TURNERS ABBATOIR - RED LION

amymay said:
I don't think anyone would disagree with you at all.

But as has been said countless times, you have to address the over breeding before you'll address stock going to slaughter.
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I would love to address the over breeding. At the moment I have my heart and passions directed else where.
 
Crazy horse lady said:
Originally Posted by Amaranta
You really are an idiot, I don't debate with idiots, I prefer to debate with someone who is in possession of the facts which you clearly are not. Now off you go back to your facebook page, run along now.

I am referring to this...........
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Which was in response to your rather rude post
 
For someone who is professing to want to debate you have a very strange way of doing so, especially so as on your facebook page you refer to us as nasty people.

You then come on here and preach to the converted, using inflamatory language and asking us to, I quote 'murder our horses at home'

Not a good way to start off on this forum is it?
 
A BBC investigation was told that horses with false papers have been sent to the Red Lion abattoir in Nantwich.

The abattoir's owner said no horse with false paperwork had ever knowingly been slaughtered there.

In a separate investigation, the Food Standards Agency (FSA) said it was looking at "inconsistencies with horse passports" at the slaughterhouse.

Speaking to BBC Northern Ireland's Spotlight programme, a man claiming to be part of a criminal gang said he had delivered horses to the abattoir on "multiple occasions" on forged papers.

He said some horses were unsuitable for human consumption.

The man, who did not want to be named, said: "[The horses] would come from anywhere, everywhere, good, bad or indifferent, it didn't matter.

"A lot of them were bought at farms around the country; people didn't want them any more or couldn't afford them.

"Some of the horses weren't in the best of condition, but to stimulate and get them up on their feet again you'd give them cortisone and Bute injections."
 
Crazy horse lady said:
A BBC investigation was told that horses with false papers have been sent to the Red Lion abattoir in Nantwich.

The abattoir's owner said no horse with false paperwork had ever knowingly been slaughtered there.

In a separate investigation, the Food Standards Agency (FSA) said it was looking at "inconsistencies with horse passports" at the slaughterhouse.

Speaking to BBC Northern Ireland's Spotlight programme, a man claiming to be part of a criminal gang said he had delivered horses to the abattoir on "multiple occasions" on forged papers.

He said some horses were unsuitable for human consumption.

The man, who did not want to be named, said: "[The horses] would come from anywhere, everywhere, good, bad or indifferent, it didn't matter.

"A lot of them were bought at farms around the country; people didn't want them any more or couldn't afford them.

"Some of the horses weren't in the best of condition, but to stimulate and get them up on their feet again you'd give them cortisone and Bute injections."
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I have been following this post, as some have provided some interesting information.
With all due respect I'm not sure even you know what you are trying to achieve, because I certainly am not sure anymore.
This information doesn't tell people anything that hasn't just been discussed which is adding fuel to a fire that people are getting bored of watching burn and your making your argument less and less valid.

As far as I can see no one on this thread has said they are in anyway pleased with what has been shown in the short clips from Red Lion and I have to VERY strongly agree this is a problem that needs to be dealt with within the slaughter houses, not just close the whole lot down! Agree there needs to be tighter regulations, and more closely monitored procedures within our abbatiors. However, this involves more time and money so how this can be done I do not know.

As someone who lived practically next door to Spindles Farm and helplessly witnessed the whole hideous thing this is a subject that means a lot to me, as we watched truck loads of horses taken past out house every day knowing exactly where they were headed. But if the slaughter houses were closed there would have been a hell of a lot more dead and dying horses found there. As there would be all over the country.
 
Did you know that you can ring Hillside animal sanctuary and ask them to post collection boxes? The monies donated are gratefully accepted and used to feed horses (as well as other animals) that they have rescued either from neglect, rescued from slaughter or from competing and racing yards.
 
Crazy horse lady said:
Did you know that you can ring Hillside animal sanctuary and ask them to post collection boxes? The monies donated are gratefully accepted and used to feed horses (as well as other animals) that they have rescued either from neglect, rescued from slaughter or from competing and racing yards.
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..Mmmm....:rolleyes:

'Rescued from competing and racing yards'?! Please could you explain why horses need 'rescuing' from such things?:confused:
 
Emma86 said:
I have been following this post, as some have provided some interesting information.
With all due respect I'm not sure even you know what you are trying to achieve, because I certainly am not sure anymore.
This information doesn't tell people anything that hasn't just been discussed which is adding fuel to a fire that people are getting bored of watching burn and your making your argument less and less valid.

