Trotting issues with horse

Jasmine2023 said:
I asked the RI did I do something wrong and the answer was no. They said he appeared to not know what to do and the term 'tucked his bum up underneath' was mentioned I think that's what she said. Does that mean anything to anyone?
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To me, I'd understand that as a horse that likely is a bit shy for things behind. As in, could be scared of the rider (could also be scared of the carriage, but that's not the case if there is no carriage or similar equipment). It requires a fair bit of training. How is he with people touching his hind legs, things being placed behind the place for the saddle, ropes around his legs?

Be very careful if you are to try especially the latter one, as the horse very well may get scared and kick. It is however something I practice with my colts, to have them comfortable with being touched all over, both with hands and ropes/other things. Wouldn't want the horse to panic if it got something stuck to it.
 
mariew said:
Can you move to a yard with better support and more knowledgeable people? I don't think they are doing you any favours and don't really seem to know what they are doing if they are unable to help and guide you.
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Sadly there are no more places nearby. I think they are trying to help in their own way.
 
Clodagh said:
Come on people show some positivity! This can be fixed with time and effort. Not everyone was born in the saddle.
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Time and effort in the right context, absolutely, but without good help and no budget it IS much more challenging.

"It's just trotting that's the issue" is a big thing OP, it's the pace that is used for a huge proportion of schooling and developing a balanced rising trot is going to be critical. Canter is often the pace that worries people which then worries the horse but it's the pace that the horse develops certain postural abilities in most naturally so ideally you move towards being super comfortable.in trot and canter.

I think groundwork is a great idea IF done right, and so much isn't. With the advice you've had so far I'd be concerned that it might be the latter you're guided towards. I always recommend my saddle fit customers, first of all, to a free FB group, Slow Walk Work. Start with the featured posts, just the first exercise, and the ebook, but go through and read people's posts, look at the videos they post asking for help etc. you'll find a lovely committed group of horse owners as well as a fab trainer. The resources are out there but knowing where to go is hard without someone to "curate" this stuff for you.

In the meantime how are we going to get you more balanced? I would have a look around for some inexpensive off horse work, I work with a lovely lady who has the channel Equimech on YouTube and she has some free content on there. Becoming a balanced load for our horse to carry us the biggest fundamental.thing we can do for then in ridden work.

Do be sure you have the resources for this, as others have said he will go through saddles as he grows and develop and there are always unexpected, and often large, unforseen costs with horses.
 
This behaviour doesn't sound unusual for a just backed young horse with a novice / nervous rider on board. What's a bit different is that an instructor would think that this is a good idea for someone who has already recently had a bad experience with a green horse that was too much for them. In the past, I also bought a horse that had been backed over in Ireland. This was a few years ago and there were a lot of holes in his education. He had literally just had a few weeks work from being in a field to being ridden. If I'd been more clued up about how little had been done with him I would have just had him restarted over here instead of pushing on with ridden work.

In this case, if the current trainer will not get on the horse and also doesn't have an idea of how to help with this issue then you definitely need someone else to help you. Training a young horse isn't always straight forward and you need someone who has experience with this aspect to keep you on the right track. Instructors who work at riding schools are not always the best to help with training a young horse as their experience can be largely teaching novice riders on safe rs ponies. If you are still at a yard where you are not allowed any external help and do not have the funds to send the horse for further schooling then it's a difficult situation that could go very wrong.
 
Clodagh said:
Come on people show some positivity! This can be fixed with time and effort. Not everyone was born in the saddle.
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Agree.

From more recent comments @Jasmine2023 it sounds like you have bought a 'just backed' pony rather than one that is 'ridden away' not your fault. you asked for advise from the people you trust and it would appear they have given you less than good advise or not paid enough attention and given you incorrect advise.

I'd take the riding (apart from walk and halt) out of the equation for a while.
See if you can find some books to give you idea's for exercises you can do with him in the school.
If the hacking is nice round where he is currently, walk him out in hand. Build a relationship with him. (my babies love this) pop him over some logs and different terrain if you can.

While you are doing this look for a producer locally - go and visit. Have a conversation about your horse, your ability and what you want to achieve. I honestly believe you need help from someone who can teach the horse and then teach you to ride the horse. This time of year show producers often are quieter as owners often take ponies home for the winter after HOYS, so you may find someone with space immediately.

Every horse is different, what your instructor is saying is OK or correct is not OK or correct in your horses eyes. He's been taught in a different way from how your instructor is teaching you to ride, without getting on and trying for herself your instructor is never going to know. I'm sorry but I'm cross on your behalf that she's given you advise to buy a young horse and then refuses to support you.
 
