Sooty
Well-Known Member
With apologies to The Clash.
Tony Blair - should he stay or should he go?
- Thread starter Sooty
- Start date
SSM
Well-Known Member
Should have gone years ago, although who will hubby heckle on TV??
lordflynn
Well-Known Member
random and disturbing but I had a dream that OH and I went to his leaving do last night, Jamie Oliver was there too....
rrose
Well-Known Member
he should go now!!
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Am I the only person who thinks he has Maggie's cloned brain in his head? Oh, and a bad clone of his body leading the Tory party...
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Leaving do? Wishful thinking! Is JO as nice in real life as he seems on the telly?
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Damn right!
suestowford
Well-Known Member
I'm kind of torn - I really don't like TB, but I hope he doesn't go before Christmas, as I've just bought my OH a 'Bollocks to Blair' shirt and was going to give it to him at Christmas, he'll have to have it early if TB resigns.
Sooty
Well-Known Member
LOL! Best give it to him now then...
Maesfen
Extremely Old Nag!
But isn't that why they've been elected in the first place - a dumbed down to appeal to union peeps but essentially (at the start anyway) a softer Tory party? If they got back to Old Labour, we'd all know where we stand and they wouldn't have been in power these long nine years.
No, he's long past his sell-by date, just have to hope Brown doesn't get to replace him - that could be worse than we've already got and we'll end up saying 'come back Tone, most is forgiven' please God Forbid!
No, he's long past his sell-by date, just have to hope Brown doesn't get to replace him - that could be worse than we've already got and we'll end up saying 'come back Tone, most is forgiven' please God Forbid!
Maesfen
Extremely Old Nag!
They'll only have to change four letters if Brown gets in! Perhaps Splash would do them in a kit form for us all to sew on ourselves!
ps: always thought it should have been BLIAR anyway!
ps: always thought it should have been BLIAR anyway!
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Absolutely! They pinched all the Tories' policies and claimed them as their own. Dread having Brown, he is very Old Labour. Labour should take heed of what is happening with the LibDems, who now want Charles Kennedy back...
Maesfen
Extremely Old Nag!
It wasn't just that they pinched all the policies - it was the fact that they made the most bloody awful job of running them! Name me one that they have done well, you'll be hard pushed to find one.
I'm not a waving blue flag tory, I can see good on both sides (and bad) but this lot have made this country the rubbish bin for all the dregs of society from all over the world and care more for them than their own countrymen; that can't be fair; we need to get back to law and order where right is right and wrong is wrong no matter who or what creed you are.
Do wish we could have Maggie back again, she'd soon sort it!!
You can't ask boys to do a man's job but that's what's happened these last nine years and look at the mess they've got us into! Just don't start me on the war!
I'm not a waving blue flag tory, I can see good on both sides (and bad) but this lot have made this country the rubbish bin for all the dregs of society from all over the world and care more for them than their own countrymen; that can't be fair; we need to get back to law and order where right is right and wrong is wrong no matter who or what creed you are.
Do wish we could have Maggie back again, she'd soon sort it!!
You can't ask boys to do a man's job but that's what's happened these last nine years and look at the mess they've got us into! Just don't start me on the war!
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Very true. I had the privilege (!) of living life under the previous Labour government, so expected the worst - this lot have kept inflation under control and thanks to Maggie have no problems with the unions, so they have totally cocked up everything else!
lordflynn
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Leaving do? Wishful thinking! Is JO as nice in real life as he seems on the telly?
[/ QUOTE ]
yes, he was upset though
but was doing the food which was lovely......that'll teach me for eating spicy food in the evening!
Leaving do? Wishful thinking! Is JO as nice in real life as he seems on the telly?
[/ QUOTE ]
yes, he was upset though
Lobelia_Overhill
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Do wish we could have Maggie back again
[/ QUOTE ]
Please tell me that's a joke...
Do wish we could have Maggie back again
[/ QUOTE ]
Please tell me that's a joke...
mrdarcy
Well-Known Member
I hope its a joke too. Thatcher did more damage to this country than any leader in history. The eighties were dark days indeed.
I do think it's time for TB to go and I look forward to Gordon Brown being in charge - he's an incredibly bright man and I think he'll surprise a lot of people when he steps out of TB's shadow.
The thing I fear the most would be the Tories regaining power. God help us all then
I do think it's time for TB to go and I look forward to Gordon Brown being in charge - he's an incredibly bright man and I think he'll surprise a lot of people when he steps out of TB's shadow.
