Tying horses to the metal ring...

[SuperCat007]

What do you think of this?

I went to a riding school for a lesson for the first time today, hoping to do some instructor training and when I went to groom my horse there was nowhere to tie it. So I went to get the instructor of the lesson, she told me there was a ring under the window, I found it but there was no bailer twine on it. I asked her and she said 'we don't use bailer twine here because our horses are trained to not pull back'

I was completely shocked! I am going to mention it when I go next week, but this is somewhere that is teaching people stable management and riding skills, even NVQ's!

What are people's opinions, am I being overcautious?!

Sorry if this is the wrong place to post.

 

[KWPN1988]

That is ridiculous, every horse can panic and to have it tied to something which will not give in the event of a panic only means something else has to, I assume it will have to be the head collar, wall, rope, etc. All this means is if something happens it is going to be a lot more serious than necessary and especially in a place where you have novices around horses this is really ridiculous! Everything should be tied to twine and the twine should not be full strength it should be weakened by cutting a few strands as twine is even too strong. Whatever you are tying to be it a horse to a ring on a wall, post, etc. it should be certain that the twine is going to be the first thing that gives way in an accident. All horses can spook even the most docile and their flight instinct means they will get away regardless of what they have to break to get to that safe place! Can't beleive this place is an education establishment! My haynets are tied to twine too rather than to a ring as I have seen the damage getting stuck in a haynet overnight and being stuck with the leg in the air whilst struggling to get free can do to a horse, I would rather the net fall than to have the horse trapped like that.

 

[jenniferharland]

Can't beleive this place is an education establishment!

couldn't agree more! this yard should be setting an example for all of the less experienceced, for horse ownership in the future. another pet hate of mine is leaving a horse tied up and keeping a head colar on around the horse's neck while getting their bridle put on.. the safe way would be to just thread the lead rope through the twine so the horse can pull back without causing any damage to their poll.

 

[nikicb]

What are people's opinions, am I being overcautious?!

I am the same as you in that I will not tie direct to the ring. I don't use baler twine anymore unless it is thinned but use safety ties instead. However I regularly ride in the US and the horses are trained to be tied direct to the posts there. I guess it's what you and the horses are used to, but I would not personally tie direct to something fixed.

My haynets are tied to twine too rather than to a ring as I have seen the damage getting stuck in a haynet overnight and being stuck with the leg in the air whilst struggling to get free can do to a horse, I would rather the net fall than to have the horse trapped like that.

Better still, don't use haynets and feed from the floor, which is (a) more natural and better for the horse and (b) safer.

 

[Maesfen]

I always tie direct to the ring but the horses are always taught to tie up properly from the very first place; it's using thin string that teaches them they can get away if they pull back which so many do these days; I like my horses to have manners and behave themselves BUT I will never use nylon headcollars for tying up, they are the work of Satan; always use leather which will break in an emergency.

 

[Cinnamontoast]

I'd expect bailing twine. My SIL mentioned this to her neighours when they tied the horse directly to a fence. When the horse reared up and yanked the post out they finally listened!

 

[MillionDollar]

Agree with Maesfen! All of mine are taught in the first place to never pull back. Yes any horse can panic but most baler twine doesn't snap anyway. Like above always use leather headcollars. If a horse has been taught to tie up in the first place there shouldn't be a problem.

 

[Enfys]

I am with Maesfen and MillionDollar on this.

Tying is a bit of a soap box issue for me.

Phoenix is five weeks old and has been 'tying' for several weeks now. I never tie horses to the bars but they are very useful for starting foals off. He understands the principal of giving to pressure which is a major factor in a horse tying safely, he is also learning patience. His dam is ground tied behind him.

Horses are generally tied off too low, and too long as well, getting a leg over a line or a head under are often why horses flip, if they are tied correctly they can't do either of those things.

In my barn I do actually have breakaway ties for my liveries because they aren't my horses I would rather they pulled back and ran off than took half my barn with them possibly killing themselves in the process. I do not use a loop of baler twine by itself though, stupid stuff, it only tightens around a rope, I thread (hairy) twine through a length of hose pipe to form a rigid loop and then tie it off to eye bolts.

