Ulcers- not sure what to do

Michen

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Hi all,

I have a little ex racer who I got straight from training at the beginning of November. He's had time off since then doing lots of ground work, leading off other horses, long lining etc. He's an absolute poppet to handle.

I have suspicions he has ulcers to a degree (and indeed most out of racing do). He has one or two explosions whilst long reining and lunging and he's chiro/physio very, very regularly since he arrived to sort out various soreness. Of course this could just be typical TB behaviour, he was very fit and is only in light work now. I did ride him a little when I first got him but it was a nightmare fitting a saddle to him so I decided to work on his shape and look at it again in feb. Despite the explosions when being worked on the ground, he never ever did anything under saddle in the few times I rode him. Actually, I hopped on him bareback and in a headcollar when I got back from a 2 week holiday (where he had not been worked at all) this week and hacked him round the block- he's that good.

Anyway explosions aside, he chews wood. Mostly when I'm not looking (never if I'm grooming him or anything) but he will go for the fence of the school, poles whilst im putting them out etc. Doesn't do it in the field. He is girthy with his roller unless I do it VERY slowly and he can be a BIT crabby when grooming his belly. Ever so slightly flinchy with heavy turnout rugs but that's improving and may well be because he's used to less noisy stable ones etc.

His coat is shiny and healthy, he is a perfect weight now (though admittedly he hasn't put on quite as much as I would have expected given the ad lib hay and lack of work) and is fed an ulcer friendly diet aka ad lib hay, healthy tummy, Saracen super fibre pencils, speedibeet, turnout 12 hours a day.

I put him on Gastric Comfort (feedmark, formally called ulcer calm) and he is less grumpy with his belly but the wood chewing hasn't stopped. At 45 quid a month, this isn't really feasible long term especially given his fondness for bi weekly chiro at the moment!

If a horse with ulcers is fed an ulcer friendly diet etc, does this give them the chance to heal themselves eventually? Equally, does this sound like gastric ulcers or hind gut ulcers? Given his symptoms are mild and the supplement hasn't made that much difference, I'm tempted to just take him off it and give him a few months to see if everything else settles down. I'd be worried if he was thin and dull coat and grumpy etc but he's not at all and his symptoms seem so mild?

I don't know what to do, whether to just carry on with supplement or not. He's insured but I highly doubt they would pay out for gastroguard on something they would probably class as "pre existing".

I want the best for the chap but equally he's getting about 90% of my paycheck currently!!!
 
Hi... My horse had ulcers and I was led to believe that the only way of actually getting rid of them was gastrogard...a 3 month course cured my horses ulcers. Since then I have used gastric comfort to maintain his ulcer free tummy...I hope! I think your insurance would pay for treatment if he has not been previously diagnosed and treated for ulcers...not sure why they wouldn't? They covered all of my horses treatment. You would need to have a scope to confirm diagnosis before they pay out tho.
 
In the long run yes you will sort his ulcers but in the short term you are probably best giving a minimum 2 weeks of GastroGuard. You don't necessarily need a full course of the stuff.
 
When you are treating ulcers you need a three pronged approach - reduce the acidity in the gut, line the gut with a mucous layer and make sure the gut is never empty, but has low sugar high fibre feeds. I treated mine without all the expensive gubbins - bicarbonate of soda to reduce acidity (with some omeprazole if you can get it), coconut oil to provide a better mucous lining and unmollassed beet pulp with cereal/sugar free feeds plus ad lib hay/haylage/grass. I also gave a probiotic (yeasacc) to boost the gut bacteria, and also someone mentioned activated charcoal but I never used it.There is also a lot of stuff on here which you might find helpful in terms of what foods help with healing etc.
http://equinenutritionnerd.com/2014...tions-for-stomach-ulcer-treatment-prevention/
 
In terms of 'pre-existing' in relation to insurance, that applies if it the horse has been previously treated for a condition so, it seems that, in your condition, your insurance would probably pay out for Gastroguard if you went down the scoping route

When my horse was diagnosed with ulcers, I was told by the vet that the only way to cure them was to provide an acid free environment in the stomach while they healed (ie- use a proton pump inhibitor like Gastroguard which 'switches off; acid production). This did seem to work in the short term but, after being off the GG for a month or so (on ulcer friendly management and diet), the ulcers would return. (Did three courses). The vet then advised that it looked like we would have to manage rather than try to cure the ulcers.

