her before trying them.

You need to break down your problems, from what I can gather, these are the most pressing ones:

- She is fizzy.

- She does not understand that she must yield to pressure.

- You are nervous handling/riding her.

Firstly, look at the fizziness. How much work is she getting a week, what is she being fed? Is she turned out 24/7? Is she better if you lunge her for ten minutes before riding?

Secondly, the pressure and respect issues. These can only be achieved through groundwork and schooling, and you do need to know what you're doing and have fairly fast reactions. You must release the pressure as soon as she yields. I would recommend some books to help you - '101 Schooling Exercises' and 'Lunging and Groundwork'. Work on basics like moving her around, yielding sideways and backwards, and doing in hand transitions to get her listening to you. If she starts to drag you, tell her to STAND and if she doesn't do so immediately, make her. If you don't have enough control in a headcollar, use a bridle or dually. The bit you are using is quite harsh, I wouldn't ride in a shanked bit with only one rein as you will just make her hard mouthed - if she needs more control than a snaffle, ride in two reins and only use the curb rein if you absolutely have to. Use a snaffle for her groundwork. I wouldn't jump at the moment, as her flatwork needs to be better before you can improve her jumping. It sounds as if she is not tuned into you. Lots of transitions and shapes will help, as will hacking.

Lastly, your confidence. I think if you work out a plan of action with achievable goals, this will help with you feeling more in control. After that it's only hours in the saddle and time spent with the horse. Even just hanging out and grooming her will help.
 
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