Outside and in the paddocks we have hitching posts with tie rings in (double as very good scratching posts too) The hitching posts are 8' railway sleepers, sunk 3' down and concreted in. They don't budge an inch.

 

[Shay]

Teaching horses to tie properly is important - but SuperCat is talking about a riding school here. I don't know which school - and quite right too - but I can imagine the type of scenario. Even the best trained horses can become disturbed in the busy environment that most riding schools have. Add into the mix less expereinced riders, often younger helpers etc.....

If the school is accredited I wonder if it is worth chatting to the BHS. I would certainly expect horses tied up to something that breaks - bailer twine on the ring, bailer twine between the lead rope and the halter, an equi ping or something. I don't think I've ever seen a riding school using leather headcollars either.

 

[AengusOg]

So. the question is...would it be better for horses to be tied solid, with no chance of breaking loose, or to be tied to 'weak' baler twine, with the chance of breaking loose.

Loose horses can create problems, especially where there are other horses tied, or where there are lots of vulnerable people around. I was at a yard recently where a pony broke loose. Another pony, tied nearby, started prancing, rearing, and attempting to follow the breakaway, which had exited the building through a narrow doorway. Two juvenile persons got involved...one went through the doorway after the breakaway, whilst the other went to the remaining pony.

The girl who was in the doorway could have been in danger had the other pony broken away, and the other girl got her fingers hurt in her attempts to free the rope from the baler twine to which it was tied, and her shoulder hurt as the pony came round and pushed her into the wall.

How would that one pan out in an insurance enquiry, I wonder?

Even the way some people tie the rope to the twine is highly dangerous. Pulling the rope through the tie, then tying it off, can, in the event of an emergency, especially if the horse is pulling away as the person attempts to release it, cause injury to hands or fingers. The safer way with twine tying is to put a loop of the rope through the twine, then twist it a turn and take the long end in a loop through the loop created. This method means that a person can merely pull the long end of the rope and it comes away without having to be pulled through the twine. Even if a horse is pulling, with this method, the person only has to give a sharp tug and has the horse in hand, without danger from injury.

Many yards are guilty of bad practice(s). You just have to decide whether you want to take risks there, or keep your money in your pocket while you look elsewhere.

I tie to the ring (I'm not a riding school) but, like others' horses on here, mine are taught to yield to pressure and to stand tied.

 

[SmartieBean09]

I had a pony with the most impeccable manners who would stand quietly all day if you let her! I always used to tie to baling twine but one day tied straight to the metal ring. Didn't think anything of it, chance of pony pulling back was slim! However on this day, after I gave her a bit of a fuss and groom. I walked off to get her tack. All of a sudden I heard screaming, I came running round to see my Mum and other liveries crying and screaming. After I had made a fuss of Jamin, for some reason she reared up. Her hind legs slipped from underneath her and she fell. The leadrope couldn't break free and as she was tied up with a haynet (also tied to the metal) she had got caught in the net and was wedged under a gap in the wall she was tied to (she had also managed to squish my mum against the wall at one point too) It took, 3 men to free her and She couldn't stand and we all feared the worst. Luckily vet checked her over and she only had superficial wounds but huge lesson learnt and I will never, ever tie to a metal ring again! Perfect mannered pony or not, we have no control 100% of the time but we do have a responsibility and Jamins injuries that day were my fault.

 

[Pale Rider]

I have to say that I don't tie to a solid ring, nor do I use baler twine.

I train my horses to accept ropes over their neck, round their legs etc without
getting stressed.

I use 12 foot lead ropes and just thread them through the ring and expect them to stand.

If they are going to break away from baler twine, they will. If its fixed they will either break their neck or the head collar.

 

[connieconvert]

Ooooh I bet the staff are glad you've turned up to point out the errors of their ways.

When you have done your training and set up your own yard then you can tie your horses up how you like.

Seems from the other posts that there are two schools of thought on tying up and both seem to work for the respective posters.

 

[Kat]

With private horses it is obviously up to individuals what they do, but this is a riding school and some form of risk assessment is required. Nothing is risk free but they need to minimise the risks.

