Unexplained weight loss in labrador - advice please!

[neighneigh]

Hi, I wondered if anyone had any advice on the following please?

It’s about my lab, who has seemingly unexplained weight loss.

He is booked back in for a weight check and review at the vets next week but the vet dealing with him is very young/newly qualified and I’m wondering if any of you experienced dog owners might have any ideas for me!

(Long story, I’m sorry in advance!)

Male lab, now 2 years 9 months old.

Changed food in March this year from…

Royal Canin Labrador to:

Feelwells Duck Cold Pressed Complete
(natural, high quality, human food grade ingredients, gently pressed together with a small amount of water at a low temperature for a short time)

He seemed much better on the new food (no loose stools like before the change) and didn’t start losing weight till June time.

We had a new puppy in June, a female lab. He was very excited at first (he’s such a friendly dog!) and they seem to get on very well. She’s a bit bolder than him but doesn’t seem to pick on him or anything. His appetite has not changed since having her.

New puppy is on the Feelwells food too and is a good weight. When we’ve increased the food (as she’s growing), we’ve seen her weight increase.

New puppy does not eat male dog’s food, as we start him off eating his first and stay with them whilst they both eat.
They both have great appetites, will eat anything out in front of them!
They both have the gulp/maze type bowls, to slow them down a bit but every scrap of food is gone within a couple of minutes!

They don’t have any table scraps or human food but do have dog treats when training and out and about, a carrot at the yard and will have sprats, a pigs ear, rawhide or rawhide alternative chew and a Kong filled with cream cheese sometimes.

Male dog lost 1.5kg between June and October and then another 1.5kg between October and November.

He was castrated in October.

Between July and October, he didn’t have as much exercise as he normally would have, as I was really ill and my partner was working full time, looking after me and the horses and project managing a huge house renovation. He did as much as he could with the dogs but it wasn’t as much as they were used to. It didn’t seem to outwardly stress either of the dogs out though but maybe could have?
We lived in a rented house, whilst doing the renovation so the dogs weren’t disturbed by all the building work etc.

After being castrated in October, he again didn’t do much exercise, whilst he was healing. If anything, I’d have thought he would put weight on, not lose more ?

He’s had 2 lots of bloods done.
First lot the only thing that came up was slightly high urea, the second lot were all fine and normal.

We were feeding him the upper amount of food for a 20-30kg dog and he’s now around 25kg.
We’ve increased this by a third (on the vets advice) but it’s not made any difference.

The other thing is that he’s always struggled with his ears. They need cleaning every day but there’s still lots of brown greasy wax there and he shakes his head quite often.
We’ve asked the vets around 12 times (literally every visit, since he was a puppy) about his ears. They’ve always fobbed us off, saying it’s just a Labrador thing, until one vet finally said that his ears probably shouldn’t be like they are (if you rub the base of his ears, they are squelchy).
We’d asked for his ears to be fully investigated, when he was under general anaesthetic for the castration but they only gave them a bit of a clean so we’re no further forward with that.
We clean his ears everyday and put drops in but this doesn’t seem to fully get to the route of the problem.

So, any ideas for us please?

(Thank you so much if you’ve got this far!!)

 

[SAujla]

You could get his poo tested to see if anything comes up there? Is he wormed regularly?

 

[CorvusCorax]

My middle dog is naturally a skinny dog. If you feed him more, he just gets the runs.
He also drops weight out of work/with less exercise weirdly (also loss of tone/muscle) and if something is bothering him (itchy/wet excema in paws etc).
Also bear in mind winter/colder weather.

 

[Thistle]

Brown gunk in the ears is often due to a yeast infection. I used an ear cleaner called Malacetic aural (vets advice) available from Amazon. Then once it had settled down just a clean once a month seems to work.

Yeast is often fed by veg, wheat etc in the food, the starch/sugar feeds the yeast, your food has a high % sweet potato and beet pulp.. Maybe the % in the food is too much for him.

