Total Hoof Crisis!

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chrisharri

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Hello All, I am having major issues with my horses feet. I will start from the beginning and take it from there.
I bought my horse in April '14, he is a 15 year old TB, who had previously evented and had been in his home for 9 years. I felt that he had good feet and his owners had said that they'd never had any problems with them. he had normal shoes on with one toe clip on the front, and two clips on the back feet.

May farrier came mid may and shod him. he decided that the shape of his foot needed altering, so he did what he had to do, and ended up putting front shoes on with two toe clips ( I'm unsure of the purpose of the two clips). The horse was a bit 'footy' for a few days but was happy enough.

The next time my farrier came was six weeks later, end of June.. Again he put all 4 shoes on, and again the horse was 'footy' for a few days. Seven days later, both of his back shoes fell off, and I contacted my farrier to ask him to come out urgently but he couldn't come out for a week. By the time he had come out, the horses back feet had disintergrated to the point of not being able to have shoes on, and his front feet had started to crumble and the farrier had to build up his foot will fillers thus to enable him to keep front shoes on.

The farrier then came out end of July to tend to the horses feet.Farrier took both fronts off and put new shoes on. The horse wasn't even happy being shod by this point and reared up several times. However front shoes were put on. The following day, the horse was unable to walk, so both the vet and the farrier were called out. Both fronts were taken off, and poultices applied. An abscess was discovered, so the usual treatment ( polutices/Stockholm tar/hydrogen peroxide/ salt water/etc) was given.

Once the Abscess cleared, the horse was sound when wearing cavello trek boots. However my farrier was concerned that the boots could rub the horse and decided the best option was to go with acrylic glue on shoes. These have been working well, and the horse has been sound enough to be ridden. However today, the horse is once again extremely lame. I picked out all his feet, as I do every day, but I was faced with this hideous crack from his frog to his heel. I would like to show you all a picture, but I'm not sure how I post a picture! Please help!
 
Use photobucket to post pictures.

A horse should not, ever, be lame after being shod or trimmed.

Regardless, it sounds like he has quite unhealthy feet and you need to ask yourself why - long term shoeing? Diet? management? Or a combination of the above?

If you don't know why - you cant solve it.
 
I would take a look at http://ecirhorse.org/ and also the Rockley blog http://www.rockleyfarm.co.uk/blog.html. I would get the vet out again, and possibly consider taken the shows off for a proper look at the feet and whats going on underneath it all. The best diet for a barefoot horse is no different to a shod horse, and if the feet are crumbling then they are not healthy so pointless putting shoes on to only cause more damage at this point. Once you have healthy hooves again, you can look to putting on shoes if needed.
As Samlf said, a horse should not be lame in shoes, especially glue-ones where there are no nails to prick/bind.
 


Ok there is a link to this mornings foot.
I have had a different farrier out this afternoon, as mine is on holiday. She said that my horses frogs are sloggy and that has caused the tear in the back of his foot, due to the instability of the acrylic shoes. She said that in a perfect world, she would put bar shoes on him, but due to the poor hoof wall quality to leave the acrylic ones on....
He is fed ad lib hay when stabled, and is out on a 5 acre field with one pony. The grass isn't fertilised, but does have a lot of clover in it. He receives two feeds a day containing- fast fibre, veteran vitality, and 250 grams of biotin. I paint his feet twice a day with plus vital, and he wears over reach boots when out in the field or when ridden.
 
chrisharri said:


Ok there is a link to this mornings foot.
I have had a different farrier out this afternoon, as mine is on holiday. She said that my horses frogs are sloggy and that has caused the tear in the back of his foot, due to the instability of the acrylic shoes. She said that in a perfect world, she would put bar shoes on him, but due to the poor hoof wall quality to leave the acrylic ones on....
He is fed ad lib hay when stabled, and is out on a 5 acre field with one pony. The grass isn't fertilised, but does have a lot of clover in it. He receives two feeds a day containing- fast fibre, veteran vitality, and 250 grams of biotin. I paint his feet twice a day with plus vital, and he wears over reach boots when out in the field or when ridden.
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That is a not happy hoof. There looks to be some infection round the frog which will not be helping. There is no need to feed fast fibre AND veteran vitality. I really would look to feed a barefoot friendly diet and use a small cup of wet weight fast fibre to carry a decent powder balancer like forage plus. With 5 acres of grass, there is no need to feed any extra feed - especially if not doing any real work. I would treat the thrush with something like clean trax soak to start, or a milton fluid soak. Use padded hoof boots (take shoes off) and providing vet happy nothing sinister going on in the hoof capsule, get the horse moving.
 
samlf said:
Use photobucket to post pictures.

