Update: she couldn't be in foal could she?

Spring Feather said:
From a breeders perspective I don't think OP has it covered at all.

Is OP using the same vet who told her that a mare was safe to go in with a gelding who was only castrated 2 weeks prior?

The same vet who does not think it imperative to scan the mare before 17 days to make sure she is not carrying twins?

A vet who does not advise the mare owner of all vaccinations which should have been given to the mare prior to foaling?

This vet has been highly irresponsible and potentially could have put this mares life at serious risk. As it is I do not think the mare is pregnant and if I was the owner I would be very relieved that she isn't.
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Spring feather from your post you have not read the entire thread. NO not the same vet, no vet ever told me that it was not imperative to scan before 17 days, it was only last month that we thought she could be in foal, close to full term and way way after 17 days! this was not planned, it was as a result of her being in contact with ben post gelding. The vet and I discussed vaccinations, I am happy our discussion. Every pregnancy carries risk, personal choice, I would not have 'put' her in foal, but if she is in foal, it can't be undone and she stands as good a chance as any if she is of producing a healthy foal.

I moved from an area, where horses were absolutely mollycoddled, you wouldn't dare do anything out of order or that was not 'seen as the done thing' for fear of being frowned upon and driven out of town! It felt really strange to move down here and be allowed to leave your horses out in the winter, fully clip and double rug if you want to, ride with or without shoes, use a worm count, not a worming programme, chain harrow and rest, not poo pick. I am far more laid back, I will admit it but it suits me and my horses, and as far as I am concerned if they are happy and healthy that is my only concern, people do things differently, it does not always make them wrong
 
Personally I don't think she looks pregnant, when my maiden was, her 'bulge' was further back, if you looked at her from behind it was a sort of triangle shape, not just round...if she is in foal they often look bigger on one side to the other [due to the foal's position] so you could check for this..

That said we have had mares who don't look pregnant at all the suddenly bloom :rolleyes:
 
I would have put money on her not being, but then a mare at the yard dropped a surprise foal on Wednesday (nobody had a clue as she must have got pregnant whilst on loan).
 
Just a couple of thoughts: if OP's mare is in foal, then OP needs to remember that she's age 18 and this might be her 1st foal. If so, she may well need more care than a younger mare. Secondly, there are far too many planned but un-sellable foals in Britain today, never mind an unplanned one. OP what will happen to the foal? And it's no good saying you'll keep it because the foal could have 30 years of life ahead of it and pound to a penny your circumstances will change during that time. My rescue shetland mare Molly (rescued after the Christmas Day appeal on this forum almost 2 years ago) came from an interim home where she could have been covered accidentally. She got fatter and fatter and I would spend hours on hands and knees beside her staring at her belly to see if I could see movement. Many, many times, I swear I did. Like you, I'd never have deliberately put her in foal but was enchanted at the thought of an "accidental" foal. But the more certain I became that she WAS pregnant (posted pix on here, small majority said not pregnant) the more I realised that the world did NOT need another 2-a-penny shetland foal from a sweetly ordinary 16yr old shetland mare. My YO threatened to drag me to Llanybydder, our local meat market, if I wanted to see some cute shetland foals ... see them before they went off to slaughter that is. I got the vets out for blood tests but before the flipping results came back, Molly started flirting outrageously with her 16hh gelding boyfriend, so I pretty much knew the results would come back negative, which they did. Wish she'd come into season the week before to save me the costs of the pregnancy testing!!!

OP, be careful what you wish for x
 
Box_Of_Frogs said:
Just a couple of thoughts: if OP's mare is in foal, then OP needs to remember that she's age 18 and this might be her 1st foal. If so, she may well need more care than a younger mare. Secondly, there are far too many planned but un-sellable foals in Britain today, never mind an unplanned one. OP what will happen to the foal? And it's no good saying you'll keep it because the foal could have 30 years of life ahead of it and pound to a penny your circumstances will change during that time. My rescue shetland mare Molly (rescued after the Christmas Day appeal on this forum almost 2 years ago) came from an interim home where she could have been covered accidentally. She got fatter and fatter and I would spend hours on hands and knees beside her staring at her belly to see if I could see movement. Many, many times, I swear I did. Like you, I'd never have deliberately put her in foal but was enchanted at the thought of an "accidental" foal. But the more certain I became that she WAS pregnant (posted pix on here, small majority said not pregnant) the more I realised that the world did NOT need another 2-a-penny shetland foal from a sweetly ordinary 16yr old shetland mare. My YO threatened to drag me to Llanybydder, our local meat market, if I wanted to see some cute shetland foals ... see them before they went off to slaughter that is. I got the vets out for blood tests but before the flipping results came back, Molly started flirting outrageously with her 16hh gelding boyfriend, so I pretty much knew the results would come back negative, which they did. Wish she'd come into season the week before to save me the costs of the pregnancy testing!!!