Horse is now on supplement from vet to work on incresing mucous membrane in stomach. He is on strict no cereal, low sugar, high fibre diet so, in answer to your question, in some cases, it seems a management route is OK.

Just as an aside, I would be very careful about feeding anything which claims to be an ant-acid. Although reducing acidity in the gut has obvious benefits (ie- use of Gastroguard), products like bicarb and ant-acids can, apparently have an adverse effect as, unlike GG, they only reduce acidity for a few hours at a time and the 'acid rebound' effect when the acidity returns after a few hours can actually be worse than the original acidity. To be effective, these products would have to be fed every few hours throughout a 24hr period. Lining the gut was what my vet advised to be most important and have least side-effects.
 
I have seen a dramatic improvement in my horse since using a product called Equishure. This is for hind gut acidosis. The same company does a product called rite-trac which soothes stomach ulcers and the hind gut. My horse was not obviously ulcer-y but he did show signs of pain and had sensitive feet. He is now less grumpy and very nearly rock crunching.
Fiona36, thanks for that. I do have concerns using this product long term.
During my research into hind gut acidosis, I came across some advice about NOT feeding sugar beet, even un molassed versions. It is apparently indigestible and detrimental to horses with GI problems.
I hope this helps.
 
I think I must have bought his twin at the same time. Was 100% sure he had ulcers. Not any more! All symptoms gone so they must at least be healing. This was his treatment;
4 weeks of omeprazole, 210mg per day. I used 7x 30mg human tablets. I believe the coated equine version ie GG is not strictly necessary but anyway...within 4 days of starting, symptoms had gone.
2 weeks of adding approx 100ml Boots version liquid antacid to a tiny feed 3x daily, purely for relief.
24 hour turnout. He will only crib now if brought in and feeling worried, e.g sheep being dosed next door!
He has a very small feed of alfalfa chaff and micro linseed with pro balance once a day.
When brought in, constant ad lib forage, never without something to chew.

Worked a treat!
 
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I think I must have bought his twin at the same time. Was 100% sure he had ulcers. Not any more! All symptoms gone so they must at least be healing. This was his treatment;
4 weeks of omeprazole, 210mg per day. I used 7x 30mg human tablets. I believe the coated equine version ie GG is not strictly necessary but anyway...within 4 days of starting, symptoms had gone.
2 weeks of adding approx 100ml Boots version liquid antacid to a tiny feed 3x daily, purely for relief.
24 hour turnout. He will only crib now if brought in and feeling worried, e.g sheep being dosed next door!
He has a very small feed of alfalfa chaff and micro linseed with pro balance once a day.
When brought in, constant ad lib forage, never without something to chew.

Worked a treat!

I guess somehow you got a prescription for the omeprazole as if you were buying the OTC version it would work out more expensive than Gastroguard well about 4x the cost. Probably not a good idea to suggest others break the law by treating their animals with an unlicenced POM human drug.
 
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I guess somehow you got a prescription for the omeprazole as if you were buying the OTC version it would work out more expensive than Gastroguard well about 4x the cost. Probably not a good idea to suggest others break the law by treating their animals with an unlicenced POM human drug.

If an owner of an animal cannot afford to treat with the current animal licensed meds then a vet can provide a prescription. I have done the same with my horse and legally purchased human drugs for him.
Typically an active ingredient is produced for the human market them modified for animals.
 
If an owner of an animal cannot afford to treat with the current animal licensed meds then a vet can provide a prescription. I have done the same with my horse and legally purchased human drugs for him.
Typically an active ingredient is produced for the human market them modified for animals.

They cannot when a licenced product is available economics does not come into it.
However it was slightly tongue in cheek ,we all do it at some point but maybe not always a good idea on an open forum to suggest others do.
 