A horse should not, ever, be lame after being shod or trimmed.

Regardless, it sounds like he has quite unhealthy feet and you need to ask yourself why - long term shoeing? Diet? management? Or a combination of the above?

If you don't know why - you cant solve it.
Click to expand...

you've made some very good points- I think my horse has always been shod by the same farrier for 9 years, and then I have got him, and now my farrier is trying to alter the shape of his feet. I underestimated my horses dislike of flies, and he went through a period of about 3 weeks galloping around the field when the flies first came out,although he did have a fly rug on and fly spray, and at that time, the ground was very hard, which might have led to him damaging his feet. In his previous home he was only turned out for an hour at a time. Diet- I have always fed biotin to every horse I've ever had, and he gets 250grams a day.. but he is stabled on straw, so I'm going to change to shavings/pellets?
 
Nugget La Poneh said:
That is a not happy hoof. There looks to be some infection round the frog which will not be helping. There is no need to feed fast fibre AND veteran vitality. I really would look to feed a barefoot friendly diet and use a small cup of wet weight fast fibre to carry a decent powder balancer like forage plus. With 5 acres of grass, there is no need to feed any extra feed - especially if not doing any real work. I would treat the thrush with something like clean trax soak to start, or a milton fluid soak. Use padded hoof boots (take shoes off) and providing vet happy nothing sinister going on in the hoof capsule, get the horse moving.
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Yes, I totally agree with you, he has very poorly feet. His frogs are so soft, they are like cheese/rubber/sponge. I will google clean trax soak, I have never heard of it, but I've never had a horse with a foot problem before. Yes, I already have a set of cavello padded boots, and he is totally fine in them (during the period of being barefoot, after the abscess went and before the plastic shoes arrived) However my farrier said that they can cause massive issues as they can damage the hoof and distore its growth? I have spoken to my vet about organising some x rays next week, although this afternoon's farrier felt that I was 'over-reacting!' I personally think I'm not over reacting, and my poor horse needs help!
 
chrisharri said:
Yes, I totally agree with you, he has very poorly feet. His frogs are so soft, they are like cheese/rubber/sponge. I will google clean trax soak, I have never heard of it, but I've never had a horse with a foot problem before. Yes, I already have a set of cavello padded boots, and he is totally fine in them (during the period of being barefoot, after the abscess went and before the plastic shoes arrived) However my farrier said that they can cause massive issues as they can damage the hoof and distore its growth? I have spoken to my vet about organising some x rays next week, although this afternoon's farrier felt that I was 'over-reacting!' I personally think I'm not over reacting, and my poor horse needs help!
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Your farrier is talking bullpoop. Even if they aren't fitted properly, the horse would make it clear something isn't right before you distort growth, or damage them.

And speaking from experience, go with your gut :)
 
chrisharri said:
Yes, I totally agree with you, he has very poorly feet. His frogs are so soft, they are like cheese/rubber/sponge. I will google clean trax soak, I have never heard of it, but I've never had a horse with a foot problem before. Yes, I already have a set of cavello padded boots, and he is totally fine in them (during the period of being barefoot, after the abscess went and before the plastic shoes arrived) However my farrier said that they can cause massive issues as they can damage the hoof and distore its growth? I have spoken to my vet about organising some x rays next week, although this afternoon's farrier felt that I was 'over-reacting!' I personally think I'm not over reacting, and my poor horse needs help!
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My horse would beg to differ :lol: He had terrible feet! He ended up in horsepital for 3 days with them they were that bad! I almost shod him, but thought better of it at the last minute. He wore boots and pads when he was turned out for a few weeks and is now so much better. We have a long way to go still! but boots and pads helped him use his feet properly :)
 
I just love my horse, as we all do, he's my dream horse, and I am just so upset that he's so poorly! I've just read on another thread that feeding micronized linseed can help? hmmmm, this barefoot/healthy foot stuff is complicated. I have always just left hoof care to my farrier, all decisions, diet, what to dress them etc, and now this has happened, so I'm on a steep learning curve!
 
