Update on new horse not settling... more problems!

[_jetset_]

Once she settled a little (stopped galloping around) she has spent the entire day with her head over the hedge that separates the mares from the geldings as she is in season. But this has caused problems in the geldings field because they have been running up and down the hedge (she is a pretty cute looking mare, LOL!)

The problem is, some gelding owners are worried that their horses will do some damage to themselves if I turn Grace out again tomorrow, which I completely understand because everyone's main priority is their own horse and that is how it should be.

I would feel awful keeping her in all day, but what other option do I have if I want to keep the status quo? While she is in season she is going to be near the geldings as the mares won't accept her at the moment (only been in one day) so is going to cause the geldings to run around again tomorrow!

There is no other field she could go in, as they are being rested for next year (the ones they have been in all summer) and I doubt the YO would want Grace galloping around in them when they are so wet.

Oh God, I just don't know what to do!

 

[LauraBR]

GAH!!!!!!!!!!! your yard sounds so much like mine! Leave her OUT and let them get on with it.

There is no easy way of introducing new horses to a yard- they have to sort it out themselves. By all means boot your horse up and let others do the same but don't be bullied by these people!

 

[GTs]

If they are concerned about their horses getting hurt, they can leave theirs in! You should not disrupt your new horse to accomodate them - their horses are 50% of the problem.

 

[FMM]

Sorry - don't agree with your responses really. If the horses were all happy before your horse arrived, it does seem a bit unfair that one of the settled horses may turn himself inside out because of a new horse. It would seriously upset me if that happened. Perhaps it is more of a YO problem. There should be a field where a horse can acclimatise itself to new surroundings. And surely there is some sort of isolation procedure to ensure that no diseases have been brought onto the yard? (apologies if this has already been done).

You have to be considerate to existing horse owners (which it sounds like you are being as you are worried about what to do next).

Is there any way (if there are no other fields that can be used) that your mare can be turned out for a limited time with only one other mare and a few geldings next door so she can get used to everything?

 

[flohelf]

Well said GT !!!

Gosh! how paranoid people can get once they stopped thinking ...That horses are made to live in herds and sort out their own hierarchy without human interference.
So much for the silly conditioning we've imposed on these creatures we pretend to love...

 

[FMM]

But why should another horse get hurt in the melee when there may be a better way of doing it? How would you like your horse to be injured? It is bad enough when they hurt themselves through normal play, without doing damage by galloping around up and down the fence, not to mention the damage they are doing to the fields as well!

 

[_jetset_]

That's the problem, this is just not possible. She was wormed in the morning and that's the only criteria the yard requires. We don't have an isolation period.

There are no other fields that could be used and no way of doing it gradually tomorrow because everyone goes before work and turns out at 7am. I won't be turning her out until 10-11am (saddle fitter coming) and will be bringing her in at 4pm so that she is not at the gate when the other mare owners come to bring their horses in.

There were a few problems when they moved into these fields a few months ago when a mare comes in season, but it's just unfortunate that Grace is new and in season. I only saw the problem when I went to bring Grace in. As I led her away they all started galloping up and down the hedge shouting to her. But I pressume this had been happening all day.

 

[LauraBR]

I understand what you are saying but in my experience horses who have been at the same yard happily who get moved to different fields react in the same way.

They need to sort out the pecking order and it's tough but ultimately I don't see an easy way other than boot up, and keep fingers crossed? I have tried the 'turn out gradually' and it goes well before once all in they bicker when you aren't there.

 

[_jetset_]

Lzt... Thanks for that! I feel so upset this has happened, especially because she has been so good in other ways. She is fantastic to lead around and I took her in the school tonight (my mare went absolutely bonkers when she first moved to the yard and went to the yard) and she was really really good on the lunge.

But this field business has really upset me

 

[FMM]

How quickly would one of the mare supplements work if the biggest problem is her being in season? Or could she perhaps have a jab from the vet to stop her being in season? (no idea as I have only just bought my first ever mare and she is not at all marey - yet)

What was she like in her old yard - she may be like this all the time in which case everyone is going to have to get used to it!

 

[_jetset_]

She is no worse than my mare when she is in season... although she is in foal at the moment. In fact, she is marginally better... I am not a big fan of supplements for mares as i tried the majority of them on Hannah and they didn't work so I felt they were a waste of time. The only thing that worked on her was valerian, but I would rather let Grace settle a bit before going down that route. It's not competition legal you see, and I would like to leave something like that until I know her a little better.