Clodagh said:
Come on people show some positivity! This can be fixed with time and effort. Not everyone was born in the saddle.
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I don't think people are necessarily saying it can't be fixed. It's just that if OP doesn't have experienced/decent quality help on hand, and hasn't budgeted for additional input, then this seems unlikely to move forward in a positive way.

I say this as a person not born in the saddle, and very much investing in trying to improve my riding skills, fitness, and mindset.

OP having a look at some of Riding with Rhi's stuff on YouTube with her young horse might be worth looking at. I believe she bought him as a 5yo though I can't remember how much he might have done before she bought him. The point there is she's someone who seems to have been riding for many years and had a horse previously, but shows how much input from an instructor has been put in to keep them moving through the challenges that can come with a new and young horse.
 
dorsetladette said:
Agree.

From more recent comments @Jasmine2023 it sounds like you have bought a 'just backed' pony rather than one that is 'ridden away' not your fault. you asked for advise from the people you trust and it would appear they have given you less than good advise or not paid enough attention and given you incorrect advise.

I'd take the riding (apart from walk and halt) out of the equation for a while.
See if you can find some books to give you idea's for exercises you can do with him in the school.
If the hacking is nice round where he is currently, walk him out in hand. Build a relationship with him. (my babies love this) pop him over some logs and different terrain if you can.

While you are doing this look for a producer locally - go and visit. Have a conversation about your horse, your ability and what you want to achieve. I honestly believe you need help from someone who can teach the horse and then teach you to ride the horse. This time of year show producers often are quieter as owners often take ponies home for the winter after HOYS, so you may find someone with space immediately.

Every horse is different, what your instructor is saying is OK or correct is not OK or correct in your horses eyes. He's been taught in a different way from how your instructor is teaching you to ride, without getting on and trying for herself your instructor is never going to know. I'm sorry but I'm cross on your behalf that she's given you advise to buy a young horse and then refuses to support you.
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I think the instructor that advised her to buy the horse is different to the one currently teaching her at least.

Re the positivity absolutely with time and money but the latter is an issue and with their combined lack of experience currently I’m genuinely worried about the safety of them as a combination.
 
without help this is absolutely not going to work, sorry (written as someone who teaches between 10 and 15 people a week and rides horses for other people also)

if you don't have the muscle memory or core strength to rise to the trot in the same rhythm every single step of every single circle for 10/15 mins and you cant canter and you don't understand what or why tucking his bum under means................. you are not going to understand the nuance/timing required to get anything at all out of groundwork..... do you even understand what groundwork you need to do? how to tie it in to ridden work?

you have to find money in your budget to get help and you will need that help 3 times a week to start ie every time you ride so you dont make more mistakes and un do any good work.

sorry to sound really defeatist but this is by far the biggest problem i see on the yards i go to-people buying horses they do not have the skill set to actually ride and somehow thinking they wont have to pay for help, sorry but its just common sense.
 
Hallo2012 said:
without help this is absolutely not going to work, sorry (written as someone who teaches between 10 and 15 people a week and rides horses for other people also)

if you don't have the muscle memory or core strength to rise to the trot in the same rhythm every single step of every single circle for 10/15 mins and you cant canter and you don't understand what or why tucking his bum under means................. you are not going to understand the nuance/timing required to get anything at all out of groundwork..... do you even understand what groundwork you need to do? how to tie it in to ridden work?

you have to find money in your budget to get help and you will need that help 3 times a week to start ie every time you ride so you dont make more mistakes and un do any good work.

sorry to sound really defeatist but this is by far the biggest problem i see on the yards i go to-people buying horses they do not have the skill set to actually ride and somehow thinking they wont have to pay for help, sorry but its just common sense.
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Sadly this is true.
 
ester said:
I think the instructor that advised her to buy the horse is different to the one currently teaching her at least.

Re the positivity absolutely with time and money but the latter is an issue and with their combined lack of experience currently I’m genuinely worried about the safety of them as a combination.
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I would sadly agree. An lady in her 60's at our yard was in a similar situation, novicey nervous rider and young horse from Ireland. I don't want to be scaremongering but she was badly hurt when the horse took off with her in the school. No malice in horse but immature physically and mentally, scared by unbalanced rider.
 
I had 2 opinions on him being suitable for me 1 from the riding school where I am at and 1 from a previous RI that I am still in touch with. The riding school used to do schooling of horses so should know what they are talking about they don't school them anymore. So I though I had the right horse and the help I may need at the riding school. They offer suggestions and things we can try in our lessons but they will not get on him themselves.
 
Sorry jasmine but you need to sell this horse for your safety and his sake, whoever told you it was suitable get rid of them.

