Uh oh! Cost of my horse is spiralling out of Control!

Ditto the other comments about yards that include hay/bedding in the cost as this would surely be of benefit to you. A friend of mine pays per week or month for ad lib hay, which with her giant of a horse is good for her, but I would be seriously out of pcoket with my little fat native - if it was more than about £4 per week!
 
Yep, I've just done a quick reckoner on my costs and it comes to £696 per month (winter cost) including insurance (expensive for new boy because I have LOU on him, and includes tack and personal accident as extra, and I also pay for a 3rd horse who is out on loan to someone - so insurance comes to £116 per month in total)

So to pay that out on one horse is pretty high cost!
 
he has Alfa oil as high in protein for muscles and he works hard!
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I don't take the diet he's on as one that is correct for a horse in hard work. You're basically feeding chaff with oil in.

Why not look at feeding him a correct / balanced diet that reflects correctly the amount of work and type of work he is in? That alone should cut costs.....
 
I have just done a rough calculation. I keep 4 horses on DIY. Without dentist or back person but including shows and estimated vets fees - including a contingency - mine cost about £1300 a month.

That is for 3 thoroughbreds - one who events, one who is a fun horse one retired 23 year old and a 20 year old native fun pony. All bar the retired girl are in medium work with the event horse in hard work. Whilst that is a frightening figure it is nowhere near as scary as yours:eek:

They get through a large bale of hayage a week and about £60 of hard feed a month. Retired girl also gets through a box of Danilon every 2 months due to a bit of navicular and geeral stiffness.

That also includes the cost of running my own HGV lorry -lucky I know.:o
 
3 bags a month? How many scoops a day does he get? Even with my horse getting 2 1/2 scoops a day and the pony getting 1/2 a scoop a day one bag lasts over a month. Are you sure someone isn't helping themselves to your feed? Can you switch to a different calmer? I've got mine on Magnitude which is £18 for 90 day supply.
 
My livery is £80 a week thats full livery Mon to Fri and DIY at weekends, also includes all bedding (straw), haylage, feed and use of facilities, indoor and outdoor schools and horse walker, bring in's, turnouts etc etc.

My boy is 16.2 7/8 TB and just gets adlib Haylage and a double handful of Alfa A morning and evening and he does very well like this. I would definitely try to cut down on the feed side of things! You may be surpised how well some of them can do even off very litttle feed.

That said they are an expensive hobby and sometimes you've just got to accept you are going to be skint. My Dad once compared owning a horse to driving down the M1 with your lifes earnings on the back seat with all the windows and sun roof open. Essentially, they are money pits.
 
Can you talk to your feed merchant to see if you can save money anywhere? Pointless us guys suggesting things when we don't know the exact requirements, plus I don't really know much about feed options, just what ours get :)

I woudl though seriously look at whether you can stretch out your visits by people. Even if you had the back person out once every 4 months, that would be one less visit a year, ditto the others. Could you stretch the farrier to every 7 weeks in the winter?
 
firewell said:
He's on calmer as our paddocks are high in calcium. Lol I don't find him a handful, he's a competition horse he is ridden every day. He probably doesnt need the magnesium now there is less grass but I still have half a tub less.
He has the low cal as it's low in starch but high in vitamins, he has Alfa oil as high in protein for muscles and he works hard! It has no molasses in it so also low in starch, ditto the kwik beet :)
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Alfafa is also high in calcium, I would drastically reduce it!

There are lots of other low starch choices (like the a&p I mentioned) so no need to feed something with less cals than you want. Worth a call to some of the feed companies. You don't need to be feeding the amount you do, or spending the amount you do. They will be able to suggest a full diet.
Being a working comp horse doesn't mean you have to break yourself feeding him! (fwiw, when the weather isn't spoiling things both ours are worked hard 6 days a week, usually one of them at a comp. They are both on ad lib hay, along with some vits in speedi beet, and a little oil when needed - comp horses needn't be money drains!)
 
i'd have a think about the feed he's on tbh...

is he on ad lib haylege? ie never left without any?

i'd be tempted to try him on something like calm and condition from allan and page- also if you feed the full amounts which he will prob need then you wont need a balancer as its got all vits and mins in.. i'd add maybe something like outshine - its great for conditioning...

other than taht - how is he in a box - ie does he box walk/stress etc?? i'd also be tempted to have him out 24/7 - i find poor do'ers often are far better out
 
It costs me about £170 a month to keep my hunter who hunts 3 full days a fortnight. £75 shoes every 4 weeks. £30 hay (eats 1/3 bale a day and we got very cheap hay from OH's best friend), £28 hard food (sugar beet, pasture mix which is own brand, spilliers slow release energy cubes) and £35 for insurance.