 

[GTs]

There is a certain point when owning horses that you just have to let go - you can not control everything, especially when it comes to herd politics. I had my horses in a field of 30 other horses, yes there were kicks, and bites and my horses were not eating enough, but I can not go up to someone and be like 'can you have a word with your horse to stop being a piggy' - it does not work like that.

 

[Clodagh]

I think the being in season may be being caused by the new boys next door, could have encouraged the hormones! I'm with FMM, my horse was killed last year after a livery kicked her, so am neurotic! Also , can't see the answer, sorry...

 

[_jetset_]

Thanks anyway Clodagh, if you do think of something, you know where I am...

 

[Skhosu]

hmmm... is her being wormed not going to mean she will now put worms into the field?
Don't like this whole no-isolation, no separation thing.
We always give ours at least a day or two with the steadiest member so they have a pal they know. Nine is quite a lot IMO to be stuck out with.
As for the geldings....not sure what to do there. Could you exercise her lots first so she's more interested in eating? Give her a small breakkie?Some of this is excess worrying, but I would never turn out immediately into a large group and think the yard should have it better organised! How would you feel if a new horse was upsetting your preggie mare?
At least you are concerned for the er liveries!

 

[LauraBR]

So sorry to hear about your horse Clodagh

Horses will be horses and as Clodagh says, there is no easy answer.

Poor Sam was kicked the hell out of when I got him, couldn't ride him for 3 weeks. That was day 2- he is now 100% happy in his field and he knows where he stands in the pecking order (gone from boss to bottom).

Don't get me wrong, it is hideous, but in my experience no amount of meeting in different circumstances help when it comes to field politics. Sadly.

 

[brighteyes]

Except wild horses don't wear shoes and don't live in enclosed fields! The smaller the field, the more territorial the inmates.

 

[Maesfen]

I have to say I am with FMM on this one.

Your YO is being very lax about introducing a new horse IMO; it should have been isolated at first to check healthwise and it should have been given a seperate paddock for at least the first week, then one horse added to it at a time.
If it was my horse I would be apesh**te at them for not sticking to the correct procedure, they are accidents waiting to happen and who will be taking the blame? - it will be you which is not fair. Your YO should be taking some responsibility for this I'm afraid but it's also unfortunate that she happens to be in season too.
Unless you can introduce them gradually to each other this galloping about will happen far more than it should. All horses gallop when turned out in a new field let alone when they have been thrust into a herd in a place they know nothing about. It's not rocket science, just sensible precautions for everyone concerned and the one I feel most sorry for is your new mare - a new place, new people and a bunch of mares that want to kill her and a bunch of louts the other side who want to rape her - put yourself in her shoes, how would you be acting?!

 

[_jetset_]

She was wormed yesterday early afternoon and then turned out this morning, which is what we do on the yard. Also, she has recently had a worm count at her old home which showed up clear but we have to worm (I am the worm police for the yard actually) a new horse no matter what.

The yards around us are all the same regarding introducing new horses... I did try to do it gradually as I turned her out with just my mare, but then people wanted to turn out so I didn't really have a choice to be honest. She was a little unsettled with just Hannah too, but the other mares would just not let her in the group (she actually got kicked herself this afternoon by one of them).

I am concerned for the other liveries, but I also have to think of Grace too. She has never really lived in a stable (she has lived out 24/7) so I really don't want to keep her in as she has been so good in her stable so far. The other problem is that I don't think she has ever been in a herd before as she does not seem to know how to act with others. She is frightened to death of the others after being chased, so she is in no way causing any problems with regards to kicking etc.

Oh God, this is just so awful! I just don't know what to do.

 

[sojeph]

Can you fence a small area off with electric in the field away from the boys, maybe with your other mare for company.

 

[_jetset_]

I know what you are saying Maesfenhorse, and I respect your opinion as I think you have been right on a lot of things. But there has never before been a problem with the way they are introduced, and there has been quite a few introduced recently. Although, I am not saying this is the right way to go about things by any means.

We do not have another field where she can go, and to be honest, I do not think she would go out on her own even if she could because of the way she behaved today.

There was a big difference from the morning to the afternoon... she was quiet in the afternoon, just stood eating and flirting with the geldings whereas she was running around (completely on her own) in the morning.

I feel really sorry for Grace, because you are right, she is in a new place, with a new person and all the horses are chasing her away. I am not sure about rape, I think she would be quite willing, he he!

I hate being made out to be a horrible person, because I am honestly not! I am worried about the other horses, but I am also worried about poor Grace. i honesty don't think she would stay in all day as she has never ever done that before in her life. I can't really work her a lot as she has been turned away for a year after being broken... the other problem is that she is not greedy at all. She is not that interested in the grass to be honest.