The thing I fear the most would be the Tories regaining power. God help us all then
teapot
Well-Known Member
What scares me is Gordon Brown as PM
They should all go now before this country goes down hill even more
They should all go now before this country goes down hill even more
Sooty
Well-Known Member
In what way? Margaret Thatcher inherited an economy with inflation spiralling out of control, massive unemployment and a country totally controlled by the unions. As a person she was deeply annoying, but as a politician she did an amazing amount of good. I think selling off the utilities was madness, but the woman had more balls than any other PMs I have lived under.
mrdarcy
Well-Known Member
What she did to the miners was a crime in itself and even if that was the only terrible thing she did it would be enough to condemn her leadership.
But on top of that she introduced the ethos of greed and selfishness - the I want and I want it now philosophy - that has resulted in the me, me me society we now have. This country is standing on a mountain of personal debt that can't possibly be paid off and will ultimately collapse and send the UK spinning into recession. It was Mrs T that encouraged people to buy what they couldn't afford by borrowing - status was judged entirely on material possession. She dismantled any notion of society and communal responsibility. It was an any man for himself mentality. Great if you're lucky enough to have the means or talent to make lots of money but tough if you're under priviledged. Mrs T didn't care about the less fortunate in society.
And lets not even start on the boom and bust economy that her misguided policies brought about. Because of that woman millions of people in this country fell into poverty and are still struggling to get out of it today. Venture into any inner city and you'll see the fall out of Thatcherism.
Everything that TB and the Labour government has done has been to try and repair the damage that 18 years of Tory rule inflicted. As we can all see the damage was that great, under investment in public services so criminal that its proved almost impossible to turn around.
The only good thing about Mrs Thatcher's time as PM was when it ended. Even today the sound of her voice sends shivers down my spine. Horrible, unpleasant and nasty woman.
But on top of that she introduced the ethos of greed and selfishness - the I want and I want it now philosophy - that has resulted in the me, me me society we now have. This country is standing on a mountain of personal debt that can't possibly be paid off and will ultimately collapse and send the UK spinning into recession. It was Mrs T that encouraged people to buy what they couldn't afford by borrowing - status was judged entirely on material possession. She dismantled any notion of society and communal responsibility. It was an any man for himself mentality. Great if you're lucky enough to have the means or talent to make lots of money but tough if you're under priviledged. Mrs T didn't care about the less fortunate in society.
And lets not even start on the boom and bust economy that her misguided policies brought about. Because of that woman millions of people in this country fell into poverty and are still struggling to get out of it today. Venture into any inner city and you'll see the fall out of Thatcherism.
Everything that TB and the Labour government has done has been to try and repair the damage that 18 years of Tory rule inflicted. As we can all see the damage was that great, under investment in public services so criminal that its proved almost impossible to turn around.
The only good thing about Mrs Thatcher's time as PM was when it ended. Even today the sound of her voice sends shivers down my spine. Horrible, unpleasant and nasty woman.
Weezy
Well-Known Member
"
Everything that TB and the Labour government has done has been to try and repair the damage that 18 years of Tory rule inflicted. As we can all see the damage was that great, under investment in public services so criminal that its proved almost impossible to turn around"
Christ I dont know how ANYONE can believe that - truely shocked
Gordon Brown is a twat and if he comes into power I will cry - bring on the next General Election I say
Everything that TB and the Labour government has done has been to try and repair the damage that 18 years of Tory rule inflicted. As we can all see the damage was that great, under investment in public services so criminal that its proved almost impossible to turn around"
Christ I dont know how ANYONE can believe that - truely shocked
Gordon Brown is a twat and if he comes into power I will cry - bring on the next General Election I say
Sooty
Well-Known Member
I have read this type of comment before, and it is usually made by someone who has never experienced life under a real, old Labour government - the total enemy of small business or self improvement. Yes, Thatcherism did encourage greed, but it also encouraged a free economy and made the UK a competitive and respected country again after being a laughing stock for years. She improved relations with the USA at a time when we needed their support. The huge debt we have now is no larger than before she came to power, and personal debt is largely the problem of the banks - not to mention greedy, stupid people! You cannot expect a government to take responsibility for peoples' expenditure. Although this lot probably would, given half a chance, with their infernal Nanny State!
Sooty
Well-Known Member
If Gordon Brown comes to power I shall do more than cry - we are a capitalist country, like it or not, and he seems to determined to undermine that. Can't abide the man's politics or his persona. Labour would have had another 18 years in the wilderness if it wasn't for Tony Blair leading the party.
mrdarcy
Well-Known Member
Fair enough. It always shocks me that anyone can vote Tory - the 'I' mentality over the 'we' mentality is not one I can fathom.
As for not being able to trust governments with our money who can you trust? Unfortunately you definitely can't trust the wealthy to voluntarily help the less fortunate - which is why you need governments to step in and make sure wealth is shared out a little more evenly. It's something I fundamentally believe in, along with the NHS and the welfare state - two things we should all be very proud of... despite their short comings and difficulties can you imagine being a country like the US? What a horrific thought - no medical care for the poor, no help if you find yourself unable to work. The result? - a third world country hidden within the wealthiest nation on earth. The evidence - New Orleans... Surely not even Tory voters would want that in the UK?