Could you cope with a raw diet, that way you can tailor it to him, cut out excess veg and also work out if he's allergic to anything (some dogs are allergic to duck)

Have a chat with Millies Wolfheart https://www.millieswolfheart.co.uk/dog-food they do foods up to 80% meat and also single protein foods. They are super helpful.

 

[MissTyc]

https://www.allaboutdogfood.co.uk/dog-food-reviews/2351/feelwells-grain-free-adult-duck

The food is deemed "good" but it's very low meat and 31% potato + veg, so it might be that just doesn't suit his metabolism (and might be related to ears problem, too).

I find many dogs need a very high meat diet, if not raw, then something like Arcana, Carnilove, or Eden dry foods come in only fractionally more expensive than yours, per day, but are more appropriate.

Another thing worth mentioning is that many dogs don't thrive on having the exact same meal every day, so it could be worth rotating some higher quality brands as well. Many minor intolerances can develop based on longer term exposure. Also, it's more interesting to have a different meal every now and then

 

[neighneigh]

@SAujla thank you for the suggestion, I’ll mention it to the vet, as we haven’t done a poo sample.
He is on their pet plan so flea/wormer is posted out to us and he’s done regularly (monthly with Nextgard Spectra) which is the vets recommendation…. maybe that’s too much?).

Thank you @CorvusCorax I did wonder if it was a loss of muscle causing the weight drop between June and Mid October but he’s been back doing plenty/his normal for a couple of months and there’s been no weight gain since. Maybe it will just take more time.

@Thistle thank you. The drops we use were given to us by the vet but I don’t think they are for a yeast infection specifically. I can ask them about that being a possible cause of his ear problems.
We desperately want to get to the bottom of that.

That’s really interesting about the veg. I’ll cut out the carrots at the yard/work then and rethink the food choice.
We thought we’d gone for a really good quality one there, being cold pressed, hypoallergenic, human grade ingredients etc. but obviously want to get him/them on the best one for his/their specific needs.

We’re not really set up for a raw diet (freezer space wise etc.) but could try to do what we can to change him on to raw.
We’ve just given a chest freezer away! ? To feed both labs on raw food, I’m guessing will take up quite a lot of space.

Thank you for your reply @MissTyc.
It could be the duck, he was the same when he was on chicken based food too so could be poultry!?

The food on the link you posted, isn’t quite the right one.
This is the one we’re feeding:
https://feelwells.co.uk/product/feelwells-cold-pressed-grain-free-duck-2-5kg/
I can’t find that one on the all about dog food website.
It’s got 50 percent duck, is grain free etc.

I’ll do some more research on other foods and look into the raw option again. I’ll look at the brands you mentioned, thank you.

 

[rara007]

How underweight/light are we talking?
How many meals is his food split into?

 

[Goldenstar]

I have had many labradors so have had many run ins with ears I have never had an issue since I swopped to higher protein diets .
My dog now 8 drops weight when he’s not exercised as much he’s always done this He had a excitable tummy as a young dog it took a little while to suss him out he’s an out an out athlete .
With him I give some probind or similar now and again he does not like yogurt or I would give him live yogurt a tablespoon twice a day that’s what my friend a vet does with her dogs .
I think the urea suggests his kidneys are somewhat stressed and high protein might not be a good thing in that case .You need an experienced vet on the case .

 

[splashgirl45]

My friend has a dog (not lab) whose ears get bad if he is on certain foods so diet may be the ear problem. I feed Wolfworthy which is a kibble as I wanted to feed raw but don’t have the room in my freezer for dog food. Sounds like your dog may need higher meat content.. if he was mine I would try different food first and less worming

 

[Goldenstar]

Less worming is certainly worth trying .

