Hannahgb
Well-Known Member
https://www.facebook.com/totilascom/posts/875838855833832?fref=nf
Very pleased to see he has now been retired
Very pleased to see he has now been retired
Totilas retired
- Thread starter Hannahgb
- Start date
Cortez
Tough but Fair
Yes, I saw that. Not sure what "edema" in a bone is, but at least the poor thing doesn't have to go through the competition circuit any more. Hopefully a happy life in the breeding shed awaits.
Goldenstar
Well-Known Member
Hopefully ...
marotelle
Well-Known Member
I hope the poor horse gets some time out in a REAL field, and if they wish to use him for ,breeding ,I think I would like to have some more information about his'injury' before sending a mare to him.
At least the nightmare is over for the poor lad.
At least the nightmare is over for the poor lad.
Casey76
Well-Known Member
Cortez, I think the official diagnosis for Toto was periostitis, which is pain and inflammation of the periosteum, the connective tissue layer on the outside of the bone. If due to infection, this can also lead to swelling of the actual bone istelf, and may be a symptom of osteomyelitis.
Cortez
Tough but Fair
Ah, thankyou - so it's inflamation of the bone.
Prince33Sp4rkle
Well-Known Member
sadly, i know people that have worked in the PSI breeding sheds, and happy retirement it aint........
crying shame for an amazing horse.
crying shame for an amazing horse.
Cortez
Tough but Fair
Nor is it supposed to be - it's a breeding station, where the stallions are "working", just like TB stallions do, or any other commercial sire. It's none of our business since we are not in charge of what happens to any horse other than our own, but do people seriously think the best thing for Totilas is to be turned out in some vast green pasture full of bunnies and bluebirds? The poor thing would go mental and be dead in a week. Remember what happened to one of Laura Bechtolsheimer's horses when they tried that?
Prince33Sp4rkle
Well-Known Member
i dont think anyone is saying that, no need to be so sarcastic.
theres breeding sheds and theres breeding sheds and the conditions viewed at the PSI station were grim...no light, no stimulation,no space,filthy stables etc and no doubt the horse will continue to breed until he drops dead.
some breeders take far more care of the horses(rather than the money)only recently Rousseau was retired from breeding due to physical issues making it hard for him to jump the dummy-dont see PSI being so caring but i hope to be proved wrong.
that was my point, not that breeding is a walk in the park or that all horses should be turned loose to live happily ever after under majikal rainbows.......................
theres breeding sheds and theres breeding sheds and the conditions viewed at the PSI station were grim...no light, no stimulation,no space,filthy stables etc and no doubt the horse will continue to breed until he drops dead.
some breeders take far more care of the horses(rather than the money)only recently Rousseau was retired from breeding due to physical issues making it hard for him to jump the dummy-dont see PSI being so caring but i hope to be proved wrong.
that was my point, not that breeding is a walk in the park or that all horses should be turned loose to live happily ever after under majikal rainbows.......................
AdorableAlice
Well-Known Member
One would hope mare owners realise he is not the bees knees of stallions. Incorrect movement, incorrect conformation a short career and a stress head. Perfect recipe for less than perfect progeny.
Batgirl
Well-Known Member
FYI - edema = swelling/inflammation in any context
Cortez
Tough but Fair
Sorry, not getting at you PSp, just trying to inject some reality into the debate. Turning horses like this out in a field is just not going to work, nor be the best thing that could happen.
Pigeon
Well-Known Member
But isn't that intensely depressing in itself??
marotelle
Well-Known Member
When I wrote about turning him out,I did not mean forgetting about him.True, he is highly strung; so is the great Frankel, and yet he gets daily turnout, walking exercise, I believe C Hester's horses have plenty of turnout.Obviously care must be taken at first, but I find it hard to believe that this horse will continue to be abused, just his stud fees should provide him with a correct life style;if not animal wellfare should intervene.
Clare85
Well-Known Member
I think so
I would say there are very, very few horses who cannot cope with regular turnout. It is public knowledge that Totilas does not get turnout at the moment (which imho is depriving him of one of his very basic needs) and so it would need slow introduction and careful management, but there is no reason he couldn't get used to (and enjoy/appreciate) at least some daily turnout, if his decision makers/carers were so inclined to put the time in.
tristar
Well-Known Member
totilas could be walked out in hand, for 5 or 6 miles 5times a week, they have the staff and the space, there are no excuses.
the racehorse sea the stars, stud fee I think now gone up to 125,000 euros goes out every day possible, I made a point of asking his groom.
there is a stallion valued at 70 million euros at the irish national stud I believe, they have super big paddocks where the stallions can see each other and the visitors, its very open..
I have seen stallions kept in very small boxes on mainland Europe, like sardines in a can.
the racehorse sea the stars, stud fee I think now gone up to 125,000 euros goes out every day possible, I made a point of asking his groom.
there is a stallion valued at 70 million euros at the irish national stud I believe, they have super big paddocks where the stallions can see each other and the visitors, its very open..
I have seen stallions kept in very small boxes on mainland Europe, like sardines in a can.
Cortez
Tough but Fair
Look, it's all very well to impose your own desires and impressions of what a perfect life for horses is, but the fact remains that not all horses conform to that. I have a horse who detests turn out - he was imported from Spain and has spent his life in full work without turnout. He is happiest with plenty of work, in hand, under saddle, led out, on the walker, whatever, but does not appreciate going out in the field: he'll do about 45 minutes and then, very firmly, wants to come in. If I insist on him staying out, he'll weave at the gate. All day. So, I do what's best for him and keep him in, work him appropriately and don't try and impose my idea of what's "best" for him. He's a very cheerful chappie, I can assure you. My other horses go out daily, as I prefer, but just because I think it's best for horses to be out does not mean that I am 100% right.
Totilas will be well cared for, he's too valuable not to be, quite apart from the fact that his owners are not necessarily heartless horse abusers. Reality, not sentiment.
Totilas will be well cared for, he's too valuable not to be, quite apart from the fact that his owners are not necessarily heartless horse abusers. Reality, not sentiment.
dominobrown
Well-Known Member
Agree he might not be the best breeding stallion- he hasn't proved longevity, and he was very quirky when young, even Edward Gal admitted that, and he looked hard to produce... Edward Gal did manage it but not many people ride like him!
As for TB's, they have to cover mares naturally and it is a different industry. Also TB's have a different upbringing. Even the most valuable youngstock grow up in the fields as herds.
Cortez^^^ I do agree, they will hopefully/ probably do what is best for the horse.
As for TB's, they have to cover mares naturally and it is a different industry. Also TB's have a different upbringing. Even the most valuable youngstock grow up in the fields as herds.
Cortez^^^ I do agree, they will hopefully/ probably do what is best for the horse.
Pigeon
Well-Known Member
It is not my own desires - I wish it were for the sake of the animals! Unfortunately science has my back. Saying horses don't like space and company is like saying humans don't like air. We constantly see behaviours in horses that we used to see in caged zoo animals in Victorian times, and still, all is fine and dandy? Your horse doesn't like turnout because he was institutionalised as a youngster. So maybe being stabled is best for him, but only because he was raised in a less than ideal manner. I assume in some cases it is necessary to keep a horse stabled. I also don't doubt that they get the best possible care, within those parameters.
I still think it is cruel.
And nothing I have seen to date has changed my mind. I mean, I think intensive farming is cruel too and that is abundant, so realistically I don't think things will change any time soon.