A lot of horses are backed too quickly, put into the deep end market place. Money

Even get on loan something SAFE That you you can walk trot and canter that is suitable for your experience

youve seen how nancy had had to deal with ozzie and what he throws up

Ride any future horse thoroughly before committing

An old horse who will look after you is what you need, I still ride my 25 Yr old, he is great, Christ a 5 Yr old is for a very experienced rider In general who can not only stick on, but knows what to expect, then has the skills to actually train a horse

What you need is a schoolmaster

It's not failure, its re calibrating , horses are tough, it's no picnic a lot of the time, but get it right and away you go

I know it sounds brutal and many will disagree, well you can I'm not bothered!
 
ester said:
I think the instructor that advised her to buy the horse is different to the one currently teaching her at least.

Re the positivity absolutely with time and money but the latter is an issue and with their combined lack of experience currently I’m genuinely worried about the safety of them as a combination.
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Oh OK. I'll put my hackles down - a bit. (my cynical side saw someone taking in mick)

I try to be positive with advise as let's face it most people that come here for advise are already in a pickle and need help to get out of it. I agree that in an ideal world buying an older (even ex riding school pony) would have been better, but here we are.

I don't see that moving yards is likely to be much of a greater expense than livery and lessons at current yard.

Jasmine2023 said:
I had 2 opinions on him being suitable for me 1 from the riding school where I am at and 1 from a previous RI that I am still in touch with. The riding school used to do schooling of horses so should know what they are talking about they don't school them anymore. So I though I had the right horse and the help I may need at the riding school. They offer suggestions and things we can try in our lessons but they will not get on him themselves.
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Will the yard allow someone else to come and ride him for you? you could drop your lessons for a few weeks and use the money to pay a freelancer to get him going for you and then make a plan from there. worse case scenario he'd be in a better position to sell on after some schooling.

What area are you in OP - someone maybe able to recommend a freelancer or yard local to you.
 
Clodagh said:
Come on people show some positivity! This can be fixed with time and effort. Not everyone was born in the saddle.
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I am trying to be positive, but she needs to avert danger she's already hurt herself falling off

She should not be falling off

No true not everyone was born in the saddle, but if you have not got the miles on the clock yourself.....

We all want to see j with the right horse enjoying it instead of being worried about even getting on the thing
 
dorsetladette said:
Oh OK. I'll put my hackles down - a bit. (my cynical side saw someone taking in mick)

I try to be positive with advise as let's face it most people that come here for advise are already in a pickle and need help to get out of it. I agree that in an ideal world buying an older (even ex riding school pony) would have been better, but here we are.

I don't see that moving yards is likely to be much of a greater expense than livery and lessons at current yard.



Will the yard allow someone else to come and ride him for you? you could drop your lessons for a few weeks and use the money to pay a freelancer to get him going for you and then make a plan from there. worse case scenario he'd be in a better position to sell on after some schooling.

What area are you in OP - someone maybe able to recommend a freelancer or yard local to you.
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It's all well and good getting someone to school him on

But it's jasmine that needs to play catch up
 
dorsetladette said:
Oh OK. I'll put my hackles down - a bit. (my cynical side saw someone taking in mick)

I try to be positive with advise as let's face it most people that come here for advise are already in a pickle and need help to get out of it. I agree that in an ideal world buying an older (even ex riding school pony) would have been better, but here we are.

I don't see that moving yards is likely to be much of a greater expense than livery and lessons at current yard.



Will the yard allow someone else to come and ride him for you? you could drop your lessons for a few weeks and use the money to pay a freelancer to get him going for you and then make a plan from there. worse case scenario he'd be in a better position to sell on after some schooling.

What area are you in OP - someone maybe able to recommend a freelancer or yard local to you.
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I think they would allow someone to come and ride him. I live in West Yorkshire would prefer not to give my exact location.
 
This lady would come highly recommended, may be able to help with assessing you both to help you make the decision, works with a simulator which would be very useful, has a great focus on helping the rider (to better help the horse) and then groundwork or ridden work as appropriate. I don't know if she takes on real novices but it's worth looking into it.

Classical Riding | Ravenroyd Equestrian - Liana Upton | Bingley

Training centered around good biomechanics for both horse and rider. Developing a mind body connection for functional movement. In-hand and ridden work for all types of horse always putting the horse first using the French Classical methods of Philippe Karl. Seat training with the riding simulator.
www.riding-simulator.co.uk www.riding-simulator.co.uk

And I would strongly recommend that you start putting your feelers out for information beyond that which the RIs are offering you, this board and a load of FB groups and pages post information which would have helped you decide against a 5 year old, any 5 year old, in your situation rather than only being able to take advice from your RIs.
 
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