Unprovoked dog attack on owner

Arizahn, The OP asked, in her opening post, "could someone shed some light on why this might happen." I was replying to that, not anything else. There was no reference to wolves, I was replying to the OP, and no other thread, and I was talking from my own experience of having been attacked by my own 2yr old rescue GSD, and what I learnt from that.
 
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stormox said:
Arizahn, The OP asked, in her opening post, "could someone shed some light on why this might happen." I was replying to that, not anything else. There was no reference to wolves, I was replying to the OP, and no other thread, and I was talking from my own experience of having been attacked by my own 2yr old rescue GSD, and what I learnt from that.
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And I was responding to you as the dog had been described as mature, so not in puberty. So unfortunately the young alpha theory really did not fit.

I was rather aghast at the dog vs wolf debate posts that then followed your post. I have not got the IT skills needed to quote multiple posters, and I type slowly. Plus tablet crashed twice. Hence my reply.

Sorry if there was some confusion there.
 
I would also like to extend my apologies for being so flippant on a serious thread, I hadn't fully read through. My comment was in reaction to one later post which contained so much misinformation I would be frothing to leap in and argue the point if I hadn't heard similar half a dozen times already this week and it's unfortunately left me rather jaded and sour of late.
 
Wibbling over whether to reply to this again or not.

OK. Here goes.

I believe there are dogs which are genetically inclined to be, let's not use the D word, shall we use 'ballsy' instead. The same dog that has been given, in his genes, the balls to take on an adversary, human, animal, otherwise, can often be ballsy enough to put it up to their owners.

Do I think all dogs are wolves or do I think such dogs live in abundance in pet households all up and down the UK, plotting to take over the world one sofa at a time, no and do I think the dominance theory has been chucked about way too much, of course.

Do I think the dog in this thread is one of these dogs, I have no idea, but I did include 'genetics/maturity' as an option for the reasons mentioned above.
 
Faracat, have you had any news on how your sisters friend is doing?

We can all speculate on why the dog attacked but in all honesty, the best that can come from this now in light of the seriousness of the attack is that we are all reminded that dogs are their own species. We anthropomorphise them day in and day out. Even when we convince ourselves that we don't do it, we are doing it in some way or another because we have bought them into our human worlds. I am fed up to the back teeth of seeing videos all over the place of people letting babies jump up and down on huge dogs while parents think it's all so cute. The truth is, even a experienced owner with well behaved dogs can become a victim and it happens more than we hear about publicly.

I personally believe that dogs are not and cannot be evil and just decide to attack. There is always a reason and there is always a warning. What we don't always know is what the reason is and what we don't always notice is the warning. There is also a very real chance that attacks like this are rooted in physical or neurological issues that make any impending aggression extremely difficult to detect.

I don't think there is any blame to be apportioned here, nor do I think that the reasons necessarily need to be discovered save that a PM could give a little closure "if" there was a physical cause such as a tumor. There are no guarantees that anything will be found though so it could mean more stress for the owner who I believe is probably in a great deal of physical and emotional pain as it is.

We will never know what makes our animals tick sometimes. We take them on easily, but when things like this happen, we should remember that they can just happen and that they don't always only happen to people who lack knowledge or experience.

Above all, my thoughts are with your sisters friend Faracat. I love my dogs so very much, I cannot even comprehend the turmoil she must be in. My thoughts and prayers are with her.
 
CaveCanem said:
Wibbling over whether to reply to this again or not.

OK. Here goes.

I believe there are dogs which are genetically inclined to be, let's not use the D word, shall we use 'ballsy' instead. The same dog that has been given, in his genes, the balls to take on an adversary, human, animal, otherwise, can often be ballsy enough to put it up to their owners.

Do I think all dogs are wolves or do I think such dogs live in abundance in pet households all up and down the UK, plotting to take over the world one sofa at a time, no and do I think the dominance theory has been chucked about way too much, of course.

Do I think the dog in this thread is one of these dogs, I have no idea, but I did include 'genetics/maturity' as an option for the reasons mentioned above.
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I think there are more trained sharks in the world than there are truly dominant dogs. I do believe they exist, but like you, not to the degree than many shout about.

I think the dog in this thread was very much loved and adored by its owner and the more I think about this the more I believe that we actually don't need to have an answer for everything. Just a terrible, terrible event. :(
 
Faracat, we can only hope that the friend of your sister's continues to recover. A clearly and obviously sustained attack must have been terrifying, and really doesn't bare thinking about. Except that you have asked the question, and without actually being present, the facts that are available sound to be so "unlikely" (though I understand that the event happened), that it would leave most confused.