OP, be careful what you wish for x
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Wise words indeed - I had an unplanned foal just drop on me nearly two years ago, didn't know until it joined mum in the stable ! (mum was bought as a childs riding pony)charming little foal but nothing special, just another coloured cob type filly, she lovely and don't get me wrong love her to bits but, what am I going to do with her ? being very honest she is not going to set alight any records in BE, BS or BD and conformation not going to cut it on the show ring, So my best bet is to try and make sure she's handled, early education is solid and this has taken an awful lot of time, time I really don't have and could have been better spent training my own horse. Just to make sure she has the best hoof forward in life.

I would try and get it confirmed in foal or not - save time, money & stress.
 
I couldnt comment either way wether she is or isnt as its not something I have experienced but.....

why on earth go to all the trouble of preparing everything etc and not actually knowing wether she is pregnant or not?

For the sake of a few quid and safetys sake too I would be getting the vet out to visit you.

Madness.........
 
Well I imagine she'll know for definite now.

But I think she's been pretty negligent leaving a horse with a belly like that without being certain it was pregnant. But that's my opinion and I hope that she has dropped a healthy sprog now and all is well.
 
OMG vet said it would be safe to turn a mare out with a gelded colt after 2 1/2 weeks post op??!!! !!!!!!! they can remain fertile (little swimemers in the tubes as my vet calls them!) for 6 -8 weeks post op!! so yes there is a chance that she's pregnant! lol! I'd be writing a stern letter to said vet and copy to the practise manager if I were you! Save this from happening again!

Regarding your mare, I do agree though that she does just look overweight, though they can all differ, but for comparison, this is my mare at 315 days, she was maiden too:
P080309_0828.jpg


has the vet not pd'd her or scanned her to confirm or not? I find it funny that you've suspected for a while and prepared for it, but not actually had it confirmed officially?
 
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Hi,
I think there are actually a LOT of vets out there who say different things re gelding... when my boy was done earlier this year... we were talking about his after care and i said 'its 6 weeks isnt it that he has to stay away from mares...' (i had never had one cut before but 6 weeks was in my brain for some reason... his reply was..... 'you're fine after 2 weeks, infact, its actually ok after 48hours as any sperm thats already been produced cant really last longer than that, but your def fine after 2 weeks...' i turned him back out with another filly after 20 days.... when the next vet came on the yard i asked her... she was mortified at what he had told me (and hes a long established vet who is meant to be their repo vet...)

I have also had... a maiden who pretty much showed no signs of foaling before she foaled, she didnt really even look infoal... so much so the stallion owner had been to see her and was talking about me using the return that spring!

I have also though had, a mare confirmed infoal... continue on to have a phantom, you could see 'movement', she had milk etc... no foal!

I have also had 2 different vets do internals and not be able to tell me one way or the other! (1 was newky qualified so not that experienced, the other is maybe in his late 40's if not older and has been a vet a long time).

My advice to the OP, based on what they have already said is, IF your mares goes over what you think is her due date by a couple of weeks, get the vet to do an internal just so you can then get some sleep - the vet should be able to feel at that stage....(and if they are not sure, then you wait some more but from when it happened to me, i was told most vets dont get it wrong at that gestation)
 
Sorry, not kept up - did you intend to breed a foal?

I expect everyone knows where I stand on random breeding. I hope any foal turns out to be something useful and not another Turner's Special. Why even risk putting a mare in with an unproven, recently cut colt?
 