As far as I can see no one on this thread has said they are in anyway pleased with what has been shown in the short clips from Red Lion and I have to VERY strongly agree this is a problem that needs to be dealt with within the slaughter houses, not just close the whole lot down! Agree there needs to be tighter regulations, and more closely monitored procedures within our abbatiors. However, this involves more time and money so how this can be done I do not know.


As someone who lived practically next door to Spindles Farm and helplessly witnessed the whole hideous thing this is a subject that means a lot to me, as we watched truck loads of horses taken past out house every day knowing exactly where they were headed. But if the slaughter houses were closed there would have been a hell of a lot more dead and dying horses found there. As there would be all over the country.
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I joined this after seeing the first couple of posts. I thought you were all, being horse lovers, into the idea that Turners should be prosecuted, after seeing the footage and abuse, and the abuse of other horses. We need horse slaughter houses and we need to promote the need to stop over breeding horses, who, if not good enough, will end up in a sorry state.
 
Moomin1 said:
..Mmmm....:rolleyes:

'Rescued from competing and racing yards'?! Please could you explain why horses need 'rescuing' from such things?:confused:
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Horses who are excessively bred for the perfect racing horse or the perfect competing horse and then flippantly sold for meat, or sold on and on, or given away to people who have no clue. Not the ones who are doing well and are obviously treated like kings and queens, and kept to the end of their days at their faithful masters homes.
 
Death may be inevitable but cruelty is not. If we must eat meat, then we must ensure that the animals we kill for our food live the best possible lives before they die.....D Morris 1928
 
Did you know that you can send your old toner cartridges to Hillside animal sanctuary and they can recycle them and all monies go to buying food for the animals they rescue.
 
Crazy horse lady said:
Horses who are excessively bred for the perfect racing horse or the perfect competing horse and then flippantly sold for meat, or sold on and on, or given away to people who have no clue. Not the ones who are doing well and are obviously treated like kings and queens, and kept to the end of their days at their faithful masters homes.
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See, there you go again! Why is stopping a horse being slaughtered for meat 'rescuing them'?! You repeatedly make out that it's 'cruel' to send horses for slaughter. You base this on one slaughterhouse's failings.

I also would not donate to Hillside.
 
Other horse charities, collecting boxes and donated ink cartridges are available ;)

Another who wouldn't donate to hillside. I support several other well known equine charities.
 
No, we just, like most informed people, believe that there is a worse fate for unwanted horses than being humanely killed. Being bought in large batches and kept in a garage by people with no money or sense, for instance.

To owner of Red Lion does need to be prosecuted if they have broken guidelines. But banning all horse slaughter would be a step backwards for horse welfare.
 
If by a diffetent breed of 'horse lover' you mean someone who follows the party lines of the BHS, World Horse Welfare and Redwings, supports those charities who operate within the law, won't be won over by claims based on unavailable evidence, and who sees the bigger picture and the place that humane slaughter has in it then yes, call me a different breed of 'horse lover' in inverted commas and shout it from the rooftops.
 
Crazy horse lady said:
P.S. if you are a Cheshire lass like me, you will have heard of the grim goings on at Turners. These stories are years old. Hence the tip off to Hillside to go through the trouble of putting the cameras in there. Even if the place is not shut down at least it may educate some ppl into the reality of horse slaughter. And help them understand there is an alternative to the "knackers yard".
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Crazy horse lady I have a some questions for you.

1: If you as a Cheshire Lass have heard about grim things going on at Turners years ago, did you report it to any Authorities, RSPCA (if so would be interested to know who and what was done).

2: On this quote you want to educate people into the reality of horse slaughter and understand that there is an alternative to the knackers yard. Well I not quite sure how you are going to educate people on horse slaughter as some time ago I mentioned about you going into a abattoir for a day and the answer was something like why would I want to! You stated you have seen things good and bad on the net? I am afraid that does not qualify you to be able to 'educate' people in the slaughter of horses or any animal. I am not disputing there were some breeches on the Turners Hillside Video, myself and others have agreed it need addressing and im sure it will be.