For all the dogs that I've ever owned, or dealt with, I've yet to have one with any form of brain disorder or tumour, or at least none that I was aware of, so this is only supposition now, but I would have thought that if a brain tumour was the reason for this behaviour, then as the tumour grew, and the discomfort became greater, so the dog's behaviour would have worsened, so that there would have been at least some indication that all was not well. Understandable though it was, it's a pity that the dog was destroyed as any evidence in the form of the animal will by now have gone up in smoke, literally!

For a dog to turn without apparent reason or indication and to be so ferocious in its attack is confusing, in the extreme. Just a couple of questions; Had the lady concerned had the dog from a puppy? and if the dog was a pure bred animal, then presumably he had a pedigree, and I'm only wondering if there may be any evidence of a predisposition to such erratic behaviour, and from the point of view of the dog's known antecedents. Someone with experience of the breed and a knowledge of pedigrees would be the person to consult.

The reason for the attack will most probably never be known, I realise that, but none the less, it's very strange.

Alec.
 
It is very difficult to understand why or how a dog can have a sudden onset of untypical behaviour.

Brain tumours can be asymptomatic ( as I know from family experience ) but usually there are signs, however subtle.
Pain can be a trigger - wasp sting? - but rarely will an acute pain trigger more than a snap rather than a sustained attack.
I know of a collie that made a similar attack on a child at home. When PTS it had a pencil stub pushed down it's ear.

I have had dogs with suspected rage syndrome in for assessment. Owners concerned about aggressive behaviour but unable to pinpoint a cause sent to have the dog checked over in a less clinical environment than the vets or a class. About one in ten had probable rage - most were just without boundaries. Rage is a variation of epilepsy and can be inherited.

The worst was a black lab from working lines. The owners first dog so they refused to believe how "wrong" he was despite advice from a behaviourist vet & refusals to allow him into several kennels - hence coming to me in my "lion pen" - a kennel set up for dogs that couldn't be handled. The owners thought he just wanted his own way & would bite if told to do something he didn't want to do and only had him PTS the week he put three of their family in A&E. This dog could go from smiley waggy lab to leaping snarling snapping & with red eyes in a blink.

Faracat, without a PM we will never know but I hope your sister's friend makes a full recovery.
 
Alec Swan said:
Faracat, we can only hope that the friend of your sister's continues to recover. A clearly and obviously sustained attack must have been terrifying, and really doesn't bare thinking about. Except that you have asked the question, and without actually being present, the facts that are available sound to be so "unlikely" (though I understand that the event happened), that it would leave most confused.

For all the dogs that I've ever owned, or dealt with, I've yet to have one with any form of brain disorder or tumour, or at least none that I was aware of, so this is only supposition now, but I would have thought that if a brain tumour was the reason for this behaviour, then as the tumour grew, and the discomfort became greater, so the dog's behaviour would have worsened, so that there would have been at least some indication that all was not well. Understandable though it was, it's a pity that the dog was destroyed as any evidence in the form of the animal will by now have gone up in smoke, literally!

For a dog to turn without apparent reason or indication and to be so ferocious in its attack is confusing, in the extreme. Just a couple of questions; Had the lady concerned had the dog from a puppy? and if the dog was a pure bred animal, then presumably he had a pedigree, and I'm only wondering if there may be any evidence of a predisposition to such erratic behaviour, and from the point of view of the dog's known antecedents. Someone with experience of the breed and a knowledge of pedigrees would be the person to consult.

The reason for the attack will most probably never be known, I realise that, but none the less, it's very strange.

Alec.
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While I agree with all your logic in this post, I do know someone who had a horse suddenly turn incredibly aggressive overnight, lungeing at the door and hurling itself at the walls and door. It was PTS and turned out to have a brain tumour. I'd known that horse for twenty years prior, and it had always been your classic lazy, laid back horse.
 
Your friend will never really know what caused this which must make everything so much more difficult. To be unexpectedly attacked by a family pet must be extremely scary, we all live with our animals on trust and it is normal that she would be looking for some kind of explanation to try to understand what happen. The dog must have had something seriously wrong with it, whether it was a tumour or a neurological problem or something else, but there is a lot we don't know and without a post mortem there is little chance of figuring this out. Perhaps when she is well enough to leave hospital (which I hope will be very soon) she would benefit from some post traumatic stress disorder counselling - what she's been through sounds very traumatic and it's bound to leave emotional scars.
 
My dog did it he is a Weimaraner x Doberman I am only 5ft 4 he weighs more and is taller than me but I knew the sign and it was being stock still and staring not the growl that everyone thinks due to this I knew what was coming and able to follow my trainers instructions should that point occur I have a very loving dog who would not harm me or my son who is 3 years old and are the best of friends but people do forget they are pack animals and need to know there place I also have the view that sometimes it is due to either dominance or could be linked to a medical problem. I am very sorry to hear about the attack and hope she comes through it without too many physical or mental scars
 
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