My horse is kept at home so at least I don't have livery costs.

It cost me roughly the same to keep my TB who again hunted 3 full days a fortnight although he did have joint supplement added on top.

Does sound like you are spending a lot of money to keep one horse!!
 
3 bags Alpha A only works out to be approx 2Kg fed per day plus balancer & Kwik beet.

I feed My 16.3hh 4Kg per day but of a complete feed so no need for balancer or Alpha on top.

Also unmolassed 24hour soak sugarbeet pellets will be an awful lot cheaper than Kwick beat & will go a lot further than flakes one bag lasts me 3 months.

Bedding £7.95 per week not too bad!!! if you are that concerned about costs put him on straw much cheaper & deep litter even more cost effective.
 
i buy the own brand mix and cubes, after looking at what's in them compared to others there wasn't much difference, but alot cheaper.
i also feed speedi beet and chaff.

depending on the behaviour/needs of my horses will depend on whether i buy the chaff with the calmer in or not, mainly the hoofkind molichaff though.

a bag of speedi beet was feeding my 5 neds (2 yrs ago) and lasting me a month over winter. i'm now down to 3 neds and it's lasting me about 6 weeks.
my chaff (one bag) lasts me about 3 weeks sometimes 4, and the mix and cubes last nearly 4 weeks.
to buy the above costs me around £30pm (speedi beet included) to feed 3 horses.

straw and haylage is included in the rent so i don't have to worry about finding some good bales cheap and also don't have to waste money picking it up.
 
I haven't read all the replies, so sorry if repeating anything, but here is my two cents worth;

- Feed - have you had a proper nutritionist come and look at his diet? It seems a very odd combination of feed to me for the type of horse/what you are doing with him. I recently had a nutritionist out, and they have saved me a lot of money - one of the key things that really sunk in with me is that the average horse cannot process over 3kg hard feed in one meal, therefore anything over 3kg is basically passing straight through without doing any good. I have a poor doer on Alfa A Oil and use one bag a month. He gets sugar beet in the morning and Alfa A Oil in the evening, giving him a difference fibre ration source in each meal. From what I have read from your feed, there doesn't seem to be much protein actually going into your 'poor doer' (may have misread as skimmed quickly). My poor doer gets 3kg conditioning nuts day (over two meals) micronized linseed and fibre (either beet or alfa a) and keeps the weight on well. Other 'cheap' things I have used to bulk a horse up are eggs (often fed on racing yards I am told) Guiness (brilliant!) and bog standard sunflower oil from the supermarket (or cash and carry in catering drums!).

- Back/Saddler - By all means get his back checked every six months, but I would argue that you do not need a saddler that often - I would have the back checked first, and see if they flag up any worries over soreness etc. A horse changes shape all the time, and getting a saddler every six months seems a bit frivilous if you are not aware of any problems. I know whether my horse is comfortable or not, and I know whether the saddle is sitting right, I have only had a saddler out twice in four years, and both times they made minor adjustments but said ther wasn't a lot to do.

- Teeth - How old is the horse? My dentist recommends seeing my horse every year - young horses she likes to see every 9 months.

How about trying to get other people involved when you get your horses back/saddle/teeth done, then you can haggle for group discounts etc. You mentioned your horse loses weight/condition standing in the rain - there is an ex-racehorse at our yard which sounds very similar, the owner dotes on him and he looks fab, but she is very careful not to stress him out - if the weather is bad he goes out for a few hours and then comes in (he weaves badly so has to minimise stress by putting him out in the first place). Make sure he is wearing the appropriate rugs, give a warm feed before going out and after he comes in, use probiotics to optimise gut function etc.

Sadly horses are very expensive if done "right" and I dread to think how much money I burn each month on them - I am too scared to work it out!! There are lots of little tips and ways to save money though, and there are lots of articles on the internet and even books which give great tips and pointers.
 