 

[Chiffy]

If there is no medical reason your dog is underweight, I would consider a change of food as many above have said.
I am not a raw feeder, I prefer a good quality kibble but feed half the recommended amount and half a wet complete such as Forthglade or Naturo. I have retrievers.
I can make a suggestion about the ears though. I have a retriever/ collie rescue. She was always scratching her ears and shaking her head. The story you tell of what you have done about it is exactly what I did, even down to the full investigation under anaesthetic while being spayed. Nothing helped at all. She became frightened of me going near her ears so I had to stop any medication.
Then, already aware that ears can be affected by food , I read about NutriPaw Pre/Probiotic supplement. It came up again and again on my facebook and in the end it sounded so convincing I had to try it. I thought I would give it an 8 week trial. For the size of my dog a tub lasts 6 weeks but I just bought one tub at first. I almost can’t believe I am telling you about the transformation in my dog after struggling for nearly three years. It’s amazing! She can now lay with her head near the fire in the evenings, whereas she used to try and then as she got warm would rush out of the room madly shaking her head.
The only other thing that I did manage to put in her ears that did calm things a bit was Thornit, which is an old fashioned treatment but far better than drops from the vet.
The inside of her ears look totally different now, we are on our second tub and she will need to stay on it apparently, but who cares if it works!

 

[neighneigh]

Thank you for your reply @rara007. He was generally around 29kg, as a healthy-looking, not fat, adult lab.
He’s now 25.2kg and is looking more like a greyhound than a lab really ?
He still has a shiny coat but is very, very lean.
I’ve never wanted to let him become obese, for health reasons but he’s skinny now, not slim and it’s very worrying.

We’ve kept him on 3 meals a day, as it was always our plan to have a second dog when he was around 2 1/2 years old and that way, they have the same meal times.

@Goldenstar thank you, that’s interesting, that does sound very similar to our boy.
What do you feed your lab now?
He has generally been on some probiotic treats everyday but the company has been out of stock since the summer (since he’s been losing weight actually) so whether it’s made a difference.
I can try him with some yoghurt, to see if he’ll eat it.
I’ll try the less worming too, as it has seemed a bit excessive, since he’s been a bit older. It’s just what the vet advised but that doesn’t always mean it’s the right thing!

Thank you @splashgirl45 I’ll look into the Wolfworthy food!

@Chiffy thank you, I will look into the Forthglade and Naturo food too.
Definitely think you’re right about getting him back into a probiotic. If the company we normally get the probiotic treats from is going to continue to have stock issues (which looks likely, as they haven’t had any in since the summer), I’ll definitely give the Nutripaw a go.



I don’t want to change too many things in one go, as I won’t know what’s causing the issues and what’s made the difference but I’ve started a list of everything to try.

How quickly should I see a difference in him, when I add or eliminate something from his diet, would you all say?

 

[neighneigh]

Just to add, since we’ve changed him on to the new food and even since we upped it so he’s having almost the recommended amount for a 40kg dog (when he’s 25kg), he hasn’t had the runs or an upset tummy in any way but he just hasn’t put any weight on.

 

[Goldenstar]

I feed my labs on Canagan and raw and cooked meat I feed them twice daily .
I think you do need advice from a really experienced vet that’s a lot of food for a dog that’s losing weight .

 

[Chiffy]

NN, I was just coming back to say, if he is on the right food that doesn’t go straight though him, you should see a difference quite quickly but I agree with Goldenstar that he shouldn’t be needing so much. It is definitely a worry for you.
As far as sorting the ears, if he has the right help, they should start improving in about two weeks but don’t give up if it takes longer.

 

[Sandstone1]

Has he had bloods taken? Nexgard spectra is supposed to be given monthly. It does not cover all worms so you should worm with something that covers the ones that it does not. I think its tapeworm and lungworm that it does not cover but you need to check and worm with something like veloxa every six months.
He should have a swab taken from his ears to see what is going on.
He may have a food allergy which would effect his ears and possibly his weight.
I would ask for a second opinion from your vet as somethings not right.