3: One moment ie, this quote you come over as being against horse slaughter, now recently you agree with it:confused:

4: Hillside, while I take my hat off to them for exposing things (have seen other things like the horrendous farm, and the Dairy Cattle) I do as I said before worry a little for the persons who are actually going onto premises (for their personal safety) again, were authorities or some of the main welfare organisations informed, if so and nothing was done THEY also need highlighting for doing nothing as we are paying for the authorities to act when something reported and many are donating to some of the large welfare 'Charities' if they are turning a blind eye ask why publicly.
How many are Hillside planning on 'rescuing'? they seem to be crying out for donations already.

To finish, I am a horse lover, and I feel there is a need for horse abattoirs, as I have said many, many times, done properly it is a peaceful end to any animal, whether bred for meat or not, and I do actually think (as much as it galls me about what has happened) IF Turners stays open people should work with them to make sure there is no repeat of what has gone on, it is a much needed service. IF it closes I hope another one opens to replace it (properly monitored of course).

As I have worked in an abattoir (not a horse one, but have visited the other one nr. Taunton a few times) for the last 20 years I think I am able to comment in an informed way as to what goes on in most abattoirs.

We cannot rescue them all!
 
Crazy horse lady said:
Wow, you really are a different breed of "Horse lovers".
:(
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Yet more narrow mindedness.

So we are a 'different breed of horse lover' because we choose not to donate to Hillside? :rolleyes:

I spend my entire life rescuing the horses which really need to be rescued - severely neglected and abused ones. Not ones which are simply being sold for slaughter.

Turners need prosecuting. They need monitoring much more closely, as do all slaughterhouses. But I do not blindly blanket them all with the same insinuation of cruelty, or for one second think that it's 'cruel' to send horses to slaughter. I also find it quite irritating when people say they 'rescued' a horse from slaughter. No, they didn't 'rescue' it. The horse did not know it was going to be slaughtered. The people merely 'bought' the horse to prevent it from being slaughtered. Not one animal which I have shot in a slaughterhouse looked remotely distressed and not once did I see any bad treatment of the animals by staff.
 
I think there should be a mass cull. Get the army in, just like during foot and mouth.

Then try and stop the overbreeding.. I do not have the answer for how we do that though.
 
I, for one, do support Hillside. They have done some very good work in bringing to the attention, of the general public, the atrocities that occur at markets, abattoirs and illegal slaughter houses. Whilst we all wish for legal and humane slaughter for all animals, including equines, it does not always happen. Highlighting illegal and cruel actions will benefit all animals and ultimately lead to increased confidence by the general public and horse owners. Horse and other farm animal slaughter does not have to be cruel. It can be carried out with calmness and quiet efficiency. This will lead to Humane Slaughter, which I am sure we will all welcome. However, in order to achieve this there must be safeguards in place - cctv is a proven method of achieving regulation and must help to weed out the "bad apples" and prevent abuse. This should lead to accountability. Any method of highlighting a problem and bringing it to our attention which ultimately will lead to improvements in handling and slaughter of animals must be welcomed. We must not shut our eyes to this problem or bicker amongst ourselves but stand united and present a concise case.
 
dalesponydiva said:
I, for one, do support Hillside. They have done some very good work in bringing to the attention, of the general public, the atrocities that occur at markets, abattoirs and illegal slaughter houses. Whilst we all wish for legal and humane slaughter for all animals, including equines, it does not always happen. Highlighting illegal and cruel actions will benefit all animals and ultimately lead to increased confidence by the general public and horse owners. Horse and other farm animal slaughter does not have to be cruel. It can be carried out with calmness and quiet efficiency. This will lead to Humane Slaughter, which I am sure we will all welcome. However, in order to achieve this there must be safeguards in place - cctv is a proven method of achieving regulation and must help to weed out the "bad apples" and prevent abuse. This should lead to accountability. Any method of highlighting a problem and bringing it to our attention which ultimately will lead to improvements in handling and slaughter of animals must be welcomed. We must not shut our eyes to this problem or bicker amongst ourselves but stand united and present a concise case.
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I agree, especially the bit about all animals, I think you will find that most people on here would agree with you.

Sadly when someone posts incorrect facts in a hysterical manner (not you btw) and then insults people who are actually on the same side, they will be treated with the derision they quite frankly deserve, that sort of person does nothing for the cause they are 'supporting'.
 
Like I said, a massive cull is required to get this back to a manageable number of horses.

Then we can start again in a controlled manner.
 
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