 

[flohelf]

Rebecca, I really understand how you feel...

No matter how annoyed I get about some of these paranoid liveries overreacting in many cases

I really believe you should give it a couple more days (if you can get the others on your yard to remember how horses function and give your mare the time she needs to feel at home )
She'll settle down, I'm sure. Please keep us posted

 

[_jetset_]

Thanks Blackeventer... I know she needs a bit more time to settle in as I know how long it takes horses to settle into the herd.

But I am a softy, and I hate having people annoyed at me, even if there is not much I can do about it. I will do everything to keep the peace (Pisces trait I am afraid) but I just do not think it is right to keep her in.

 

[flohelf]

DON'T ! Keep her in. Better to let her get it over with both ways: For her to get used to the others and for the others to get used to her.
And I'm sure that when she'll be out of season, things will fall into place. Then next time she IS in season again, by then they will all know where to stand with one another.
Hope you can keep all the paranoid liveries in their place...Like in the herd LOL!!!

 

[Fiona]

I may be confused here, but am trying to look on the positive side. If she was much quieter in the afternoon than in the morning then surely that is a good sign, and perhaps she was starting to settle down. Even if she is ostracised by the mare group for a few days, as long as she is quiet and not charging about then surely the other livery owners/YO will be happy with that. I think you should try again tomorrow and see what happens. Horses to be booted up if the other owners will feel better with that.
Apart fomr that, I can't think of anything, when had horses at livery they were always in small groups of 2 or 3 per field, now when have them at home we have 2 small adjacent fields with high post and rail between them which can be used to introduce new horses to each other.
Hope tomorrow goes better.

Fiona

 

[_jetset_]

I think I am going to try her again in the morning and try to keep popping down (or get my husband to if I am too busy). Poor baby... I hate the fact I have taken her away from her Mum and brother!

 

[Fiona]

It is so hard to be rational when you feel like you have uprooted poor horsie from all their chums. We bought my mare from her breeder so she had never been anywhere before she came home with us. She was in little field beside the other 2, and getting on well. On 4th or 5th day, we had a freak mini tornado with hailstones and she went completely mad ( I felt so guilty as she didn't have rug on yet) but we were able to recover from that. It still took her a full 6 months I would say before she felt at home in our herd (2 mares, 1 gelding) but we were lucky because she was at the bottom of the pecking order, I always think if they know their place (ie at the bottom), then there is less bother than when they try to fight it out for a higher position.
Really hope it goes well for you tomorrow.
Any chance you could ride her before turning her out as she might be a bit tired, and more likely to just put her head down and eat.
Fiona

 

[mrdarcy]

Hi Rebecca

Sorry you're having teething troubles. It's difficult when you're on a livery yard and have to follow certain rules. Ideally I would always keep a new horse in for the first day or two so they get to know their new herd mates over a stable door at first, before turning out with one steadying influence - that's where my Ged comes in handy!

However in your circumstances and because Grace is used to being out, like you said, it's not fair to keep her in. Just for a few days could she go out at night with Hannah (well rugged up of course!), so the two of them get to know each other without distractions in the other fields? That way she'd be in during the day when the geldings were out. Btw she most likely has come in season because she's moved yards i.e. to a new herd which is the best place to conceive and diversify the gene pool.

If this isn't possible then just keep turning her out as you have been doing. At least during the week the other livery owners will mostly be at work and not around to worry about their horses. And by next weekend Grace should have settled into her new routine.

 

[SirenaXVI]

I tend to agree that it would be wrong to keep her in, this will do nothing to help get her integrated into the mare herd. If she was more settled in the afternoon then that is a good sign. Mares do tend to push new girls out at first, but give it a couple of weeks (perhaps sooner) and they will accept her.

Poor you I do feel sorry for you, and your mare, but also think that the other liveries will just have to understand for the time being and I totally agree with your reluctance to give her anything to stop her seasons, I would not want to mess up her hormones either!

Am sure things will work themselves out sooner rather than later, but have to say that this post has reminded me of all that is bad about livery yards!

 

[Sal_E]

What a nightmare! How about electirc fencing down the side of the shared fence line to keep the geldings away from her - if they are far enough apart then surely they'll lose interest?

Other than that, I can't really see why the geldings will get hurt, all they are doing is running up & down! (assuming they're not fighting over her...).

It may be an idea to give her a good lunge before she's turned out so that at least she is not feeling fresh.

No point in keeping her in - she's a mare & she's often going to be in season! Mares in season & geldings always end up tarting, however well they know each other.