 

[Cinnamontoast]

If there is no medical reason your dog is underweight, I would consider a change of food as many above have said.
I am not a raw feeder, I prefer a good quality kibble but feed half the recommended amount and half a wet complete such as Forthglade or Naturo. I have retrievers.
I can make a suggestion about the ears though. I have a retriever/ collie rescue. She was always scratching her ears and shaking her head. The story you tell of what you have done about it is exactly what I did, even down to the full investigation under anaesthetic while being spayed. Nothing helped at all. She became frightened of me going near her ears so I had to stop any medication.
Then, already aware that ears can be affected by food , I read about NutriPaw Pre/Probiotic supplement. It came up again and again on my facebook and in the end it sounded so convincing I had to try it. I thought I would give it an 8 week trial. For the size of my dog a tub lasts 6 weeks but I just bought one tub at first. I almost can’t believe I am telling you about the transformation in my dog after struggling for nearly three years. It’s amazing! She can now lay with her head near the fire in the evenings, whereas she used to try and then as she got warm would rush out of the room madly shaking her head.
The only other thing that I did manage to put in her ears that did calm things a bit was Thornit, which is an old fashioned treatment but far better than drops from the vet.
The inside of her ears look totally different now, we are on our second tub and she will need to stay on it apparently, but who cares if it works!

I really rate Thornit but given it’s a solid, I’d be reluctant to put any in very gunky ears. I like Sandstone’s idea re a swab and her suggest that you worm him for tapes-that’s the first thing I’d tackle for a dog that’s losing weight.

One of mine once had tapeworm, they were very obvious in his poo and the eggs can often be seen as crust/scab like strands around the anus. Very quick to resolve with Drontal or an unbranded equivalent. I use Animed/Viovet or whoever’s cheapest and bought Cestem (cheaper than Drontal). I recommend feeding on an empty stomach (my 3 all threw up when given in food). It’s probably a hell of a lot cheaper than getting it from the vet-why are they giving you a product that doesn’t cover tapes?!

If your vet is newly qualified, I’d be reluctant to talk food with him/her. A friend told me he had half a day on nutrition for all species whilst training! Speak to a qualified nutritionist. I’m a raw food advocate and go through a kilo a day for 3 springers. What weight do you think the dog should be? Charts suggest 25kg is the lower end. Have you body scored him? My last 2 springers were whip thin as youngsters.

 

[Escapade]

Anyone know the typical moisture content of cold pressed foods?
If it's not vastly different from other dry foods, this seems to be exptionally low calorie

 

[Cinnamontoast]

Anyone know the typical moisture content of cold pressed foods?
If it's not vastly different from other dry foods, this seems to be exptionally low calorie

https://www.allaboutdogfood.co.uk/dog-food-reviews/2351/feelwells-grain-free-adult-duck

Looks like 8% for the one the OP is feeding. I wonder if there’s a common gunk causing ingredient in both the foods she has fed?

 

[Sandstone1]

I really rate Thornit but given it’s a solid, I’d be reluctant to put any in very gunky ears. I like Sandstone’s idea re a swab and her suggest that you worm him for tapes-that’s the first thing I’d tackle for a dog that’s losing weight.

One of mine once had tapeworm, they were very obvious in his poo and the eggs can often be seen as crust/scab like strands around the anus. Very quick to resolve with Drontal or an unbranded equivalent. I use Animed/Viovet or whoever’s cheapest and bought Cestem (cheaper than Drontal). I recommend feeding on an empty stomach (my 3 all threw up when given in food). It’s probably a hell of a lot cheaper than getting it from the vet-why are they giving you a product that doesn’t cover tapes?!

If your vet is newly qualified, I’d be reluctant to talk food with him/her. A friend told me he had half a day on nutrition for all species whilst training! Speak to a qualified nutritionist. I’m a raw food advocate and go through a kilo a day for 3 springers. What weight do you think the dog should be? Charts suggest 25kg is the lower end. Have you body scored him? My last 2 springers were whip thin as youngsters.

Nexgard spectra does all worms except tapeworm and possibly lungworm ( cant remember off hand) which is why you need to worm separately. It does fleas too. I really would worm for tapeworm and get his ears sorted. A swab will tell you what treatment he needs. As for food you need to find out if there is something else going on with him as all the food in the world will not help if you have something else going on.

 

[Escapade]

https://www.allaboutdogfood.co.uk/dog-food-reviews/2351/feelwells-grain-free-adult-duck

Looks like 8% for the one the OP is feeding. I wonder if there’s a common gunk causing ingredient in both the foods she has fed?

