Update on Adrian. Can yucky 'bits' REALLY cause this behaviour???

catembi

catembi

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Bit of a bizarre one, tbh...

The practice owner has just been out to see Adrian & assess our progress re spavins. He trotted up fine, then I rode him in the school & luckily he put in a fab performance... ears back, planting, bunny hopping, threatening to rear & generally not wanting to go forward... the works.

The vet said that he's sound & his hock action is fine... but he thinks he's uncomfy somewhere else. He reckons it's his groin region, so sedated him & had a good feel, & I've got the wonderful job of putting aqueous cream 'up there' for the next week.
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He's also got to go on bute for 7 days & after that we'll reassess.

He agreed that Adrian was a very cross horse, & that yucky bits was the cause rather than anything to do with his hocks. So def NOT my riding & the solution is NOT to farm him out to be hunted. (For those who didn't see my orig post, another vet wanted me to send him to her trainer on full livery to be hunted cos apparently it was my fault that he wasn't going fwd.)

Could the prob all along have been that he's got yucky 'bits'...??
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I honestly *do* have a quick look when he gets it out, & it's never looked too bad to me, in fact the bit you can see looks quite clean, so I've always left well enough alone...

OMG I'll be soooooo
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if my horse has had 4 or 5 months off competing & a £1,500 vet bill for spavins if it turns out that the issue has been 'personal hygiene...'

Has anyone else had any experience of this, please...?? Obv I'll be delighted if the hocks aren't to blame, but it seems a bit too good to be true...
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I have googled this and can't find a single reference to lameness associated with "sheath" (except tendon sheath) or smegma. I've never heard of it before and I personally will be very surprised if your Vet is right. The behaviour was extreme if you can't see anything wrong with his "bits" and he has had no discharge. I could see that cystitis or bladder stones might cause it, but he isn't advising treatment for that and I wonder what on earth the bute is supposed to do? It's very likely that at the end of a week he'll be better behaved because of the bute and you will still have no idea whatsoever what was/is wrong with him.

Horses are self-regulating in that region and the vast majority of geldings will never have their sheaths cleaned out. I've never done one in about 60+ gelding-years and never had a problem once.

This sounds really, really odd. The behaviour you describe is often caused by hind limb suspensory ligament desmitis, which either goes hand in hand with spavin or is frequently misdiagnosed as spavin. Has he been properly scanned for desmitis?

Sorry not to be more positive!
 
He is sound atm but he absolutely doesn't want to work. He's never been noticeably lame as the spavins are in both hocks so they were balancing each other out.

Oh well, if he's still having a hissy fit when we reassess, we'll have to look for another cause...

Thank you for your thoughts...
 
That is absolutely typical of a description of behaviour of a horse with suspensory desmitis. The vet spots the spavins because they are obvious, and misses the desmitis because it's hidden inside the leg. For some reason it often shows as irritable or dangerous behaviour and not as lameness at all. Refusing to move forwards, rearing, suddenly stopping in the middle of a dressage movement, bucking.

I second the referral to Newmarket, it's a very difficult thing to properly diagnose.

Let's hope we are wrong and your vet is a genius!
 
I read your post the other night and could see great similarities with an old horse we had who started to have behavioural issues and not be quite forward or through.. still sound to the naked eye but just not quite right to the rider. Local vet tried but could not pinpoint and so we asked for a referal to the AHT. One of the main vets there examined horse and his initial reaction was that had it been an examination for soundness he would have passed him as sound but as he could see how concerned we were he persisted in the examination and decided to lunge on a semi hard surface. After 5 minutes or so he began to see an issue that warranted furthur work- cue scans and blocks.. Resultant diagnosis was p.s.d. which was a bit of a surprise to all concerned. I think a referral as suggested above would be a very sensible idea.
 
Another vote for PSD I am afraid - very like our boy when he had it - never ever looked lame. He just napped bucked and refused to go forward. I would recommend Sue Dyson at the AHT - she will also check his fronts/his back and everything else. How much longer do you have insurance for? I know this is an ongoing problem and if you are running out of time I would throw everything I had left in one good hit. I find it hard to believe a mucky sheath could cause this.
 
Oh dear...that's exactly what he's doing. Napping, bucking & refusing to go forward. He's naturally quite straightforward & is too laid back to nap or bother being 'naughty'.

Insurance claim started on 15th Sept & I've got £3,500 left for spavins / mystery lameness.

If it IS PSD, is that pretty well it for him? His job is BD/BSJA & he was at one time looking quite promising for both. If that's it, I think I'll leave him in the field & get an unbacked 3 yo & start the whole merry cycle all over again. My other horse is 37 so won't be around indefinitely so I'll be back to 2 eventually.

I'd be happier to retire from PSD than spavin. I know that arthritis in people is v painful, esp in the cold, & I'd have been v doubtful about quality of life. Hey ho, I'll bring up the PSD thing at our assessment in a week's time.
 
I was told that spavins and PSD are very closely related and its often hard to see PSD if the horse has spavins and that often you need the spavins to be medicated first before you deal with the PSD. PSD was not ruled out with my horse and I was told from the beginning he would most likely have it but in the end the hocks came good and PSD was ruled out.
 
I'm afraid so, it's almost always a write-off. I don't understand why, but they don't seem able to recover from it. Thank goodness you have the option to retire him, but what a shame you might have to
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Agree with lec - our lad recovered well. He than went on to do both front collaterals which put paid to everything but was sound after PSD at 5 - went on to compete sucessfully at BE but did not jump (daughters choice as she felt it might put more stress on him). Some people have more luck than others but you need to rest/paddock rest for long enough and do careful rehab and shockwave can help sometimes. Not all of them have the op - ours didnt. I would really really get a good lameness workup by a specialist vet and then you know what is going on. You have plenty of choice round your way.
 
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Agree with lec - our lad recovered well. He than went on to do both front collaterals which put paid to everything but was sound after PSD at 5 - went on to compete sucessfully at BE but did not jump (daughters choice as she felt it might put more stress on him). Some people have more luck than others but you need to rest/paddock rest for long enough and do careful rehab and shockwave can help sometimes. Not all of them have the op - ours didnt. I would really really get a good lameness workup by a specialist vet and then you know what is going on. You have plenty of choice round your way.

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What my mum should have written was he went on to compete successfully at BD but yes the thought was right
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. I still believe had he not had crap front foot confirmation he would have stayed sound behind. Good luck.
 
We had the problems with psd in the early 2000's when it was just becoming a diagnosis in its own right. We used up £3000 of insurance fees just getting a diagnosis. As the source of the problem was not clear he had two trips through the 'nuclear' body scanner....not cheap....and these did not reveal any major hotspots . The main result came from nerve blocks with a test rider assessing the difference before and after injections. We saw Sue Dyson on our second referral to Newmarket and she was excellent. I believe these days with shockwave and operations the success rate can be much higher but prompt diagnosis and treatment are important before it reaches a chronic stage.
 
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I'm afraid so, it's almost always a write-off. I don't understand why, but they don't seem able to recover from it. Thank goodness you have the option to retire him, but what a shame you might have to
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Gosh, don't tell the 4* eventers who've had the op that - no-one has let them know and they don't seem to realise they are write-offs, they might fall over if they find out
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No, the op has a v high success rate from what I have heard about it.
 
They cut the nerves supplying the top of the suspensory ligament and cut the fascia so the suspensory has room to swell. It has a 70% success rate.
 
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