UncleJr's words of wisdom in XC Corner on EWW...

I had a really useful lesson with Carol Broad on Sunday - my mare tends to bury herself in the bottom of the jump making it hard work, she had me coming back to trot half a dozen strides before a small upright and then letting her find her own spot to jump, she was generally picking up canter in the last couple of strides. Then she had me cantering in and just asking for trot (but not insisting) and this was giving the beast time to make her own adjustments and she was meeting the jump spot on every time, we didn't actually come back to trot, just hesitated (for want of a better word) and then she was adjusting herself. Ending up popping over 1.05m on a perfect stride which I never dreamed we'd do in the near future. I was leaving it up to the beast to decide on the adjustment, and basically had my leg off the entire time but because I was asking her back to me a good half dozen strides out it gave her time to look and adjust, the difference was amazing, not once did I feel we were coming in wrong.
 
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I think what people say about talented riders not being able to teach people to see a stride is spot on. I am convinced that really talented riders often aren't the best teachers.


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I think this is completeley true. If you find an amazing natural rider, they are just that natural. They don't "think" they just do, and thus they generally can never explain what they have just done (this applies to flat as well as jumping).
 
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Do you think the expression 'Jumping out of your hands' is relevant? I think this is more a racing term & basically means that the horse is going forward & taking up a good contact all the way to the fence. The rider keeps this 'one' steady contact & then goes with the horse at the point of take off. The contact on approach is not dropped either by the horse e.g backing off the fence or the rider e.g flinging the horse at the fence.



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Interesting that you use that phrase, as it's a synonym for jumping with an automatic release in North America, rather than any of the various crest or modified releases. The point being to maintain the same contact from take off to landing. The problem, of course (like a few related topics on this thread) is what to do with people before they reach the relatively advanced stage of balance and skill required to do this properly. Given that jumping is something one has to learn by doing (with proper instruction, of course) and that horses are not always endlessly forgiving of errors, teaching people to jump well can be quite a trick.
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Personally I find this achievable XC whilst riding a keen bold horse. However the system falls apart somewhat show jumping where I am working harder to keep a more controlled canter & I do not trust the horse not to give the poles a little rub on the way over. I start either over checking or 'giving up' my hold & allowing the horse to go on a long one & gradually building up speed.

Is this a common fault? Do others feel this? is this why lots of event riders struggle with the show jumping or is it just me
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My personal opinion having spent last season watching an awful lot of eventing and not riding (so therefore analysing what different riders do), is that eventers struggle with SJ because they are more comfortable on the slightly long spot than on the deep (correct) spot.

If you think about it, the horse jumping XC by necessity has a flatter jump - he is travelling faster, the fence profiles are more forgiving, there is no great calamity if occasionally his hoof touches a fence. Of course there are fences where this is not true and you are aiming for a proper bascule (upright rails, coffins etc). In general, the eventer is comfortable XC and generally doesn't get it wrong several times round a course (I know there are a few people who do, but in general). They generally take off from further away from the fence too (exceptions being the really upright fences).

However SJing, you need a more powerful canter (the speed gives you more power XC), and you need a proper bascule, and touching the poles does matter. Eventers are more comfortable with the long spot because it is more akin to XC where they don't generally feel like they regularly miss to a fence. However SJ is a completely different skill - and a lot of eventers are not prepared to come out of their comfort zone and place that bit closer to the fence - to them it feels like a miss I reckon. I also think that if they struggled as much XC as they did SJ they'd have given it up as a bad job by now! As it is, because the poles fall, they keep plugging away. The final thing is that XC if you get it wrong, there is maybe one or two fences to organise for, and as long as the horse is honest and you are balanced, you can get away with a kick in the right direction, long reins and a bit of prayer. You then have breathing space to get your act together before the next fence. SJing you don't do that, it's all over in less than 2 mins. There is no time to think and get your act together/reins back, balance back etc etc in quite the same way.