Isn't loratidine a human anti-histamine- for allergies and hayfever????? You may mean ranitidine which is for human stomach problems..........but I think OP would be best advised to speak to her vet than be diagnosed and treatment prescribed on here!
 
If you suspect ulcers, to be honest I wouldn't waste money on supplements, get him to the vet and get him scoped. You will at least then know what you are dealing with.
 
Incidentally loratidine is apparently a good option for suspected hind gut ulcers and again the human version will suffice.

I know you meant ranitidine. This is a proton pump inhibitor like omeprazole (active ingredient in Gastroguard). They shut off acid production in the stomach, giving ulcers time to heal in an acid free environment. They do, however have a detrimental effect on hind gut health as, if there is no acid in the stomach to digest and break down food, food will pass, undigested into the hind gut, causing problems there. For this reason, PPIs are not beneficial for hind gut health. In fact, quite the opposite. This is the reason that long term use of Gastroguard is not ideal. The problem is simply being moved elsewhere.
 
As far as I'm aware, ranitidine isn't a proton pump inhibitor...it is prescribed for hind gut ulcers although certainly creating the right conditions by other means alongside is always going to be a good thing :)
 
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Ignore my last comment about ranitidine being a proton pump inhibitor. I was thinking of Lansoprazole. OH is on one and dog on the other! Got mixed up!!
 
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Ha ha, SJ yes ranitidine indeed.
Popsdosh, don't speculate on what you don't know....

Not speculating at all however it is dressed up giving a horse human omeprazole is potentially illegal for the person who issued the prescription or supplied the drugs whether they are vet or doctor I suppose may involve family members,so it is others that are put at risk by putting it on an open forum because there is no grey area on that one.
I am not trying to be clever but I certainly would not shout about it on an open forum as others may try the same with a different outcome .

The other issue with omeprazole capsules is making sure that the horse takes them down whole as omeprazole is absorbed in the small intestine to the bloodstream. the capsules protect the drug from stomach acid that very quickly breaks it down . That is why horse specific forms of omeprazole are so expensive because of the carrier that prevents this breakdown and allowing the drug to be absorbed.
 
The other issue with omeprazole capsules is making sure that the horse takes them down whole as omeprazole is absorbed in the small intestine to the bloodstream. the capsules protect the drug from stomach acid that very quickly breaks it down.

That's really interesting and makes perfect sense. Just realised why human form is described as, "Gastro resistant capsules".
 
micro linseed to 200g which is the rda minimum. I feed 500-600g a day (and have fed up to 1kg) for my TB who can be a hatrack when winter kicks in! Apart from all the healthy benefits of omega 3+6 oils, its very good for all types of gut issues.

Slipper elm powers is also very recommended for soothing gut as well as cider apple vinegar.

Alfalfa chop maybe instead of pellets? leave it soaked and give free access? My boy isnt a fan of the long chop but will eat it in smaller amounts so i only use a little to add texture to the feed, but i give him the pellets and i soak them in with his unmol beet so their softer and all mixed in.
i put his CAV in with the water at the same time and give it all a stir so it helps disguise taste of his powders or minerals

pure feeds he didnt like, simple systems he did. but i just feed all generic local feeds the same as simple without the price tag and delivery cost but its basically unmol beet, alfalfa pellets, micro linseed, alfalfa oil chop, plus he gets CAV, brew yeast, yea saac, lysine. i just ordered slip elm for when he comes home from vet and being put on gastroguard.

Feed before, during and after exercise, adlib hay and/or live out if possible?


i always feed all my guys high fibre and oils, very low sugars/starch. strictly no cereals or molasses regardless of the work or rest they do but my ex-racer (last raced 4 yr ago) was scoped last week and found Grade 2. vets were all very surprised as he lives out on this diet, but still had them. He has also been diagnosed with severe SI and PSD issues so they think the pain kicked the ulcers off (i personally think he has had them constantly since ive had him in a very mild form).
No amount of management can every stop them developing but treating when they are found then managing the diet is key.
 
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