I just wanted to reply as I have also been on a very steep learning curve during the last year. Frogs seem to be amazing at recovery given the right conditions and indeed so do hooves themselves (which I didn't realise!). Having thought previously that horses in work have to wear shoes otherwise their feet wear away, I now have a 11 year old wb who works in cavellos at the moment but is barefoot when not being ridden and a youngster who has been shod this summer but who I am planning to remove shoes over next few months. Love the idea that your farrier has about the evil boots but there is just no way this can be true, apart from the fact that they wear them for not a very long period of time, how could velcroing what are essentially hardcore wraps round a hoof do more damage than nailing on a shoe?! As I say, I am still learning lots but those frogs look thrushy to me, I would look at the red horse products. I use the sole cleanse to stop thrush and the artimud. There are some excellent hoof care articles on the Rockley farm blogspot and I would maybe start by looking there.

I feed my boys a minuscule amount of fast fibre, micronised linseed, salt and pro-balance and have been super impressed with their hoof quality. Good luck :-)
 
Terrible thrushy frogs and wow, look at that contracted heel.

This horse has had hoof balance issues developing for some time. The old owners may have had no hoof issues, but that probably just meant that he doesn't loose shoes often. I bet his hoof balance is chronic and has been for some time. The poor quality horn also suggests that he has not been fed for hoof health for a minimum of how long it took him to grow that hoof capsule.

No way on this earth would I put bar shoes on a hoof like that.

Your horse is a serious candidate for a barefoot rehab, even if you decide to shoe again once his hoof health is restored. Please do have a good read of the Rockley blog that MLP linked to in post 4.
 
Don't just add stuff because someone said its good. What you want with a diet for a horse is balanced you add stuff to achieve this, which is why what works for one doesn't always work for the next. Carry out an as fed analysis of current diet/ or new diet and see where deficiency's / excess lie and address this. Once you have it theoretically balanced you then tweak to suit your horse as recommendations are done on an average horse which means most will be either side.

Give it time it can take up to 9mths to grow a new hoof capsule so don't go changes loads of things regularly.
 
One of the simplest things that I did, RE feed, that really improved my horses' horn quality was cutting out molasses. I swapped from a molassed chaff to a non-molassed one and all four horses got event lines with better quality horn above and poorer quality horn below.
 
Faracat said:
One of the simplest things that I did, RE feed, that really improved my horses' horn quality was cutting out molasses. I swapped from a molassed chaff to a non-molassed one and all four horses got event lines with better quality horn above and poorer quality horn below.
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I also agree with this neither of my horses get anything with molasses in, my mare had terrible cracked feet and seedy toe before the switch.
 
Faracat said:
One of the simplest things that I did, RE feed, that really improved my horses' horn quality was cutting out molasses. I swapped from a molassed chaff to a non-molassed one and all four horses got event lines with better quality horn above and poorer quality horn below.
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This ^
There are photos in my profile of my tb's hoof, that show what a hoof can recover from, but you have to get the feeding right. No molasses, horses don't need it, low starch, low sugar diet.
I also didn't have any knowledge of hooves and left it all to the farrier.... that was my biggest mistake, as I couldn't recognize when it was going badly wrong. You are on a steep learning curve, but you owe it to your horse to find out all you can. I nearly lost my horse because I didn't know enough at the time about how a healthy hoof should look, and what an unhealthy hoof looked like. I also believed the "typical tb feet " line.
please don't make my mistake.
 
Faracat said:
One of the simplest things that I did, RE feed, that really improved my horses' horn quality was cutting out molasses. I swapped from a molassed chaff to a non-molassed one and all four horses got event lines with better quality horn above and poorer quality horn below.
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I agree, but this horse is on 5 acres with just one pony! surely a case of sugar overload, how is the pony? I have 3 ponies on half an acre this time of year!
 