I can see the arguement that they don't want horses to be able to get loose easily if startled as a loose horse is a risk but if i read the OP correctly this horse was tied in a stable, therefore the horse cannot get loose and cause an accident even if it breaks its tie. On that basis I think the safe option would be to have a breakaway tie. The horses may be well trained but they are being handled by novices who may do something to cause the horse to panic or may tie too long or low and allow the horse to get a foot over the rope etc. Further the risk of a horse panicking and not getting free in a confined space with a novice handler present is significant.

If the horse is being tied up on the yard then there are different considerations. The risk of a frightened horse loose amongst members of the public needs to be considered, but I still think that the risk is potentially greater if the horse panics and can't get free. A horse thrashing around in a panic can cause injuries to those nearby and to those trying to help it. Considering the realtive risks if I was a riding school manager I think my preference would be to design my yard so that there is a tie up point for washing off/trimming/grooming etc that was enclosed away from members of the public so that a breakaway tie could safely be used with minimum risk. If this was not possible I think I would want a tie that is more easily released than just rope to metal ring, but perhaps not as easily broken as some of the commercial breakaway ties. So that a horse is unlikely to breakaway out of mischeif but is likely to be easily freed in a genuine emergency.

I do like Enfys tie up rings, great idea!

 

[K27]

As people have said above, yes I do expect my horses to tye up calmly with manners, -however horses are unpredictable, and accidents can happen in the blink of an eye which is why i always use the newer breakaway tyes or a bit of thinned down baler twine. I always like to use leather headcollars too, and if something did make the horse pull back i'd rather them be able to pull back and get away or break their headcollar (and it has happened!), rather than them break their neck or injure themselves.

I would/could not tye straight to the metal rings just in case something happened, and don't get me started on having seen people that tye up their horse wearing chifneys!

 

[AmyMay]

Chances are the lead rope will break before the bailer twine, so I wouldn't be terribly concerned tbh.

 

[supagran]

On our yard most of the liveries tie up either to the metal railing or using thick baler twine (doubled!) to headcollars. OR which is even worse, I've seen horses tied using lead reins to their bits and then to the doubled baler twine or the metal railing - round the yard we have concrete panels which are about 2 feet high then a gap of about another 2 feet then a round metal rail- I cringe every time I see it. One of our horses has a habit of stretching and putting one of her front legs onto the top of the concrete panel and I have visions of her getting stuck and snapping her leg, so I won't tie her up there at all!

 

[Enfys]

I have to say that I don't tie to a solid ring, nor do I use baler twine.

I train my horses to accept ropes over their neck, round their legs etc without
getting stressed.

.

Doesn't everyone? My foals look like bondage victims sometimes, I wrap bandages around their bodies, let them walk about with ropes on , leave ropes on the floor etc.

 

[Aoibhin]

i dont tie up but leave long rope passed though, the boy is too scared of his own shadow to move & big lass has too many manners.
if i need to go get anything i will pop them back into stable for a min or so.

when we are out in horsebox i have safety leads that clip straight onto the ring but have thier own breakaway clip

 

[Pale Rider]

Doesn't everyone? My foals look like bondage victims sometimes, I wrap bandages around their bodies, let them walk about with ropes on , leave ropes on the floor etc.

Nice foal Enfys

 

[Tinks81]

I think there are a lot of differences between how you do things for NVQ and what we all do in the real world !!!

personally i do tie to the metal but make sure the knot will come un done completely with one pull and always use quick release leadropes too

 

[Enfys]

Nice foal Enfys

Thankyou

He is a bit of a "I'll do it my way or not at all" character, and was not at all amused at the time.

 

[IsabelleJ]

I know of one horse that was tied to a ring set in the door frame of a stable. He was tied to baler twine, but full strength twine. He pulled back, pulled the stable door off, and charged around the yard with stable door attached to him. I believe he injured his back quite badly and had to have 6 months off.

I have several equi-pings attached to my trailer, and if I do use twine, it is thinned. My horse always wears a leather headcollar, especially when travelling or in the field.