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I also have a TB, and have worked out several cost-saving things over the years (double duvet to keep her warm in the winter, unshod (at least in winter, would shoe in summer maybe if wanted studs), yeast to improve digestion. At one point she cost £350 per month when she could go out and eat grass everyday. Now she's too lami prone for that so has to have Timothy horsehage and goes out 2x day for 30min - and costs less than she used to!

MONTHLY
- 10 bales horsehage (£70 or therabouts)
- 3 bales oat straw (£7.50)
- 4 bags ERS nuts (special diet) (£48)
- 1 bag speedibeet (£9)
- Shavings from local timber place (£10)
- Yeast supplement (£7)

So rent + £151.50 feed/bedding/forage + insurance (£30) + a trim (she's unshod) every 8 weeks at £20 if farrier does it (she trims herself doing roadwork in the summer).

Monthly cost = rent + £191.50 costs + competing.

Oh - forgot to add, teeth done once a year (£30), back checked if there's a problem, vaccs once a year (£60 incl call-out).
 
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zoeshiloh said:
From what I have read from your feed, there doesn't seem to be much protein actually going into your 'poor doer'.
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With the amount of Alfa A Oil it is getting, the horse is definitely not going short on protein! Alfa A Oil is 14% protein, so significantly higher in protein than a lot of conditioning cubes!
 
We spend about the same we think on our TB.

The feed bills are astronomical- and yes, he is fed in the best way for him. Shoes need doing every 6 weeks or his feet will fall apart.

They only compete once or twice a month now, and that does save money...
 
zoeshiloh said:
I haven't read all the replies, so sorry if repeating anything, but here is my two cents worth;

- Feed - have you had a proper nutritionist come and look at his diet? It seems a very odd combination of feed to me for the type of horse/what you are doing with him. I recently had a nutritionist out, and they have saved me a lot of money - one of the key things that really sunk in with me is that the average horse cannot process over 3kg hard feed in one meal, therefore anything over 3kg is basically passing straight through without doing any good. I have a poor doer on Alfa A Oil and use one bag a month. He gets sugar beet in the morning and Alfa A Oil in the evening, giving him a difference fibre ration source in each meal. From what I have read from your feed, there doesn't seem to be much protein actually going into your 'poor doer' (may have misread as skimmed quickly). My poor doer gets 3kg conditioning nuts day (over two meals) micronized linseed and fibre (either beet or alfa a) and keeps the weight on well. Other 'cheap' things I have used to bulk a horse up are eggs (often fed on racing yards I am told) Guiness (brilliant!) and bog standard sunflower oil from the supermarket (or cash and carry in catering drums!).

- Back/Saddler - By all means get his back checked every six months, but I would argue that you do not need a saddler that often - I would have the back checked first, and see if they flag up any worries over soreness etc. A horse changes shape all the time, and getting a saddler every six months seems a bit frivilous if you are not aware of any problems. I know whether my horse is comfortable or not, and I know whether the saddle is sitting right, I have only had a saddler out twice in four years, and both times they made minor adjustments but said ther wasn't a lot to do.

- Teeth - How old is the horse? My dentist recommends seeing my horse every year - young horses she likes to see every 9 months.

How about trying to get other people involved when you get your horses back/saddle/teeth done, then you can haggle for group discounts etc. You mentioned your horse loses weight/condition standing in the rain - there is an ex-racehorse at our yard which sounds very similar, the owner dotes on him and he looks fab, but she is very careful not to stress him out - if the weather is bad he goes out for a few hours and then comes in (he weaves badly so has to minimise stress by putting him out in the first place). Make sure he is wearing the appropriate rugs, give a warm feed before going out and after he comes in, use probiotics to optimise gut function etc.

Sadly horses are very expensive if done "right" and I dread to think how much money I burn each month on them - I am too scared to work it out!! There are lots of little tips and ways to save money though, and there are lots of articles on the internet and even books which give great tips and pointers.
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Apparently our poor doer ought to be fed 5-6kg of forage and 5-6kg of concentrates every day... We do this (he gets far more forage than that in hay to keep him occupied...) and he looks very well. We also do it with high quality feeds. It costs us an absolute fortune to keep him- especially in winter!
 
I know what it costs to bed/hay feed my entire yard wtc but no idea what it works out as per horse as some arnt fed as live out etc.

My first reaction to seeing £700 was put him on part livery!! however that is the yearly breakdown including physio etc so makes a little more sense.