Box_Of_Frogs said:
Just a couple of thoughts: if OP's mare is in foal, then OP needs to remember that she's age 18 and this might be her 1st foal. If so, she may well need more care than a younger mare. Secondly, there are far too many planned but un-sellable foals in Britain today, never mind an unplanned one. OP what will happen to the foal? And it's no good saying you'll keep it because the foal could have 30 years of life ahead of it and pound to a penny your circumstances will change during that time. My rescue shetland mare Molly (rescued after the Christmas Day appeal on this forum almost 2 years ago) came from an interim home where she could have been covered accidentally. She got fatter and fatter and I would spend hours on hands and knees beside her staring at her belly to see if I could see movement. Many, many times, I swear I did. Like you, I'd never have deliberately put her in foal but was enchanted at the thought of an "accidental" foal. But the more certain I became that she WAS pregnant (posted pix on here, small majority said not pregnant) the more I realised that the world did NOT need another 2-a-penny shetland foal from a sweetly ordinary 16yr old shetland mare. My YO threatened to drag me to Llanybydder, our local meat market, if I wanted to see some cute shetland foals ... see them before they went off to slaughter that is. I got the vets out for blood tests but before the flipping results came back, Molly started flirting outrageously with her 16hh gelding boyfriend, so I pretty much knew the results would come back negative, which they did. Wish she'd come into season the week before to save me the costs of the pregnancy testing!!!

OP, be careful what you wish for x
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I'm glad you said this. EVERY person thinking a foal is a 'nice idea' should do this - and maybe follow a few through the slaughtering process. Either don't breed or don't ever sell them on if you can't bear to do this...
 
And I remember someone on here ages ago buy a cremello with only the most vague signs of it being in foal, and no mention, by the seller, of the fact prior to purchase. We all speculated on the possibilty/likelihood - it was. And very near term, too.
 
Box_Of_Frogs said:
Just a couple of thoughts: if OP's mare is in foal, then OP needs to remember that she's age 18 and this might be her 1st foal. If so, she may well need more care than a younger mare. Secondly, there are far too many planned but un-sellable foals in Britain today, never mind an unplanned one. OP what will happen to the foal? And it's no good saying you'll keep it because the foal could have 30 years of life ahead of it and pound to a penny your circumstances will change during that time. My rescue shetland mare Molly (rescued after the Christmas Day appeal on this forum almost 2 years ago) came from an interim home where she could have been covered accidentally. She got fatter and fatter and I would spend hours on hands and knees beside her staring at her belly to see if I could see movement. Many, many times, I swear I did. Like you, I'd never have deliberately put her in foal but was enchanted at the thought of an "accidental" foal. But the more certain I became that she WAS pregnant (posted pix on here, small majority said not pregnant) the more I realised that the world did NOT need another 2-a-penny shetland foal from a sweetly ordinary 16yr old shetland mare. My YO threatened to drag me to Llanybydder, our local meat market, if I wanted to see some cute shetland foals ... see them before they went off to slaughter that is. I got the vets out for blood tests but before the flipping results came back, Molly started flirting outrageously with her 16hh gelding boyfriend, so I pretty much knew the results would come back negative, which they did. Wish she'd come into season the week before to save me the costs of the pregnancy testing!!!

OP, be careful what you wish for x
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Box of frogs, they are indeed wise words, Eb's potential accidental pregnancy, was infact that, but yes I do intend to keep her foal. I know that times can change, but I live through them, as someone who purchased Ebony as a 7 yr old that had done nothing and was a right difficult challenge in nearly every aspect to begin with, I had to work on picking feet up, stabling, loading, ground manners, ridden manners, spookiness, honestly, this little mare who had done nothing was the biggest challenge in my life to date! She has ended up to be an exceptional mare, I made a pact with myself there and then that any horse that I had would learn everything that it could possibly learn, impeccable manners etc, if i wanted to grass keep a horse, it would still learn to be stabled, if I wanted it barefoot, it would still learn to be shod, any horse of mine would have the best education going, just incase anything ever happened to me and they ended up in new homes, at least I know that I have done everything I could to prepare them for life, whatever that may hold for them. I do intend to keep the foal and am in the fortunate position of having an OH who has built stables for me, set aside a field for me and produces hay, straw and haylage, whilst mine are currently at livery for the facilities for ben, I am confident that I will be ok, furthermore, should anything happen between OH and myself, I have enough savings to purchase enough land to ensure that my horses remain safe and well cared for. Not planned, but I promise you with regards to providing for 3 horses I am as well prepared as possible :)

brighteyes said:
Sorry, not kept up - did you intend to breed a foal?

