Tripping horse...out of ideas...do I quit?

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RichardRider

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I have a stunning(looking anyway,) big Selle Francais(1,80...18hands?) and he has always had a bit of a tripping problem. I have had a few trips to hospital, broken bones, etc. For the past few months, a very good rider(English as well,) has taken me under his wing and we have tried many different approaches, including changing bits, double reins on straight plastic bar pelham and curb chain to recently, a dutch gag on single reins...

I even started jumping again(timidly,) with him...

Mate/pro rider has always claimed that he's lazy, often bridle lame and always needs a lot of "leg"(even rode with spurs for a while,) to keep him from going "out the front door" as he puts it(and then sometimes tripping...but scary tripping.)

Wish I had the money just to change horses(technically he has good papers,) and I am beginning to get to the age where finding myself flat on my back is not the most enviable position...and I'd love to get back jumping WITHOUT BEING SCARED TO DEATH of him stumbling after the jump...

What am I(we) missing with this horse? When I got off him today I said that that was it, but damn it....well you know...

richard
 
Lots of possibilities really! I would get your vet and farrier on the case. A horse that trips badly might have long toes, be bilateraly (sp!) lame etc - many options as well as being a schooling issue. A chat with the farrier about your probs and how his feet are and a full lameness work up with the vet would be my next steps.
 
As previous poster said, it could be for any number of reasons, but when my old boy started tripping (shire x) I told the farrier, and he changed the front shoes to natural balance and they gave him a new lease of life.
 
glosgirl said:
Lots of possibilities really! I would get your vet and farrier on the case. A horse that trips badly might have long toes, be bilateraly (sp!) lame etc - many options as well as being a schooling issue. A chat with the farrier about your probs and how his feet are and a full lameness work up with the vet would be my next steps.
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Thank you.

Farrier has been trimming him back more...We did have him on daily "Bute" and he seemed better for it after showing a bit lame. I wonder if he's blocked somehow in his back somewhere.

Today's tripping also probably due to long toe(I've talked up my French Farrier to so many of my English Friends, the other day he came and didn't have time for my horse! But this is not the only problem and he's been much longer in the past....

rr
 
Misinterpreted said:
As previous poster said, it could be for any number of reasons, but when my old boy started tripping (shire x) I told the farrier, and he changed the front shoes to natural balance and they gave him a new lease of life.
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yes,(and thanks,)
he's gone to a beveled off competition shoe but maybe this is the next direction to take, but I have a feeling it's elsewhere...Mate says hes a "grass trimmer," never hardly lifting up his forehand...

rr
 
Shoes can interfere with the horse's reflexes & ability to know where it's feet are (propriocepsis - sp?!). Sometimes when you take their shoes off they get a lot less stumbley & klutz-like. My old horse stumbled an awful lot but stopped stumbling almost immediately when he went barefoot - he had long toes which won't have helped, but the difference was so pronounced that I think there was more to it than that. I don't think you have a lot to lose by whipping off his shoes to see if it helps ;)
 
If you had him on daily bute did he have an injury you were waiting to heal? Perhaps all isn't well even though he isn't showing lame as he was before you put him on bute. Would be an absolute def vet call for me with that info.
 
Spinal Tap said:
Shoes can interfere with the horse's reflexes & ability to know where it's feet are (propriocepsis - sp?!). Sometimes when you take their shoes off they get a lot less stumbley & klutz-like. My old horse stumbled an awful lot but stopped stumbling almost immediately when he went barefoot - he had long toes which won't have helped, but the difference was so pronounced that I think there was more to it than that. I don't think you have a lot to lose by whipping off his shoes to see if it helps ;)
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OMG I completely second this! The difference in the way my horse moves now he's bare is noticeable even to my very unhorsey friends. He positively floats along like a short thick tb (ha ha!) and lands heel first now even on hard ground.
 
tallyho! said:
OMG I completely second this! The difference in the way my horse moves now he's bare is noticeable even to my very unhorsey friends. He positively floats along like a short thick tb (ha ha!) and lands heel first now even on hard ground.
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Thanks(to all,) but going barefoot means I can't walk him up to the place where I can work him(and hack out,) when he finally gets back home...He's only been ridden in my mate's school over the past few months...

