Crackajack
Well-Known Member
This was a typical H&H thread...full of arguing! 
I have had several Two Mills horses come onto my old competition yard where the owner had bought them - few teething problems but nothing major...
Two Mills Sport Horse dealers
- Thread starter harrypotter
- Start date
This was a typical H&H thread...full of arguing! I have had several Two Mills horses come onto my old competition yard where the owner had bought them - few teething problems but nothing major...
cptrayes
Well-Known Member
Carolyn, you are incorrect about the law. Completely wrong, in fact. You seem to have written from a very emotional standpoint as if I have attacked friends of yours. Let's keep this to the facts, shall we?
The point was that the horse was not suitable for an extremely capable 5 foot 6 inch nearly eleven year old who had been riding a sharp pony for years, and that in consumer law the buyers were entitled to a refund. That refund was difficult to obtain. I have no problem that they sold the horse but the law clearly states that if it is not fit for purpose, which it was clear within days that it was not, then the buyer is entitled to a no-quibble refund. Not an exchange, a REFUND. "no-quibble" could not describe our experience at that time, which is now over two years ago and things may well now be completely different.
This is the benefit of buying through a dealer. Consumer law is all on the side of the buyer. It is not necessary for the seller to know that they are selling an animal which is unfit for purpose. It is not necessary for the horse to have behaved badly with them. It can have been a complete angel the whole time that they had it. But the law says that if it behaves badly with the new owner and is not fit for purpose, then the buyer has a right to a refund.
As regards the child and my advice to them, she went on to buy a bigger and stronger horse which had been broken for 6 months, whose canter transitions and canter itself were not established. She's currently jumping him at 1m 10 and has won nearly all her dressage and equitation classes this season.
I repeat what I said at the time, that Two Mills are the better end of the dealer market and have nice horses at reasonable prices.
The point was that the horse was not suitable for an extremely capable 5 foot 6 inch nearly eleven year old who had been riding a sharp pony for years, and that in consumer law the buyers were entitled to a refund. That refund was difficult to obtain. I have no problem that they sold the horse but the law clearly states that if it is not fit for purpose, which it was clear within days that it was not, then the buyer is entitled to a no-quibble refund. Not an exchange, a REFUND. "no-quibble" could not describe our experience at that time, which is now over two years ago and things may well now be completely different.
This is the benefit of buying through a dealer. Consumer law is all on the side of the buyer. It is not necessary for the seller to know that they are selling an animal which is unfit for purpose. It is not necessary for the horse to have behaved badly with them. It can have been a complete angel the whole time that they had it. But the law says that if it behaves badly with the new owner and is not fit for purpose, then the buyer has a right to a refund.
As regards the child and my advice to them, she went on to buy a bigger and stronger horse which had been broken for 6 months, whose canter transitions and canter itself were not established. She's currently jumping him at 1m 10 and has won nearly all her dressage and equitation classes this season.
I repeat what I said at the time, that Two Mills are the better end of the dealer market and have nice horses at reasonable prices.
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TopTotty
Well-Known Member
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Not wishing to start an argument, i'd just prefer it it you didn't tar all dealers with the same brush. Why not say 'maybe if Two Mills took the time to match horses' instead of saying it at me, which is how your reply comes across.
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I think your doing a good job of starting an argument by yourself and giving yourself a bad name in the process!!
I only read so far down and I am already fed up with your attitude! I only wish I was as good as you think you are!
No need to reply as I will not be re visiting.
Not wishing to start an argument, i'd just prefer it it you didn't tar all dealers with the same brush. Why not say 'maybe if Two Mills took the time to match horses' instead of saying it at me, which is how your reply comes across.
Quote
I think your doing a good job of starting an argument by yourself and giving yourself a bad name in the process!!
I only read so far down and I am already fed up with your attitude! I only wish I was as good as you think you are!
No need to reply as I will not be re visiting.
