Upside down presentation ...

T

TrueColours

Well-Known Member
Joined
27 December 2008
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114
Location
Wilsonville, Ontario. Canada
www.truecoloursfarm.com
Here are the YouTube foaling clips from the Guaranteed Gold / Puchi Trap birth that the wonderful people at Mare Stare put together for me:


Foaling Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbOgr64SukY

Foaling Part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ughPdzhEC9g

Foaling Part 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCzQfY5ge5M



For those that didnt see it - help me learn as well. The sac was evident after the water broke and the first foot I saw was upside down. I went in with a glove and lube and found the 2nd foot - also upside down and then found the head - upside down as well. I had an "oh @#!%" moment, then got a halter on her and tried walking her around in her stall to see if I could get the foal to slide back down again. No go ...

What could I or should I have done at this point to possibly rectify this situation sooner? I tried to walk her around to get the foal to slide back in again and that didnt work - it didnt even appear to slide back down even a little bit

Should I have manually tried to push him back down in there, or was the foaling so far along that no choices were open to me except to deliver him as presented and pray that he flipped over on his own (which he did thank God) once he reached a certain point? Once his shoulders cleared, he twisted and flipped on his own and it then became a normal presentation and foaling after that

I would be very interested to hear what others have done - successfully and not so successfully - when presented with this very issue. The big problem was well is that this foal is probably the biggest one I have delivered so he was HUGE, upside down and firmly stuck in there. NOT a good combination to have at all ...

I was on the phone with the vet several times as things were progressing, telling him what I was seeing and we both knew he wouldnt be able to make it in time to assist so I ultimately needed to figure this one out right then and there. The biggest issue I had to overcome, mentally and logistically, was delivering this foal UP towards her back instead of DOWN towards her hocks as that is the way the foal's body was contoured in this delivery ...

Here are a few pictures of the HUGE foal that this poor mare had to deliver upside down as well ... these were taken at about 4-5 hours old ...

http://www.angelfire.com/on3/TrueColoursFarm/images/Brickle-May10-1.jpg

and:

http://www.angelfire.com/on3/TrueColoursFarm/images/Brickle-May10.jpg

and:

http://www.angelfire.com/on3/TrueColoursFarm/images/Brickle-May10-3.jpg


Thanks everyone, as always ... :)
 
I have done plenty of sitting up and one year we had a spate of these. In every case they rectified themselves. This doesn't mean that there weren't a few worried helpers around!

The obvious main danger is the foal's hooves puncturing the perineum so it was a case of covering the hooves with a hand and trying to guide them out, rather than up. In the cases I saw, once the mare had got down (and usually up again, and then down, repeat to fade....) things had sorted themselves out naturally. As with anything out of the ordinary it is always worrying but in the vast majority of cases they do come right. It's the point when you realise it isn't sorting itself out and time to get the vet out that is the real skill in my experience!!
 
we had a same delivery a couple of years ago, the feet were trying to come through her anus, we guided averything out until we could help twist the foal the way it was naturally twisting out, it was very disturbing but everything turned out well, i dread to think what would have happend to my mare if i hadnt been there !
 
I have read somthing about crossing the foals legs but I can't remember if its the right leg over the left to encourage the foal to turn.....(don't shoot me!!)

Glad both mare and foal are OK and yes he is another massive foal - why are they all so big this year?
 
My husband, who is completely non horsey, reckons that their bodies slow right down in a bad winter like we've had and thats their way of coping with intense cold/poor nutrition/whatever. We then stable them, feed them ad lib hay, stud cubes and so on and they have slowed their metabolism so the foal gets too much.
Thats his very unscientific theory anyway.

BUT True Colours what a stunning foal, beautifully marked, I really like him.
 
Thats just spooky - my husband who is also non horsey said the same thing!

Something about the cold weather and the mare gives everything to the foal as nature intended and then we feed them even more....may be something in it!!
 
It isnt that uncommon for foals to present upside down. Usually the mare rolling will sort it out but if not and you are not able to push the foal back in to reposition it then all you can do is to help guide the legs so that they do not exit from any other oriface. Cute foal and alls well in the end.
 
:D So pleased that all is OK, hope they are both doing well.

So cross, why did I come for hay on Sunday instead of Monday? But at least I did get to see your other, very special, beauty.

Absolutely beautiful, good markings, not too much or too little.

No advice from me as I have never encountered that particular position, but the replies are interesting..

ps...that's your chipmunk in my signature :D
 
Very glad all well - once the mare has started in labour, the strength of contractions can make it nigh on impossible to push back in if malpresented - we had a dystocic presentation only once(was a dog-sitting hurdler), but the foal did not make it - we couldn't push it back in and despite getting to theatre while the foal was still alive, we were unlucky.

Well done you - lovely foal too!
 
enfys - TOO funny that our chipmunk made it onto your H&H signature! :) And yeah - rotten luck indeed that you came over a day early!

We did get her up and walk her trying to get the foal to slide back down, but not luck. She did get up and down several times on her own, and rolled and that didnt work either. Either he was too far along or too big or in a position where getting flipped over wasnt easy or wasnt an option at all

I have also heard that crossing their forelegs and trying to twist and flip that way is also an option BUT ... unless you 100% know that they should flip counter or clockwise - if you choose to twist them right when their body is already leaning to the left, instead of them twisting 40 or 50 degrees to achieve a normal presentation, you may have complicated things further and made them have to flip 180 degrees to right themselves

In the end, Mom and "Frosty" are doing just fine and are happy and healthy so I am SO grateful for that ...

Thanks so much for the suggestions and comments as well!
 
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