As for the Bute, he was a bit lame and it did him much good but we took him off it gradually and he seemed fine. Someone just asked me(on an American Forum,) if he tripped when galloping and clowning around here at home and the answer is NO, he's bloody beautiful when Iam not on him!

rr
 
RichardRider said:
Thanks(to all,) but going barefoot means I can't walk him up to the place where I can work him(and hack out,) when he finally gets back home...He's only been ridden in my mate's school over the past few months...
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He might be fine. My old lad (who was a very heavy 16.2 cob, not a pony) took to it like a duck to water when his shoes came off & never took a sore step, my current horse has been pretty much the same. She's done everything, including going out with the bloodhounds for 3 1/2 hours on all terrains, barefoot. It needn't be a problem. If he is sore initially then hoofboots are an option, but if he might be less stumbley, surely it's worth a go?
 
Well, RichardRider, I can only tell you that when I made the decision to remove the shoes, it was because I couldn't stand to see him struggle any longer. In my heart of hearts I knew it was his the shoes that were causing all his faults. Bad shoulder, stiff stifles, back like a plank, tripping on thin air...

People kept telling me I shouldn't and that I won't be able to ride him. "So what?" I thought, after 2 years deliberating, he's given me his time and braved everything I asked even though it hurt and it was time I helped him out for a change. It's going to be long road for you but will be worth it if you think it's worthwhile trying and you have the time to give your horse.

Have you tried googling equine podiatry?
 
Must try this but mate/and pro rider thinks natural balance shoes and all that a bunch of "bullocks," to quote him; even the special competition shoes I had the Farrier do some time back...

An American Friend said he might have had his hoofs/legs "nerved," so he doesn't even feel his forehand feet?

I think pulling off his shoes is worth trying(and thanks again,) but he's stunning(without me on his back!) So if he isn't tripping without me, why with, pressure on his vertibre?

Funny how things like this just take the life out of one...appreciate all your help


richard
 
Hi,

I'd definitely follow the advice other people have given on here as it's best to try everything, but reading your post was like hearing myself a few years ago. My horse started tripping and fell with me several times for no apparent reason, with the last staw being when we were jumping and his front feet just buckled underneath him on landing, leaving me with a fractured neck & broken hip.
Needles to say, I retired him and had several vet tests done. I was desperate to find a solution to his problems, but thousands of pounds worth of tests never gave me a conclusive answer, and it put us both through so much stress. I was told he had navicular, and he eventually developed neurological problems so I had him put to sleep 18 months into his retirement as he was a danger to himself as well as others.
Like I said, definitely try what everyone has reccommended, but please be careful ... sometimes there's just no answer or solution, and riding a horse that trips severley can have really horrific consequences.
I don't mean to be the negative one, but after my experience I'm petrified about anything that trips reguarly for no reason!
Best of luck though, I really hope you can sort it.
 
tallyho! said:
Well, RichardRider, I can only tell you that when I made the decision to remove the shoes, it was because I couldn't stand to see him struggle any longer. In my heart of hearts I knew it was his the shoes that were causing all his faults. Bad shoulder, stiff stifles, back like a plank, tripping on thin air...

People kept telling me I shouldn't and that I won't be able to ride him. "So what?" I thought, after 2 years deliberating, he's given me his time and braved everything I asked even though it hurt and it was time I helped him out for a change. It's going to be long road for you but will be worth it if you think it's worthwhile trying and you have the time to give your horse.

Have you tried googling equine podiatry?
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Yes, and maybe I can keep my soul this way?

Today, when he tripped for the second time(good shoulder dipping, throw you off type,) on a slow(I thought,) balanced canter, I just got off him, my mate pretending not even to see me, and said that was it. This was ANOTHER accident waiting to happen but I'll try anything...

rr
 
ELM89 said:
Hi,

I'd definitely follow the advice other people have given on here as it's best to try everything, but reading your post was like hearing myself a few years ago. My horse started tripping and fell with me several times for no apparent reason, with the last staw being when we were jumping and his front feet just buckled underneath him on landing, leaving me with a fractured neck & broken hip.
Needles to say, I retired him and had several vet tests done. I was desperate to find a solution to his problems, but thousands of pounds worth of tests never gave me a conclusive answer, and it put us both through so much stress. I was told he had navicular, and he eventually developed neurological problems so I had him put to sleep 18 months into his retirement as he was a danger to himself as well as others.
Like I said, definitely try what everyone has reccommended, but please be careful ... sometimes there's just no answer or solution, and riding a horse that trips severley can have really horrific consequences.
I don't mean to be the negative one, but after my experience I'm petrified about anything that trips reguarly for no reason!
Best of luck though, I really hope you can sort it.
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Thank you Elm,

As much as I'd like to jump again, my last hospitalized accident with him,(at 50,) lost me work and my jumping confidence. That's when I got off this morning. My work in NEVER STEADY, I have a 6yr old son, and I'm the only able body on our little farm, and I even think it SELFISH of me to be taking these risks just for one last hurrah...