CarolynDelve
New User
As expected ... heated response obtained ... good work cptrayes
First off cptrayes .. i am unaware of dates as simply came through on a search engine on my iphone and tbh i dont see theres an issue regarding ehen someone can post a comment or not.
I do not know Two Mills nor John Johnson personally whatsoever.
I do however know the dealings of the law exchange/refund and this is why a refund would be given .. i did state that this would not necessarily mean it was morally correct nor that many people would agree however that is why we have Consumer Rights and trading standards as you are aware.
No two horses are the same and as our new urchase may have been bigger and stronger it does not account for his/her personality and trainability ... all things which should be considered when going to a sport horse dealer and buying a newly broken 4yo.
Again ... as entitled and stated ... this was my opinion when i stumbled across this thread and im entitled to it =)
First off cptrayes .. i am unaware of dates as simply came through on a search engine on my iphone and tbh i dont see theres an issue regarding ehen someone can post a comment or not.
I do not know Two Mills nor John Johnson personally whatsoever.
I do however know the dealings of the law exchange/refund and this is why a refund would be given .. i did state that this would not necessarily mean it was morally correct nor that many people would agree however that is why we have Consumer Rights and trading standards as you are aware.
No two horses are the same and as our new urchase may have been bigger and stronger it does not account for his/her personality and trainability ... all things which should be considered when going to a sport horse dealer and buying a newly broken 4yo.
Again ... as entitled and stated ... this was my opinion when i stumbled across this thread and im entitled to it =)
CarolynDelve
New User
haha <3 JeniBall's comment ... 'no need to reply as I will not be revisiting' ... i agree ... i came, i commented, i stand by my statements, goodbye all ....
martlin
Well-Known Member
Quote
Not wishing to start an argument, i'd just prefer it it you didn't tar all dealers with the same brush. Why not say 'maybe if Two Mills took the time to match horses' instead of saying it at me, which is how your reply comes across.
Quote
I think your doing a good job of starting an argument by yourself and giving yourself a bad name in the process!!
I only read so far down and I am already fed up with your attitude! I only wish I was as good as you think you are!
No need to reply as I will not be re visiting.
Somehow, I don't think Starman will be replying any time soon, judging by the colour their forum name is being displayed in
Honey08
Waffled a lot!
Why? Is it black for baddies? lol.
cptrayes
Well-Known Member
Oh Carolyn 
There was nothing whatseover heated in my reply. It was a measured and unemotional response to what you wrote. I would like to point out that I did not start this thread, I replied to someone else's request for information about Two Mills and gave an honest and straightforward account of a (then) recent personal experience. The original post was a loooooong time ago now and it's a surprise to be discussing it again.
You suggested that we had threatened them into a refund
"You wee [sic] offered an exchange ... as you and I both know that is what they are obligated to give you on the spot and I suspect you have threatened them with court action to reap the money back."
and I responded pointing out that we had done no such thing, because there was no need as the law was entirely on our side.
I have made no suggestion that you should not have posted and I have no idea where you got that from.
I can assure you that the second horse that was bought for the child was considerably more difficult to ride than the horse which was bought from Two Mills was at the time of purchase. On the two occasions, totalling two hours, that the child rode it before it was bought it behaved impeccably with established transitions, a balanced walk, trot and canter and a nice pop.
The behaviour on moving homes was unexpected by all concerned, but it was given several days to settle before being lunged and ridden by professional breakers in a big livery yard, resulting in the pro jockey refusing to get on it. Whether it would have come right in time is irrelevant as it had by then totally destroyed everyone's confidence in it and the situation was irrecoverable. We requested, and received with ill grace after sticking to our guns, the refund to which the family were entitled by law when buying through a dealer. But as I say, you have dredged up a thread which is two years old and everything may have changed by now.
It's for exactly this consumer protection that you pay more when you buy from a dealer, and in situations like this it's worth its weight in gold. I repeat, Two Mills are at the better end of the dealer market. They have a range of nice horses at decent prices and are worth a visit.
