Trailer Mis-sold?

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countrybumpkin727

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Hi all!

So iv been saving up a while for a trailer, finally found one which fitted my boy for my price range...great! Even better a friend of friend was selling it so the history was known... Or we thought!!! We went and saw the trailer and did the normal checks and looked over it and decided to go for it. The advert said it had a new floor, brakes and light working. Some cosmetic damage to a front ramp but it was safe. If I can work out how to upload the ads I will.
3 weeks later I take it to be serviced before I start putting my boy in it.. 1 hour later I get a call from the mechanic saying the brake shoes all needed to be replaced but they couldn't be replaced as the axial points had rotten away and needed to be completely replaced. The back ramp (not the front that is in the add) is starting to rot and is coming away from trailer. The bill to replace £1000+
Now obviously I'm heartbroken as I can't afford the fixes and I now have no money to hire.

So I rang citizens advice and they said I have a claim due to the sales and goods act of 1979 and I should email the lady. I have done so and pointed out the issues and sent the mechanics note to her.

So my question is this. If you were the lady receiving it what would your reaction be? Would you think it's my fault as I didn't get a mechanic down to check it before I bought it? Or would you accept you mis sold it by accident?

If someone can tell me how to upload pics I will upload the advert!
 
I really feel for you, can't help with pics but think they need to be on photo bucket first???
As for the lady's reaction. I suppose it's buyer beware, even if the item is from a known background. But if she's any decency she would knock some money off for you. Or it could very simply be that she had no idea. Was the trailer regularly serviced?? I would definately look under the chassis but I'm not sure I'd pay a mechanic to inspect a trailer if buying one. Did you get it for a good price? You may be able to sell on as found or part ex?? I'm not surprised your gutted, good luck OP
 
Agree about the buyer beware but the way it was described to me as because the seller gave a full description such as the brakes are working and it's turned out not the be true she has mis sold it. If she had just said here is a trailer sold as seen with no comment it's my fault..... Apparently!
Bought it for 1500... Present value with the faults... £300
 
countrybumpkin727 said:
Agree about the buyer beware but the way it was described to me as because the seller gave a full description such as the brakes are working and it's turned out not the be true she has mis sold it. If she had just said here is a trailer sold as seen with no comment it's my fault..... Apparently!
Bought it for 1500... Present value with the faults... £300
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Omg that's awful, was there an advert? Did CAB give advice on your next step? I think I'd go and see the seller in person and have a chat with her about what's happened. Go for the wanting your money back and return the trailer, hopefully she will but if not then at least you've got advice. No matter how angry you are, I'd keep it very civil pleading to her good nature.
 
She might not have known, depends if it went to a cowboy for the work. I know of a car that was sold, it looked lovely, had had welding done in the past, but was all sound and MOT'd.

Oh no it hadn't, the thing was so rotten underneath it had to be scrapped. The buyer was furious that he had been sold a wreck, when it was advertised as being sound, but the seller had been ripped off very badly by his garage. He had been paying hundreds for work to be done, the car had never been welded, not even bodged and the garage had MOT'd it every year, charged for work and not carried it out. Poor bloke had no idea.

I don't know what arrangement he came to with his buyer, I know the buyer didn't get all of his cash back though. It was sold in good faith, the garage was, well, awful.
 
So CAB told me to write an email explaining the situation to the seller and then saying that under the sales act in entitled to a replaced,repair or refund. They said if they don't respond then small claims court...

http://i1168.photobucket.com/albums/r488/Countrybunpkin727/Mobile Uploads/image_zpshicdfllh.png Hope that link works for the photo of the advert! Let me know your thoughts!

My gut feeling is she didn't know... I mean can you imagine if I put my horse in there and was driving on the motorway? Horrible :(
 
Very much not fit for purpose then, I suspect she didn't know either but that isn't the way it works really. I do wonder who put the new floor in!
 
As its not a trade sale then you may find your options are limited. My understanding is that you will only be able to claim on anything that is specifically not as stated in the advert. So therefore you may be able to claim for the brakes as she said they were working and you now have evidence that this is unlikely but the advert doesn't appear to mention the rear ramp and therefore this is likely to be buyer beware.

If the person is a friend then I think maybe rather than quoting SoG and CAB at them you might have been better giving them a call/going to see them and explaining what you have been told by your mechanic and that you are absolutely distraught as you don't have that sort of money to fix it and see where the conversation went. If they say tough luck then they are obviously not much of a friend and you can then get official on them, if they are willing to meet you part way then you might both be OK and retain the friendship.
 