I have had two fascinating lessons with two different trainers - the first was in the USA on a dirt surface where the trainer drew a square in front of the fence that she deemed to be the perfect take off spot - anywhere within this was fine. Then she made me come to the fence and get what I felt was a 'perfect' jump and then come in a bit closer - where I felt too deep. The difference was a matter of a couple of inches when you looked at the hoof-print - certainly nothing major. That made me realise that we all have our comfort spots but being off that point does not equal a miss to the fence. The second one was a trainer teaching me how to influence where the horse landed by where I asked it to take off - helping me therefore adjust for awkward related distances over the first fence not in between the fences - that was a great principle to learn too.
 
SC, that's interesting, and tallies with my experience, i'll admit to being an eventer who doesn't get that deep spot for a sj.
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i think my idea of a 'good' one is actually a little bit further off the fence than the ideal that makes the horse really use itself, BUT i've had a few horses that really hated that deeper spot (including my good grey, who usually wouldn't take off if i stuck her in there -, she liked being a bit off her fences, it didn't flatten her jump) and unfortunately she in particular trained ME to avoid that spot (nothing so convincing as jumping the fence on your own...)
so sometimes when i think i've 'missed', i've actually just got them to that deeper spot... but because i don't manage it very often, it feels like a miss. does that makes sense?
 
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SC, that's interesting, and tallies with my experience, i'll admit to being an eventer who doesn't get that deep spot for a sj.
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i think my idea of a 'good' one is actually a little bit further off the fence than the ideal that makes the horse really use itself, BUT i've had a few horses that really hated that deeper spot (including my good grey, who usually wouldn't take off if i stuck her in there -, she liked being a bit off her fences, it didn't flatten her jump) and unfortunately she in particular trained ME to avoid that spot (nothing so convincing as jumping the fence on your own...)
so sometimes when i think i've 'missed', i've actually just got them to that deeper spot... but because i don't manage it very often, it feels like a miss. does that makes sense?

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I think that makes perfect sense K - as I say, we all have our comfort zones, and training yourself to be really good involves knowing where that 'magic box' is in front of the fence and accepting that anywhere within that box is ok - which is where I find video really useful. I am also convinced that this is why we often feel a round was dreadful when in fact the video shows us it was fine. I think pros do not suffer from this in the same way because they ride such a huge number of horses, who will all have different preferences (such as your grey mare), so they are more used to getting to the 'magic box' than to getting to a specific spot.

I dunno if that makes any sense, but it has helped me be a little bit less brutal of my own riding when the video shows it was actually all fine. I just accept that I didn't get to my sweet spot but I was still in the 'magic box' so it is all good!
 
Great article. Re; the striding issue. I don't event, but my RI is of the opinion that if you've not done anything about meeting the fence right more than 2 strides out, it's too late. He HATES to see us lengthen up to meet a stride late (even if we get to the right spot) because he says the horses are 'stretched' and unable to jump properly as they don't have their hocks under them. He says once you know the stride is wrong you have to ride it as if it isn't so that the horse is still able to put in a decent jump. IE: keep contact and leg and imagine you're meeting the fence at precisely the right spot, then let horse get on with it.
Does that make any sense?
 
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. . .in the USA on a dirt surface where the trainer drew a square in front of the fence that she deemed to be the perfect take off spot - anywhere within this was fine. Then she made me come to the fence and get what I felt was a 'perfect' jump and then come in a bit closer - where I felt too deep. The difference was a matter of a couple of inches when you looked at the hoof-print - certainly nothing major. That made me realise that we all have our comfort spots but being off that point does not equal a miss to the fence.

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This has been driving me crazy all day! This system was developed/popularised (sort of, it's not exactly standard) by one trainer, a Frenchman living in the US. His book is very simple but extremely useful. Mine is, alas, sitting in a box in Canada and do you think I can remember the guy's name . .
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