You were being realistic, not negitive. Thank you so much and I hope you have recovered fully from your accident...richard
 
I had a horse that did this. The physio pointed out that he had a very small shoulder blade for his size and he thought that this was possibly related to the cause of the trip. His shoulder looked normal but on poking and prodding the lack of scapula, and therefore muscle attachment area was very noticable. Did not cure the problem but did give a reason.
 
EPRider said:
I had a horse that did this. The physio pointed out that he had a very small shoulder blade for his size and he thought that this was possibly related to the cause of the trip. His shoulder looked normal but on poking and prodding the lack of scapula, and therefore muscle attachment area was very noticable. Did not cure the problem but did give a reason.
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Hope it isn't this...Would think my mate would have seen this. He's a great rider/trainer(and all that,) but obviously we've missed something...

going to eat a bowl of cereal or something....rr
 
Yes thank you - I had a very lucky escape with my broken bones! I completely understand as I felt the same way after my last accident. You certainly shouldn't feel selfish for wanting to jump, and I know it's incredibly frustrating when you see your horse galloping round the field like there's no problem at all. You have to give him all the chances you can, as long as he's not in pain (I agree with one of the previous posters that as he reacted well to bute it may be worth a call to the vet for their opinion?). However, like you say I suppose you have to weigh up the pros and cons of riding this horse against your responsibilities in life ... many people said to me 'there's too many good horses to have a bad one', and I tend to be of this view now too on certain occasions. Whilst riding is always a risk, it is meant to be enjoyable and you (& your horse!) shouldn't dread your next lesson. Once again, good luck with whatever you decide.
 
I know exactly how you feel. I nearly stopped riding mine as I had come off over his head too many times - 4 to be exact but I thought if he ever did it again I would retire him. I thought it was a good way to break my neck.

I had all the experts, vet, different farrier, different saddle, umpteen back, physio, chiro people, etc. etc. All helped a bit, but he always had one good trip when ridden, either schooling or on the road. I hacked him in knee boots and it badly affected my riding.

Until one day Neil Saunders walked into the yard and said "I can't fix all this in one visit."
Three maniupulations later he was fine, and hardly ever tripped again. He completely altered his stance. There theory was that stiffness in back/hind leg area wasn't allowing his front leg to go forward sufficiently. Also he was restricted inthe shoulder area. I did have him barefoot for nearly 2 years later on and he didn't trip once and didn't trip in hoof boots either. Back in shoes now, temporarily, and if his feet get long he will have the odd trip and it still sends a cold chill through me.

I would have him looked over by a Veterinary Physiotherapist, who should check the saddle and look at his feet. I do carrot stretched regularly with my horse now, to keep his shoulders stretched. Every time I ride him I give him a "thank you" by making him reach for it 3 times both sides.
 
Have you had a vet look at him? ( I honestly can't see how changing his bit will make any difference)

If he's working on his forehand because he has difficulty carrying himself it could be due to lots of things including spavins and back pain.

Until you get to the bottom of it, your safety should come first and not riding would perhaps be sensible.
 
You have my sympathies. I have a 22 yr old TB who has had quite a busy life. I've had him since he was 16 & he's always had a tendency to trip, but has got much worse of late. My chap has been fired so not sure if that means anything & has an old tendon injury, but trips equally on both fronts. We try to keep his toes cut back & this makes a slight difference, but he will still stumble. He's also had rolled toes & we are going to try a reverse shoe next time which means nothing under his toe. He also trips in the field when turned out, but these are slight.

I haven't come off him yet as he's always saved himself, but I'm thinking of retiring him from anything more than hacking, which he can only do on the road, as even a verge will make him trip. I too have responsibilities & am in my late forties so really can do without breaking bones.

Trouble is, the old chap loves his hunting & I'm so tempted to take him for one last spin.
 
Ted has problems tripping. I don't know how old your horse is but age and arthritis is what the vet thinks has caused him to trip badly. Ted has always tripped since we've had him as a 14 year old. However, over the last year (he's now 19) his tripping became really bad in the ménage. He has natural balance shoes, and at age 16 they did make a difference, they don't now.

Ted had a nasty fall when going around a corner, he tripped in front and couldn't recover, and down we both went, fortunately we were both unharmed just shaken up. It is really scary, one minute we were trotting happily, the next on our side, poor Ted landed with his face in the sand, it is horrible to see such big, gracious animals face down in the sand!