AngieandBen said:
I agree, but this horse is on 5 acres with just one pony! surely a case of sugar overload, how is the pony? I have 3 ponies on half an acre this time of year!
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The pony is fine, she is barefoot, she is 12hh's and 16 years old. She wears a muzzle sometimes out grazing and has a sectioned off barepatch should she require, plus she's in daily hard work as we do worry about laminitis. The grass on my field is very poor, its full off clover, rather than grass
 
avthechav said:
I just wanted to reply as I have also been on a very steep learning curve during the last year. Frogs seem to be amazing at recovery given the right conditions and indeed so do hooves themselves (which I didn't realise!). Having thought previously that horses in work have to wear shoes otherwise their feet wear away, I now have a 11 year old wb who works in cavellos at the moment but is barefoot when not being ridden and a youngster who has been shod this summer but who I am planning to remove shoes over next few months. Love the idea that your farrier has about the evil boots but there is just no way this can be true, apart from the fact that they wear them for not a very long period of time, how could velcroing what are essentially hardcore wraps round a hoof do more damage than nailing on a shoe?! As I say, I am still learning lots but those frogs look thrushy to me, I would look at the red horse products. I use the sole cleanse to stop thrush and the artimud. There are some excellent hoof care articles on the Rockley farm blogspot and I would maybe start by looking there.

I feed my boys a minuscule amount of fast fibre, micronised linseed, salt and pro-balance and have been super impressed with their hoof quality. Good luck :-)
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Thank you! it's just so complicated!
 
Poor you, what a stressful time. It does sound like your farrier has been trying to correct what was a long term problem with hoof balance, and I have heard of this causing abcesses and soreness for some time while the hoof is rebalanced. Horse might be footy after being shod if farrier is trying to shorten the toes and support the heels I suspect.
I don;t have any great advice there are people on here with lots of experience with feet, though I don't envy you trying to pick through it. I am sure you will resolve this though and after a period of adjustment you will see a huge improvement. I have had farrier and vet work together to resolve issues. If you are confident your vet understands lameness and is open minded about barefoot, then why not call a bit of a conference with them both on the yard together to decide on a course of action they have both agreed.
 
chrisharri said:
Thank you! it's just so complicated!
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Ahhh honestly it isn't once you get into it. Basically cut out as much sugar as poss, feed a nice hoof mineral supplement, get rid of the thrush and make the feet work properly to build up the digital cushion. That's essentially it! I now spend less on food and shoeing that I ever did before. But I agree with what others say...it sounds like you can sort this horses hooves out before you have a clinical problem. I made my changes due to my horses having very mild intermittent lameness. We investigated and MRI showed inflammation of nav bone and the start of signs of wear and tear to ddft. Touch wood since really focusing on hoof health this problem has not returned. He is now striding out better than I have ever known him in all paces, his breeder saw him working for the first time the other day in years and couldn't believe the difference. He has quietly got quite pottery and we had not noticed. Try the book Feet First, this really explains lots. Good luck!
 
I am another one that agrees diet needs looking into, micronised linseed, pro hoof, salt (a full tablespoon daily) with fast fibre, restrict grazing and feed soaked hay-all these things will reduce the sugar intake which affects the quality of the hoof wall that grows. clover fertilises the ground and therefore the grass you have will be rich and the clover itself is not good for horses to eat.

what sort of work if any do you do with this horse? Non of the vets I deal with are even happy for horses to be turned out in glue on shoes let alone ridden in them as they are so slippery on smooth concrete and hard ground-they offer no grip and that in itself is dangerous at worst and creates tension through the whole horses body at best as the horse will remain tense in an effort to stay upright. I would suggest you look at the rockley farm site and phone for advice if you feel it is appropriate.