We have 13 playing polo ponies at the moment. 5/6 them are pure tb and in winter play 2-3 times a week and get worked 1 hour twice a day in trot/canter or second ride will be a school. 1day off where we try and get them all in field for day. The poor doers get scoop alfa a original, three quaters baileys top line and some get a little sugar beet- good old 24hr traditional white bag blue/red detail stuff. This is stubbs round scoop. If they look poor we would give them a 3rd feed of the same. They probably get adlib haylage. Just consider the horses stomach is a rugby ball (smaller) now think how much that alfa a alone takes up!

I have used lo cal in them past and for the cost wasn't impressed hence baileys no 4.

We are in Surrey, and no longer have hay on yard as the cost was too much. We have big bales haylage at about £30 a bale and use around 2 and half a day not including the bales for the live out chaps. Where a field of 5 adlib get a bale every 5th day.
 
TGM said:
With the amount of Alfa A Oil it is getting, the horse is definitely not going short on protein! Alfa A Oil is 14% protein, so significantly higher in protein than a lot of conditioning cubes!
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Ok, perhaps worded wrongly - there are cheaper sources of protein out there, ie, soya flakes - 1 scoop a day at £13/bag rather than 4 scoops of Alfa A at nearly £14/bag.
 
Agree with the person who suggested checking for worms. My arab was regularly wormed for years yet we couldn't figure out why he was suddenly becoming difficult to keep weight on. We tried coprameal, alfa oil, balancers, many mixes, kwikbeet, swapped him to haylage etc and nothing worked - his ribs were still visible. Eventually the vet suggested doing a worm count and low and behold (despite many years of being on the yards own routine worming) he was full of tapeworms. We fixed the problem and he now only needs a handful of happy hoof for his supplement. With grass and hay he more or less lives off thin air, so it's worth looking into (we've saved a small fortune!).

I also agree it's not necessary to get a saddler as often as six months. I get mine done yearly or when he or the saddle show any signs. It would definitely be worth moving to an all inclusive DIY yard where you can get adlib hay and straw, or even moving on to livery which is likely to be cheaper as the yard will have to cover the cost of his feed/hay/straw.
 
Lolo said:
Apparently our poor doer ought to be fed 5-6kg of forage and 5-6kg of concentrates every day... We do this (he gets far more forage than that in hay to keep him occupied...) and he looks very well. We also do it with high quality feeds. It costs us an absolute fortune to keep him- especially in winter!
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My poor doer gets about the same - 3kg Nuts (over two meals) and linseed, Alfa A Oil, Sugar Beet etc adds up to another 3kg. He then gets 6kgs of very good quality haylage twice a day (currently lives in). I use the big bales of haylage, and get through one every ten days (two horses - the other is a good doer!)
 
Hmm, feed and farrier seem v expensive to me.

farrier - no foot no horse as they say, but you could look at buying the shoes yourself and the farrier just put them back on? Or instead of paying for a new set each month (if you dont do any road work) you could get the feet trimmed and the same set put back on?

Feed - tbh I think you are paying far far too much!
My 17hh ISH (3/4tb) gets a scoop of cool mix and a scoop of chaff, morning and night!
The chaff we get free from the feed merchant, as they have holes in the bags :)

The Lo cal is exactly that - low calories. You say he is a poor doer - would he not be better on something that has more calories?
Maybe something like Baileys competition mix, or the top line conditioning cubes (which can be fed on their own).
If you want low starch you could feed red mills complete, (comes in 14 or 10%)http://www.redmills.co.uk/uk/horse/products/product/?id=501
a few 4* event horses are fed that only - and they are the pure tb!

He is getting an awful lot of hay - can you not put it in haynets and weigh it, so he gets only what he needs?

Maybe switch bedding - 7.95 is very expensive for bedding! straw or cardboard maybe?
 
TGM said:
With the amount of Alfa A Oil it is getting, the horse is definitely not going short on protein! Alfa A Oil is 14% protein, so significantly higher in protein than a lot of conditioning cubes!
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Oh yes - lots of protein there - too much (??) It's just not the sort of diet I'd expect to see a hard working comp animal in.... And would have thought a more rounded and balanced diet would be more appropriate - and ultimately much cheaper.
 
Couple of things that may help you:

1. Try finding a DIY yard that includes the cost of hay in your rent. I was paying £150 a month for grass livery before I moved-my DIY now includes a stable with hay included for £180 a month.