There was nothing whatseover heated in my reply. It was a measured and unemotional response to what you wrote. I would like to point out that I did not start this thread, I replied to someone else's request for information about Two Mills and gave an honest and straightforward account of a (then) recent personal experience. The original post was a loooooong time ago now and it's a surprise to be discussing it again.
You suggested that we had threatened them into a refund
"You wee [sic] offered an exchange ... as you and I both know that is what they are obligated to give you on the spot and I suspect you have threatened them with court action to reap the money back."
and I responded pointing out that we had done no such thing, because there was no need as the law was entirely on our side.
I have made no suggestion that you should not have posted and I have no idea where you got that from.
I can assure you that the second horse that was bought for the child was considerably more difficult to ride than the horse which was bought from Two Mills was at the time of purchase. On the two occasions, totalling two hours, that the child rode it before it was bought it behaved impeccably with established transitions, a balanced walk, trot and canter and a nice pop.
The behaviour on moving homes was unexpected by all concerned, but it was given several days to settle before being lunged and ridden by professional breakers in a big livery yard, resulting in the pro jockey refusing to get on it. Whether it would have come right in time is irrelevant as it had by then totally destroyed everyone's confidence in it and the situation was irrecoverable. We requested, and received with ill grace after sticking to our guns, the refund to which the family were entitled by law when buying through a dealer. But as I say, you have dredged up a thread which is two years old and everything may have changed by now.
It's for exactly this consumer protection that you pay more when you buy from a dealer, and in situations like this it's worth its weight in gold. I repeat, Two Mills are at the better end of the dealer market. They have a range of nice horses at decent prices and are worth a visit.
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Donkey66
Well-Known Member
The Rip Van Winkle thread. If no-one has cared for a year what's brought it back to life?
JanetGeorge
Well-Known Member
It happens regularly. Someone with 'an interest' in a particular dealer (either the dealer or a friend) does a search on his name or his business name and finds .... shock, horror ... thred that might be deemed slightly critical.So they join and resurrect the thread - madly defending the dealer and insulting anyone who has dared criticise the dealer. Then they disappear from whence they came!
Spit That Out
Well-Known Member
They bought my friends horse off her and gave her a good price for him. They let her go and see their yard and their horses so she felt reassured that he wasn't going to some grotty yard!!
I know that it's different to buying off them but i think its good to see a dealer that cares what the customer/client thinks.
I'm not saying that they are perfect but i don't think there are many dealers that are...everyone has good and bad stories about who they have brought horses from. There are always people who think they got a bad deal, horse isn't what they wanted or they were fleeced but there are plenty of people who have great experiences and find the horse of their dreams.
Go and see the horse and make your mind up after seeing him...go with your gut feeling.
I know that it's different to buying off them but i think its good to see a dealer that cares what the customer/client thinks.
I'm not saying that they are perfect but i don't think there are many dealers that are...everyone has good and bad stories about who they have brought horses from. There are always people who think they got a bad deal, horse isn't what they wanted or they were fleeced but there are plenty of people who have great experiences and find the horse of their dreams.
Go and see the horse and make your mind up after seeing him...go with your gut feeling.
cyberhorse
Well-Known Member
So they join and resurrect the thread - madly defending the dealer and insulting anyone who has dared criticise the dealer. Then they disappear from whence they came!
Ah, so there is someone as cynical as me!
wizbit
Well-Known Member
Agree
jester_ben
Well-Known Member
Ok, not that I have had any experiences with them, but to other dealers, there quiet straight forward. Most of there photos of horses show, free schooled, in the school being ridden, outside/hacking, and jumping/cross country. (Any thoughts on Humphrey?
)
lannerch
Well-Known Member
I too being also of a cynic nature particualry noticing the resurrector is a newbie suspect they may have more connections than they let on.
However if this is the case would it not be better to keep this slightly critical post hidden in the archive covered in cob webs and forgotton!
However if this is the case would it not be better to keep this slightly critical post hidden in the archive covered in cob webs and forgotton!