If it was a private seller (not a commercial one) then without something in writing the law is clear = CAVEAT EMPTOR = buyer beware
Therefore no legal recourse against the seller

No different to buying a private used car

Next time take this advice - take a mechanic with you or agree in writing that the sale is subject to it being looked over by an expert

Not want you wanted to hear but thats the law
 
Well if people can return a horse to a private seller as not fit for purpose I don't see why they can't with a trailer!

If it were a car the rules would be
T'he car should be true to the advert and what you were told by the person you bought it from. You won’t be entitled to anything just because the car is faulty or because the seller failed to mention something in the advert.

I wonder if it was sold as 'safe' or whether that was just when mentioning the front ramp.
 
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ROG said:
If it was a private seller (not a commercial one) then without something in writing the law is clear = CAVEAT EMPTOR = buyer beware
Therefore no legal recourse against the seller

No different to buying a private used car

Next time take this advice - take a mechanic with you or agree in writing that the sale is subject to it being looked over by an expert

Not want you wanted to hear but thats the law
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I'm sorry ROG but I don't think you're right. I don't think she can explicitly state that the brakes are working if they need new shoes and are about to break away from their axial points.
 
OP the easiest way to put pics up is to upload the image to photobucket/facebook etc and copy the .jpg code. Then add
without the spaces either side of the code and it will show.
 
ycbm said:
I'm sorry ROG but I don't think you're right. I don't think she can explicitly state that the brakes are working if they need new shoes and are about to break away from their axial points.
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This type of case has been on TV many times - to claim a refund etc from a private seller it MUST be in writing

I could legally sell a car and say wonderful things about it verbally but if not in writing it just 'puffing' and has no legal bearing

Horses may be covered differently as they are animals - I do not know the laws on that
 
ROG said:
This type of case has been on TV many times - to claim a refund etc from a private seller it MUST be in writing

I could legally sell a car and say wonderful things about it verbally but if not in writing it just 'puffing' and has no legal bearing

Horses may be covered differently as they are animals - I do not know the laws on that
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But the CAB says it includes what you were told!
 
But as I don't think it comes under car stuff it would be this from CAB, again it includes whatever you were told:

'It depends on how the item was described to you

You only have rights if the item isn’t as it was described. It should be true to the advert and what you were told by whoever you bought it from. You won’t be entitled to anything just because the item is faulty or because the seller failed to mention something in the advert.
If it’s not ‘as described’, you’re entitled to a refund so long as you haven’t customised the item since you bought it. An example of this could be dyeing a sofa a different colour.

You’re only entitled to a refund if something goes wrong with the item within a ‘reasonable’ time of you buying it. The law isn’t very specific on how long you’ve got, but if you’re confident in your approach you should be entitled to a refund within the first 2 months or so.'

'The seller might not agree with what you’re asking for - they may try to say you don’t have rights, or that they don’t owe you anything.

Let them know you understand what you’re entitled to.

You can say something like this:

“Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979, this X should be of a satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described. My rights have been breached because the X you sold me is faulty. I would like you to put this right by giving me a refund/repairing the X at your cost.”'
 
you only have to prove it if it goes to court... OP hasn't got that far yet.
She also didn't view the trailer on her own so has a witness....
Under the law it includes verbal so you can't say it has no legal bearing at all.
 
Private sales are only governed by whether the goods are as described. Therefore if the description is brakes working and they aren't then the seller would be responsible for fixing the brakes. If they had said all ramps sound and safe then they would be responsible for the ramps but the OP has said only the front ramp was mentioned and therefore the seller is not responsible for the rear ramp.

Similarly in a private sale of a horse if the seller says it is good to load and then proves to not load at all then it is possible that the buyer may have a case to either return the horse or to claim costs for correcting the problem. However the problem must be communicated and the seller given opportunity to rectify first.

In a private sale both parties are treated as equal whereas in a sale from a trader to a private individual then the trader is deemed to have a professional knowledge not available to the buyer and therefore must deal with more care. So silence or ignorance from a dealer on an issue is no defence and the law will favour the buyer, whereas in a private sale silence is golden and caveat emptor.
 
ROG said:
If it was a private seller (not a commercial one) then without something in writing the law is clear = CAVEAT EMPTOR = buyer beware
Therefore no legal recourse against the seller
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See it is this, that just isn't accurate.