Isabelle

 

[Nugget La Poneh]

I tie to the ring direct, but use a knot that if the horse pulls it comes undone (a bit too easily sometimes). I have seen too many situations where the horse has pulled back, groom/owner has pulled the rope to release and because the twine is under pressure the rope is trapped in the twine.

Plastic twine is nasty stuff if not thinned down.

I wouldn't be overly concerned if a RS school doesn't have twine on the rings. What would bother me more is them allowing the general public to tie up horses (unless said general public has already proved their capabilities in tying up a horse)...

 

[martlin]

Tying horses to things they can get away from easily is a very British thing, which I never quite understood. I do have an array of snap ties and stuff for my liveries to use, but my horses get tied up to solid, unmovable objects, as the idea of tying a horse up is for it to stay put In a real emergency/panic situation, I find that leadrope clips snap quick enough.

 

[irish_only]

Another one here that ties direct to the ring. If we had a real emergency then we have a trusty very sharp knife that will cut through the rope.
I've never yet been able to quick release a rope tied through baler twine, even the loop through method as described which is how I tie, as the pressure tightens the knot anyway.
I really can't be doing with rude horses that think that one good tug or battle equals letting them go.

 

[Kallibear]

but my horses get tied up to solid, unmovable objects, as the idea of tying a horse up is for it to stay put

Ditto. I want my horse to stay where I left it! I often tie up to trees or lampposts briefly and the last thing I want is the horse to pull free and run off

Mine are all happy to tie and do not panic at the feeling of being restricted. I would not do it to a horse I didn't know as some horses have never been taught properly and will panic. I also know plenty of horse who have learnt that they just need to tug their rope and the twine snaps and they came wander off as they wish (usually to the nearest piece of grass ).

I've always found the leadrope clip the the clip or the headcollar (the one at the cheek) snaps if they really fight.

I do however always use a snappable tie if the object they are tied to isn't utterly solid and may break and come with them if they pull (fencing stobs, metal gates etc)

When he's tied up like this that LAST thing I want is his tie to snap! (although it's not usually allowed to be so long!)

 

[Tnavas]

I am with Maesfen and MillionDollar on this.

Tying is a bit of a soap box issue for me.

Phoenix is five weeks old and has been 'tying' for several weeks now. I never tie horses to the bars but they are very useful for starting foals off. He understands the principal of giving to pressure which is a major factor in a horse tying safely, he is also learning patience. His dam is ground tied behind him.

Horses are generally tied off too low, and too long as well, getting a leg over a line or a head under are often why horses flip, if they are tied correctly they can't do either of those things.

In my barn I do actually have breakaway ties for my liveries because they aren't my horses I would rather they pulled back and ran off than took half my barn with them possibly killing themselves in the process. I do not use a loop of baler twine by itself though, stupid stuff, it only tightens around a rope, I thread (hairy) twine through a length of hose pipe to form a rigid loop and then tie it off to eye bolts.

Outside and in the paddocks we have hitching posts with tie rings in (double as very good scratching posts too) The hitching posts are 8' railway sleepers, sunk 3' down and concreted in. They don't budge an inch.

Love your idea to thread string through a piece of hose pipe. I'm in two minds, mine have all been taught to tie with a bum rope so tie up well and much of the time I don't worry about string. I do use it at shows though because of the excitement factor and the idiots that race around up your horses bum!

One place I worked at had the string loops on the head collar and would clip the rope to the piece of string

 

[Jesstickle]

I solid tie as well I'm afraid. I don't want my horse to learn it can piss off whenever it wants!

Besides, a leadrope will break if they really want to break them. I know, I have one that does it for fun (wasn't taught to tie up until it was a hulking great 5 yo )

Nitty will stand tied anywhere for as long as you leave her there pretty much. She might fidget a bit but she never pulls back. She knows the rules!

 

[Jesstickle]

I always tie direct to the ring but the horses are always taught to tie up properly from the very first place; it's using thin string that teaches them they can get away if they pull back which so many do these days; I like my horses to have manners and behave themselves BUT I will never use nylon headcollars for tying up, they are the work of Satan; always use leather which will break in an emergency.

What a surprise, you already said what I wanted to say. Should read answers before replying