As for not being able to trust governments with our money who can you trust? Unfortunately you definitely can't trust the wealthy to voluntarily help the less fortunate - which is why you need governments to step in and make sure wealth is shared out a little more evenly. It's something I fundamentally believe in, along with the NHS and the welfare state - two things we should all be very proud of... despite their short comings and difficulties can you imagine being a country like the US? What a horrific thought - no medical care for the poor, no help if you find yourself unable to work. The result? - a third world country hidden within the wealthiest nation on earth. The evidence - New Orleans... Surely not even Tory voters would want that in the UK?
teapot
Well-Known Member
This labour government is thinking of closing my local hospital thus meaning that I want/need treatment (which as we speak I'm waiting for an MRI scan) I'm going to have to travel 40miles + to gain any form of medical care.
Waiting lists, no beds, people dying in the corridors....... NHS something we can be proud of? I think bloody not.
Waiting lists, no beds, people dying in the corridors....... NHS something we can be proud of? I think bloody not.
mrdarcy
Well-Known Member
And 18 years of extreme underfunding is not to blame for the current state of the NHS? If the Tories had stayed in power there wouldn't be an NHS at all now.
My family's recent experience of NHS service has been nothing but great. Even my Dad - a resolute Tory voter - praises it and he's the one using it most. Sure there still isn't enough money being ploughed in (which means it's time to bite the bullet and accept we need an income tax increase) and there are still too many managers and too many horror stories but those horror stories will always be the ones in the news. The success stories are not very interesting to read. As well as closing hospitals new ones are being built - sometimes old ones have to close if the buildings they inhabit just can't accomodate 21st century needs.
I'm not saying things are perfect, not even close, but surely any NHS is better than no NHS at all?
My family's recent experience of NHS service has been nothing but great. Even my Dad - a resolute Tory voter - praises it and he's the one using it most. Sure there still isn't enough money being ploughed in (which means it's time to bite the bullet and accept we need an income tax increase) and there are still too many managers and too many horror stories but those horror stories will always be the ones in the news. The success stories are not very interesting to read. As well as closing hospitals new ones are being built - sometimes old ones have to close if the buildings they inhabit just can't accomodate 21st century needs.
I'm not saying things are perfect, not even close, but surely any NHS is better than no NHS at all?
teapot
Well-Known Member
Then why close a hopsital which has all been re-done/re built within the last 10yrs and is one of the best in the country?
Just a thought - I'm not old enough to comment on Thatcher's reign as PM but even at the age of 19 - I feel this country has gone down hill and fast within the last couple of years regarding education, the health care system, taxation, the nanny state etc
Oh and just a thought - have you ever lived in the SE as in the home counties? As the general feeling is rather different to yours
Just a thought - I'm not old enough to comment on Thatcher's reign as PM but even at the age of 19 - I feel this country has gone down hill and fast within the last couple of years regarding education, the health care system, taxation, the nanny state etc
Oh and just a thought - have you ever lived in the SE as in the home counties? As the general feeling is rather different to yours
mrdarcy
Well-Known Member
I grew up in Thatcher's Britain and the thought of ever going back to that fills me with horror. She destroyed a lot of traditional industry, caused huge amounts of suffering to many communities and many areas are yet to recover. Things are far better now than they were back then. Inflation and interest rates are lower, unemployment significantly lower, more people have been lifted above the poverty line than ever before. The inner cities, like Manchester, Liverpool, Newcastle and Glasgow are regenerating fast, whilst they lay derelict and deprived for the time the tories were in government.
You are correct that I've never lived in the SE, though I did live in Wiltshire for a while. I can understand why the SE is a Tory heartland. The area did incredibly well out of Thatcherism. Unfortunately the same can't be said of much of the North of England, Scotland and Wales. For Britain's poor and working classes things are better now than they ever were under Thatcherism... because her belief was that anyone should be able to improve their own situation without any help from the government. Unfortunately that's a simplistic view and just not the case for many people.
You are correct that I've never lived in the SE, though I did live in Wiltshire for a while. I can understand why the SE is a Tory heartland. The area did incredibly well out of Thatcherism. Unfortunately the same can't be said of much of the North of England, Scotland and Wales. For Britain's poor and working classes things are better now than they ever were under Thatcherism... because her belief was that anyone should be able to improve their own situation without any help from the government. Unfortunately that's a simplistic view and just not the case for many people.
lordflynn
Well-Known Member
not really a political animal but I do remember Old Labour and I remember Thatcher. Now I personally dont like New Labour but the thought of thinking that Thatcher was in any way something we should remember wistfully!? give me a break!
twinnieolz
Well-Known Member
Tony Blair should of been gone years ago!!!