2. I would try going the barefoot route. My boy is a TBx a he has now been barefoot almost all his life (he is rising 9) the first year will be quite expensive getting the trimmer out & possibly the upfront cost of some hoof boots to help with the transition. My boy now gets trimmed once a year & I rasp as & when needed. I compete so dont worry about the no shoes & competing.

3. Try cutting what you feed down. My boy is a really bad doer yet my feed bill is only £25 a month. I feed a chaff with a competition mix & some seaweed for his skin & it barely costs me £25 a month.

4. As for the competing, I love to compete & does cost around that each time so unless you want to go out less or cut it out completly I cant see of any way of making it cheaper. But I could never give it up like you!

Hope that helps.
Good luck :)
 
amymay said:
Oh yes - lots of protein there - too much (??) It's just not the sort of diet I'd expect to see a hard working comp animal in.... And would have thought a more rounded and balanced diet would be more appropriate - and ultimately much cheaper.
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I don't think there is anything wrong with the balance of the diet - the combination of beet, alfalfa and a balancer is quite widely recommended by nutritionists these days, and a competition horse doesn't necessarily have to be on cereal-based feeds. However, it does seem rather expensive and if the horse is happy to chomp through that amount of fibre in the form of Alfa A Oil, then if that was reduced I suspect that the horse would probably chomp through more haylage instead, which is a more cost-effective form of calories and less bucket feed would be needed overall.
 
Yikes that is a lot. My two (TB and TBxWB) cost me less than that together. Do you have your own transport? That is a lot to spend on lorries, can you split that with a friend to save some costs?

Echo what a couple of people have said about shoes, depending on your horse of course, you could try without. If you need studs then obviously that isn't going to help though.

You say the back person. What type of back person? I don't want to sound sniffy but I'd be very surprised if a genuine physio would be finding anything that often. Mine get seen if I suspect there is a problem but otherwise left on the advice of said physio.

And I echo the thought that that is an awful lot of food. We had racehorses in training on less than that! Unless he only picks at his haylage I am shocked that he needs all that alfalfa on top of ad lib haylage. Has he got tapeworm or ulcers possibly? (I'm sure that isn't the case as you sound like you treat him like a prince and would be well on top of that!) Just seems like an enormous amount to be feeding.

You could just ride less in winter. Less work = less feed and smaller bills.
 
Um I have 3 horses , they`re at home now but when they were on DIY it cost me £282 a month for all three, that includes

DIY
feed
haylage
bedding
supplements

add a further £130 every 6 weeks for shoeing and trimming

and add £105 a yr for teeth......

I`d look at changing your feed, if your feeding ad lib haylage he shouldnt really need loads and loads of feed even if he is a bad doer.

£7.95 seems a lot for bedding, my guys are on straw, deep litter and I go through a bale a week each for them, and straw is £2 a bale...
 
comming from another TB owner i think your feed/hay is about what i spend.

hard feed is £70 a month, supplements about £40, haylage about £70 and shavings about £25/30.

he does really well on that feed (winergy equilibrium condition @ 1 bag per week, micronised linseed @£30 per 2 1/2 months and a speedibeet every 4 weeks).

eats 2-3 small bales of haylage a week and has one bag of shavings.

no worms, just a very fit, very sharp, hard working TB!

iv seen pics of your boy and he looks so well id be loathe to change too much, i think all you can do is try barefoot (but a proper trimmer will charge £40 a trim every 5 weeks and i do think you need a proper BF trimmer), and compete one less time per month.

on the other side of the coin, can you clip other peoples horses to make a bit of extra money on the side?

ETA that mine has a sports massage every 6 weeks, sees dentist twice a year, and a proper physio twice a year if i feel he needs it, and also that i forgot to add in his coligone @ £100 for 4 months.
if you want your horse to give you 100% in the ring, i think you do need to keep on top of these tiny aspects.

i am not adding anything else up!
 
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firewell said:
Hay is so expensive round here, all those who live in Surrey must know how I feel.
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Having been quoted £10 a bale recently, I do know how you feel. I did notice that at Scats (Redhill) a small bale of haylage is £6.10 if you buy 20 or more (and they deliver over a certain spend). Would that work out cheaper than your current supplier?
I'm bulking out hay with lots of Hi-Fi, as it's now working out cheaper than buying extra hay. I normally have more than enough for the winter, but Henry being grass sensitive until November and a bad December has left me looking at a near empty store!!
 
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