My first port of call would be get those shoes off (leave barefoot) and make use of your hoof boots-they do sometimes rub but only when worn for long periods of time and if you can use them just for ridden work and possibly to and from the field depending on the surface you have to walk across then you should not have a problem-do remember to lower the work load and start with just 5 or ten mins walking once or twice per day in hand once the horse start to go without the boots, it can be a long road but once your horse is comfortable with out boots then the feet will be good and strong and life will be much easier.

good luck
 
chrisharri said:
The pony is fine, she is barefoot, she is 12hh's and 16 years old. She wears a muzzle sometimes out grazing and has a sectioned off barepatch should she require, plus she's in daily hard work as we do worry about laminitis. The grass on my field is very poor, its full off clover, rather than grass
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Clover is not good its higher energy than grass
 
The glaring thing for me here is the horse was only turned out for an hour at a time in it's previous home and now it's out all the time .
This sounds like a lot of issues coming together to produce a big problem .
The thrush /cracked frog issue needs dealing and OP need to get very on top of these thing from now on .
I think OP needs to consider if this horse can cope with being at grass this much I have one I simply could not keep the feet right on if I allowed him a lot of access to field grass .
I think getting the feet first book for a overview would be worth it although it recommends seaweed which it's now known is a bad idea for foot health .
I would get onto to the forage plus website and look at their supplements .
I would go back to boots ( lots of ways to stop boots rubbing ) and PM Oberon for BF diet overview which is great .
Once the feet are falling apart it's my experiance you just have to give a shoeing break and get things right .
 
Hi OP, I would seriously think about getting a new farrier because those hooves are not happy. I know it can be daunting/ scary at first when a professional is involved but I would definitely try to find a more BF friendly farrier. Then I'd whip the shoes off, measure him up for some boots and then build up the work gradually. I'd introduce a good vit and min balancer (pro balance from Progessive Earth on ebay is very good), some micronised linseed and you're good to go! Even if you want to shoe in a few months when his feet have improved, that's fine. You given him the chance to recover and grow the hoof he needs and trust me, he will thank you for it :)
 
Good grief :o Sack your farrier asap - he's talking rubbish re boots and also clearly can't see the wood for the trees in his approach to shoes.

Those hooves need a serious break from shoes, of any type, and grass. He needs to be on a decent mineral supplement such as Pro Hoof or Forage Plus and being exercised in boots and pads. Where a bouts are you Il find you a barefoot trimmer.
 
Apologies my original reply was quite short - was just about to head out the door to work!

I wouldn't underestimate how sore that thrushy frog can make a horse - imagine if you had a deep infection in the sole of both of your feet! That deep central sulcus is going to be yucky too, I bet.

I would definitely be soaking that hoof twice a week (and the other hooves if that is anything to go by) but I don't think you can use cleantrax on a shod hoof. I have also had success using iodine squirted into the central sulcus for a hoof like that, but only used for the first week or so as it can degrade healthy flesh.

The most important thing to getting his hooves healthy is diet though - high fibre, low sugar and starch and adequate minerals.

I don't know what your budget is like OP, but I'd chuck out the biotin (studies have shown healthy horses produce more than enough of the stuff themselves) and invest in the forageplus hoof health balancer. I would also be concerned about the grazing situation - clover is really high energy and best avoided, although I'm not sure how you will overcome that. Can you perhaps restrict grazing and feed hay until the weather changes and grazing is 'safer'?

I would also be taking shoes off and using boots and pads.
 
Wow Thank you all for the overwhelming response to my thread. The sheer amount of knowledge here is phenomenal! I feel that you have all given me so much support and advice. I will do whatever it takes to get my boy right- so if that means changing diet/management I will.

I feel that I have an awful lot to work on. Today I have removed all the straw from my stable, disinfected it, and replaced with bags and bags of wood pellets so to keep his bed drier and hopefully his feet. I have soaked all 4 of his feet in warm salt water and syringed the bad one with salt water also. I have soaked his hay and just given him fast fibre for his dinner, with his biotin. Tomorrow I have a new farrier coming to assess the situation.

I will explore his diet tonight and find the perfect feed for him. I will look into the balancer more. I had no idea clover was so bad for horses, so I will speak to a local farmer to see if he can spray them off the field next year. Hopefully tomorrow these plastic shoes will come off, as they are slippery and actually don't work across stoney ground anyway. Ihave noticed that his back feet have become slightly, only very slightly concave now, which is a positive sign, however his poor front feet leave a lot to be desired. I did turn him out in the sand paddock for 20 mins earlier and he did look very sound, so hopefully the farrier that came yesterday has done the right thing by cutting away all of that black infected from. I will take some more pictures tomorrow and post on here.
 
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