Ulcer symptoms?

[bluehorse]

I know there have been a lot of posts about ulcers, but I am after your opinions on my horse...

I have a 6yo TB x trakhener, he is a very sensitive soul and quite a stressy individual (weaves, box walks etc). I have had him for 15 months. He is tall and slim - when I got him he was very slim (I wouldn't say thin), but pretty much what you might expect a large gangly youngster to look like. Where he was kept he had daily turnout, but had been in a pro yard for about 2 months to sell, where I don't think they had turnout at all. Last winter with me was pretty much stabled full time but had constant adlib haylage so never ran out of forage. I have now moved yards and he is out full time on very good grass, and will have daily turnout in the winter. He is fed a low starch hi-fibre diet.

He has filled out alot since I have had him (just the normal maturing process), but is still slim despite being on good grass and having had a couple of months off full work due to injury - he looks great actually and I am lucky that I don't seem to have to worry about his weight. His coat gleams...

So that's the background info...now to the point of this post. I keep wondering if he has ulcers. This is because he extremely sensitive to being girthed up. I do the girth up very slowly whilst putting on boots, bridle etc, a hole at a time. He also has a sheepskin girth sleeve. He seems to be getting worse despite the care I take, and will now sometimes cow kick when I tighten the girth. He blows out too which doesn't help, and the girth usually has to be tightened again 10-15 minutes into exercise. When I am on him he refuses to stand for me to tighten it, cowkicks etc and rushes off the minute he feels me lean over. I am not over-tightening it by any means.

He also dislikes me grooming his sides and belly, although he generally likes a bit of fuss and enjoys a good scratch on his neck etc.

He bites/licks his sides alot too. He is a very dark bay so it's easy to see where he has been doing this as i can see the dried saliva.

He is very very tense in his flatwork, quick off the leg and prone to rushing around with his head in the air, the odd buck etc (teeth, back and saddle all checked and fine).He can generally be quite resistant and a bit difficult.

I did discuss this with my vet who said he looked very well so probably not worth worrying about it. I also understand that alot of horses have ulcers anway which go undetected.

I will confess that I am rather prone to looking for problems due to years of bad luck and various ailments with my older horse who is now retired. But I always went with my gut feeling if I thought something was wrong with him, and was right when bloods showed up liver damage.

So what do you think peeps, am I just being a horse hypochondriac?? Am I worrying about nothing? Should I just bite the bullet and get him scoped? It would at least put my mind at reast if nothing was found, but I could do without spending a couple of hundred pounds for potentially no reason...

 

[Angelbones]

Sounds very like my horse's symptoms. My chap had previously been a very laid back chap, no probs at all although rather reluctant to work properly. He also used to grind his teeth when excited / stressed out hunting. He too was easy to keep weight on actually - which is considered to be the opposite to those with ulcers. Anyway to cut a long story short - his behaviour deteriorated so much that it would take two of us to rug him etc and we were constantly dodging teeth and feet when grooming / tacking up. He also used to leap forward when I was on and first asked for him to move off. Suddenly he dropped a lot of weight too, which was quite startling but we had just had all that snow so I presumed he was stir crazy and had wintered badly.

Called vet out as i was worried about the loss of condition and bad behaviour, he did blood tests which showed nothing and I asked about ulcers. He arranged for a scoping which was going to cost approx £250 but I couldn't attend in the end. Another vet practice was holding a free scoping day - you paid if your horse had ulcers but not otherwise. The theory being I think that if they did have ulcers then most people's insurance would cough up for the scope and the drugs etc.

Turns out my chap does have ulcers - a slightly different type in a different area to those expected in general. He's now on Gastroguard - week 2. The difference in him was almost instant and is quite dramatic. On day 2 I got him ready for his hack, all alone, with not one evil face or even a tail swish at me. He walked out better too. By the end of the first week I reported back to the vet - and he's now on the remainder of the course of drugs and heading for another scope in a few weeks.

I would say that my chap had a very relaxed lifestyle, was on the correct diet, had plenty of turnout etc and would have been an unlikely ulcer candidate. it was the behaviour like you have described that rang alarm bells for me. I would honestly ask your vet about scoping - and see if anyone else has a scoping day planned you could get your horse onto. The guy in charge of ours is the expert, his name is Tim Brazil - it may be worth googling him to see if it brings up a schedule of clinics or something similar near to you. My vet was cool about me sidestepping his own clinic - he understood the money issue too, and has treated it as a referral for the insurance as he is now working with the 2nd vets to get my chap sorted.

So, not a quick reply, but there you go! I'd say its worth investigating further.
Good luck with it all. x

 

[bluehorse]

Thanks very much for that Angelbones, it's very interesting to hear of horses that don't necessarily show all of the symptoms.

I would never deny my horse veterinary care but it is difficult when you're not sure if you're making something out of nothing... At the end of the day I do have a concern about him although I know his general welfare is good, and after all the problems with my old boy I am hyper aware of every blinking move they make!!!

 

[Box_Of_Frogs]

I'd recommend starting him on Coligone which is specifically made for stressy TB-types. It contains Yea Sac and pre/pro biotics and lines the horse's stomach which protects it against the stomach acids and thus prevent ulcers. I feed the minty powder and although it might seem pricey at first, it lasts yonks so works out at just pence per day. It is as close to magic fairy dust as you will ever find and I have seen many stressy and unhappy horses completely turned around on a maintenance dose of Coligone. PM H'sm_mum on here and she can tell you all you want to know.

 

[banners]

I would think about hindgut ulcers if I were you. Girthyness, sensitiveness on the flanks, and training issues are prime symptoms. Look up the anatomy of the digestive system and see where the stomach actually is. Its much higher in thoracic cavity than people think, then look at the location of the hindgut, especially the right dorsal colon. It lies all the way down the right side of the horse, so any discomfort there would elicit the symptoms youre describing. if it is hindgut then coligone won't make any difference. Let me know if you want to know any more!

 

[bluehorse]

Thanks Box_of_Frogs - I have heard of coligone and was thinking about maybe trying that.

Banners - let me know as much as you can!

Thanks