I expect everyone knows where I stand on random breeding. I hope any foal turns out to be something useful and not another Turner's Special. Why even risk putting a mare in with an unproven, recently cut colt?
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Brighteyes, short, sweet and too the point, I respect you for that, no, I did not intend to breed a foal, I can pretty much say that from my knowledge of both of my horses, if there is a foal about to pop out then it should be nicely put together and yes, useful. And no, it will never end up a Turners special, if there are any hard 'serious quality of life' decisions to make for whatever reason, I will make the hard but tough decision to call the hunt out to my home/yard. Why risk it? OH yes, I forgot, you have not kept up ;) I was advised that it would be ok, that there was no risk. As it is, that advice was ill made, but my boy is showing a willingness to learn, fantastic temperament and lots of potential, so I am not worried.


georgiegirl said:
I couldnt comment either way wether she is or isnt as its not something I have experienced but.....

why on earth go to all the trouble of preparing everything etc and not actually knowing wether she is pregnant or not?

For the sake of a few quid and safetys sake too I would be getting the vet out to visit you.

Madness.........
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GG: Madness to you, not to me, supplementing my mare is no hassle, I already had the supplement from ben, worming is good practice, it was less than £10 for a foaling kit, and I needed a new torch anyway :D all that has been purchased for the kit can be used in a general first aid kit. Added to that, fresh bedding at the beginning of the season and regular disinfecting is something I practice anyway... where is the trouble of expense?

You are welcome to your opinion, I am more than happy with my mares health and safety, if i was not, then I would get the vet out.


Cedars said:
Well I imagine she'll know for definite now.

But I think she's been pretty negligent leaving a horse with a belly like that without being certain it was pregnant. But that's my opinion and I hope that she has dropped a healthy sprog now and all is well.
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I am sure you do think that, on the other hand, she still has a 'belly like that' but you can see the shadow of her ribs when she turns, so not really FAT is she. She is well over what would be 320 days but still 2 weeks off the average foaling date.

She is very happy she bounced around like a diva yesterday because I was in the school with ben, she is still large, and very niggly with her back legs at her tummy, especially at feeding time, but her bum would not create an eclipse, you can just see her ribs, her neck and chest are normal and her coat is shiny.

I understand that this is probably going to cause another flow of QB is being negligent and uncaring tirades, but that is not the opinion of the vet, or even my opinion, who incidentally knows this horse and has owned her for 10 years, funnily enough, I have had no negative comments from anyone up at the yard either. However, I only just saw that this thread had been resurrected the other day, and felt a desire to respond to some of the more recent posts.

Should there be a foal, I will of course post the pictures, if not, for a horse that is going into the winter, I am sure she will be fine. Thank you all for your concern though :D
 
I bred a foal a few years ago, and somehow acquired another. I still have them both, although it hasn't been an easy time.
I hope your mare isn't in foal - the world doesn't need more youngsters at the moment when so many are already surplus to requirements.
N :(
 
When you look at the lives so many horses lead, in this country and even more in others, how on Earth can people say this mare's neglected?

Here is an utterly devoted owner, who posts pictures of her obviously healthy shining horses and tells us the story because she thinks we'd like to share it. And in come a load of criticisms saying she's neglectful!

Indescriminate breeding of foals isn't helpful I agree. But this was a MISTAKE! The OP was badly advised, but as it turns out, the resulting foal has every chance of being as good a horse as the stunning parents.

Whatever the opinion of current thinking is about vet's examinations, immunizations etc... it only opinion. It's the OPs right to choose whether she involves the vet. I personally don't think she's neglectful.

I've loved reading this thread, I'm quite excited too now! Thankyou so much for sharing this story, PLEASE tell us the outcome and post more pics.
 
There was a different thread started as an 'Update' thread, think when the mare got to a certain day after the possible 'accident' she got her checked (think it had always been her intention that at day X if there was no foal the vet would check), turned out to be bloat, no foal, but there is another pony on the yard that has been confirmed as being in foal, so a new thread will start next year for updates on this one (if you go on to the Update thread it explains what happened with the pony being in foal, I can't remember off the top of my head but I think it was given an injection to abort the foal, but the injection didn't work and they will now keep the pony and foal, but as I say check the thread), the 'Quick Update' thread did turn into about 45 pages!!!!
Found the Update thread http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=488051
 
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