Yes Lizzie66 I think it depends exactly what was on the advert and what was said.
 
ester said:
you only have to prove it if it goes to court... OP hasn't got that far yet.
She also didn't view the trailer on her own so has a witness....
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NEVER going to legally win

I could tell the buyer (and 6 of their mates) that my used car does 0 to 60 in 5 seconds then after they buy it they find it does not = CAVEAT EMPTOR = they had the opportunity to test that in the same way that the trailer buyer could hav chosen to have it inspected before buying

Contact any legal expert and they wil tell you the same thing
 
All good replies thanks :)

One point the ladies at CAB said that for the first 6 months of ownership it is down to the seller to proove something is in working order, other way round after that...
As the axial is attached to the breaks would that be included in the statement about the breaks?
Also as the consumer rules changed in oct 2015 if this was a non private sale I would have 30 days for a refund. Not relevant but interesting
 
Not sure it was mis sold. OP states they looked over it and did the normal checks, so I guess that included driving it and checking the general state of the ramps etc. The seller informed them of the new floor and that the brakes and lights were working, and there is nothing to say that they weren't, if they weren't the test drive should have shown up an issue, you would know if the brakes weren't working.
The seller probably has driven (like many do) that trailer regularly for ages with no problems so would assume there isn't a problem. I would shop around for some more prices.
I always do a receipt with 'sold as seen' and both parties sign it and have a copy.
 
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ester said:
But as I don't think it comes under car stuff it would be this from CAB, again it includes whatever you were told:

'It depends on how the item was described to you

You only have rights if the item isn’t as it was described. It should be true to the advert and what you were told by whoever you bought it from. You won’t be entitled to anything just because the item is faulty or because the seller failed to mention something in the advert.
If it’s not ‘as described’, you’re entitled to a refund so long as you haven’t customised the item since you bought it. An example of this could be dyeing a sofa a different colour.

You’re only entitled to a refund if something goes wrong with the item within a ‘reasonable’ time of you buying it. The law isn’t very specific on how long you’ve got, but if you’re confident in your approach you should be entitled to a refund within the first 2 months or so.'

'The seller might not agree with what you’re asking for - they may try to say you don’t have rights, or that they don’t owe you anything.

Let them know you understand what you’re entitled to.

You can say something like this:

“Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979, this X should be of a satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described. My rights have been breached because the X you sold me is faulty. I would like you to put this right by giving me a refund/repairing the X at your cost.”'
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The sale of goods act does not cover private sales!
 
CAB are confusing buying from a commercial seller to buying from a private one - the 6 month comment gave that away
 
countrybumpkin727 said:
All good replies thanks :)

One point the ladies at CAB said that for the first 6 months of ownership it is down to the seller to proove something is in working order, other way round after that...
As the axial is attached to the breaks would that be included in the statement about the breaks?
Also as the consumer rules changed in oct 2015 if this was a non private sale I would have 30 days for a refund. Not relevant but interesting
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Cab have got it wrong the rules they are quoting do not apply to a private sale its a totally different ball game.

The Brakes indeed cpould be working but still look bad when inspected how was the seller to know any different why didnt you inspect them as its easy to do!
As for the ramp how come you did not notice it? If indeed it is as bad as made out. Sorry private sales very much are still Caveat emptor as far as the law is concerned.
 
countrybumpkin727 said:
The act does include private sales!!! Really at the end of each sale having the statement sold as seen is very needed. But it wasn't so I'm thinking I'm entitled to what she states as working and isn't!!

I guess it boils down to were the brakes working when you tried the trailer? You could be totally honest and say a) I didn't drive it. B) yes, the brakes stopped the trailer or c) no, the brakes didn't work and the car towing the trailer was pushed by it. Now, i assume the seller was present when you looked over the trailer so they would have to answer the same questions.
The fact is you decided the trailer was satisfactory when you handed over your money and it was your decision to get someone to look it over AFTER you had made your decision. The fact issues were picked up then is unfortunate.
If you and the seller both picked option 'c' then I would say you can go back to them to try and sort something out.
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countrybumpkin727 said:
The act does include private sales!!! Really at the end of each sale having the statement sold as seen is very needed. But it wasn't so I'm thinking I'm entitled to what she states as working and isn't!!

http://e-lawresources.co.uk/Statutory-implied-terms.php
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3. S. 14 Implied term as to quality


S.14 only applies where the seller sells goods in the course of a business. It therefore does not apply to private sales although there may be an action for breach of an express term or misrepresentation in some circumstances.

Can you quote where it applies to privately sold good please ?
 
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