I wasn't sure as that breakdown is quite different from the website OP linked, perhaps an old formula ?

Anyway I tried a few calculations and all came in under 320kcal per 100g. Of course this is only a rough guide, but I did the same for RC Labrador and got just over 350kcal/100g (they have 364 on the bag) so if I'm in the ballpark I would change the food and touch base with the vet if he continues to drop

 

[Cinnamontoast]

I wasn't sure as that breakdown is quite different from the website OP linked, perhaps an old formula ?

Anyway I tried a few calculations and all came in under 320kcal per 100g. Of course this is only a rough guide, but I did the same for RC Labrador and got just over 350kcal/100g (they have 364 on the bag) so if I'm in the ballpark I would change the food and touch base with the vet if he continues to drop

OP’s food is saying 350 calories per 100g. I feed by weight of dog/food as a raw feeder so I have no idea what calories per 100g means. I imagine that’s quite high, given chicken breast is 165g.

 

[Escapade]

OP’s food is saying 350 calories per 100g. I feed by weight of dog/food as a raw feeder so I have no idea what calories per 100g means. I imagine that’s quite high, given chicken breast is 165g.

The analysis on AADF is very different, using that info i get 354.5kcal/100g

 

[Goldenstar]

My bitch who is small and slim is 23 kilo my dog who is very slim ( and mature is 34)

 

[neighneigh]

I think you are all right @Goldenstar @Chiffy and @Sandstone1, I need a more experienced vet really.
I don’t like offending people and the vet who has been dealing with him, is lovely but very recently qualified and isn’t seeming to take it very seriously.

I wanted him to have further tests/a scan/ear swab etc. last time we went but she persuaded me to try upping the food and give him another month.

I think because he’s so bright, excitable and friendly (labradorish!) when he goes to the vets and they just don’t want you to have obese pets, she didn’t seem that worried. I feel very worried though!!

@Christmascinnamoncookie thats not the one I’ve been feeding. The cold pressed Feelwells isn’t on that website.
This is it:
https://feelwells.co.uk/product/feelwells-cold-pressed-grain-free-duck-2-5kg/

I would expect him to be 29-30kg.
He was around 29kg, after he’d finished growing and looked great at that. Still slim but not skinny. He is now 25kg so quite a difference.
His ribs are visible and he’s even gone down a couple of notches on his collar.
My Dad and Sister have both commented about his weight loss and they aren’t doggy!

He’s on the vet’s plan for flea/worming, which is the Nexgard Spectra every month and then another tablet that he has every 6 months that covers anything that the Nexgard misses.

He’s having almost the recommended amount of food for a 40kg dog, according to the manufacturer and he’s only 25kg currently.
My 9 month old lab is on the same food, having the recommended amount for her weight and she’s doing really well on it.

It’s very worrying, I just need to know how to make him better.
Definitely think I need to request a different vet who will offer more advice/testing etc.

 

[Goldenstar]

 

[Goldenstar]

There they not great pictures

 

[Cinnamontoast]

As a basic, I’d check the other wormer covers tapes. You can send a fecal sample to Westgate labs (they’re quick) https://www.westgatelabs.co.uk/

Get the vet to check poo too for any issues.

I’m not convinced the food is the issue re weight loss.

 

[neighneigh]

@Christmascinnamoncookie I don’t think it’s the food either but am open to suggestions.

Thank you @Goldenstar, those photos are useful to compare.

I haven’t got that many side-on photos but will try to upload some from before the weight loss and some now.
He’s basically now got a very big head and paws and a greyhound looking body but the basics of calories in and calories burnt don’t seem to be explaining it.
I do feel it might be an allergy, something to do with his ears or something more serious ?

 

[SaddlePsych'D]

I would definitely lean towards further consultation with a vet/second opinion, that seems a lot of weight to lose. Even if the food isn't great/not the best match for him, that does seem extreme given you're feeding well over guidelines and he's still losing not even maintaining.