We had the vet out the following week, and she told me to never ride in the school as he would be likely to fall again. He has arthritis in his hocks, and she also thinks he may have kissing spines. She said it probably wasn't worth injecting for his arthritis given it was in multiple areas, the chances of 'fixing' him were very slim, as she said it will only get worse with age.

The vet suggested lightly hacking him, and put him on danilon for a month, and said that it would either make a difference or he would still trip. He no longer trips out hacking, although he hasn't done much work tbh, as I'm fearful of him falling when he messes around or spooks, as he always drops his shoulder.

I would get the vet out if I were you, but from my own experience vets don't tend to give a good prognosis due to the risk of harm for riders when horses fall.
 
deicinmerlyn said:
Have you had a vet look at him? ( I honestly can't see how changing his bit will make any difference)

If he's working on his forehand because he has difficulty carrying himself it could be due to lots of things including spavins and back pain.

Until you get to the bottom of it, your safety should come first and not riding would perhaps be sensible.
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Just wanted to quote this because of the spavin issue: strangely, narrow/contracted feet has a significant correlation with spavin, navicular and back pain. Contracted feet are not necessarily related to shoes but the foot can gradually contract when wearing shoes.

Don't mistake me for a shoe-hater, I will probably shoe my horse again when his foot shape is back to normal when/if required...

The saddle... well, I've commented on ill-fitting saddles two sizes too narrow and that horse never tripped once. Who knows?

Thing is, it's true you shouldn't waste good money on a bad horse but is he bad because we made him bad or is he truly a badly conformed horse?
 
Hi Richard
I had an ex-racehorse who tripped. Never injured me though but fell on his knees loads of times. Had him vet checked, back, tack, etc. Always kept his feet trimmed so he never had a long toe, he wore standard shoes.

With him I really think it was down to his concentration, fitness & interest in what we were doing. Never tripped when we are flat out, never tripped when we were doing something he was interested in & stopped tripping when he got very fit. I did a lot of balancing work with him in the school on the lunge, etc. Funnily enough most of his tripping went on in the school - may well have been a coincidence but schooling was his least favourite thing!

If you get him checked over & he is sound I would suggest really putting him to work - I don't mean riding him into the ground, give him lots of varied things to do in the school, keep his mind occupied at all times so he doesn't switch off & become bored. Some say that you should only focus on 1 or 2 things during a schooling session but I found with my horse the more I crammed in, the better he was. The fitter he gets he will develop better muscles & be able to carry himself properly.
 
I agree with some of the other posts - farrier and vet......what about plastic shoes as a trial? Also, what about his eyesight? Everyone looking at the obvious things, as we all do, but maybe think outside the box......my horse lost an eye at 21 in an accident (then uveitis), he is now 28, and wins loads of veteran classes etc, but he can be trippy due to his eyesight being half of what it was. Eyesight problems can cause all sorts of things which you may not associate.....like falling down when the farrier comes (you try standing on one leg with one eye closed!!!Lol) Worth consideration.
 
Thank you all. I feel like someone attending an AA meeting and discovering that he is not alone...Having him checked out by a Chiropractor/vet/osteopath is something I should have done long ago...And the carrot stretching I am going to do with him tomorrow when I see him...

I could be crazy(started riding at 40, am 57 now and don't profess to be anything but a somewhat athletic but average rider,) but I feel like something "mechanical", perhaps cpapable of being remedied by manipulation, is his problem and has been all along. He's 14 this year and I've had him almost 10 years. He was tripping when he was young when we,(mistake, another one,) were backing and training him.

Tomorrow morning I'll be riding someone else's horse. Don't know how many of you ever suffered being accused of not knowing how to ride your horses, but my present mate/and excellent rider has said this all along(nicely but firmly.) But he is wrong, and both right to a degree...

The past few months at his place has done wonders for the horse's balance, confirmation, and general good health and happiness. It didn't cost me anything, I helping out in other areas where he needed it. It was his personal vendetta to prove it wasn't the horse...Thanks to my friend, I have gotten back into a nearly daily riding routine and have experimented with all sorts of riding positions,bits, spurs, etc and even jumped a bit...

But the horse still trips and all it takes is once(again.) It's funny how, owning a tripping horse can be taken so personally by the rider. My friend even said to me today, "so you change horses, and your new horse trips once...Then what do you do?"

There is tripping and there is tripping. Anyone who owns a "tripper" and has been to emergency(me three times,) and/or flat on his back, with no notice, out of nowhere....knows the difference.

Thank you all.

richard rider
 
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