urgent advise needed

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jackbobs

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a young girl on my yard sold her pony 3 months ago on a lwvtb arrangement. the agreement was that the buyer pays 200 per month until the full balance of 2000 is paid and all costs for the ponys up keep whilst paying her off, the buyer called yesterday to say she could no longer keep up with the payments and so can she come and collect the pony. the girl told the buyer that she would come up to the yard today to check everything is ok and arrange to collect her (we dont have our own transport) during the conversation the buyer has told us that the pony has not been ridden and has been turned out 24/7. the pony is clipped and was against the agreement for her to live out, we did not say anything to the buyer we just decided to go up ans see her. a bit later on we recieved a text to say she can now afford the payments so doesnt want to send her back... we decided that there is something not quite right and so replied to say we would like to come and see the pony... since this she has not replied and will not answer the phone. we are just going to turn up today. if the pony is not being kept to the level of care that was agreed can we take her back? if we do should we be paying her the 600 that she has already paid back or not. what rights do we have. any info greatly appreciated
 
Go and see what condition the pony is in. If it is OK, try to find out what the problem is re. the money and find a solution if you can.

If the pony is in poor condition take it back immediately and give them their money back minus petrol expenses. I think this is only fair.
 
the owner has the passport and the pony is micro chipped in the owners name. Im just not sure where we stand if she has already paid some off... does the pony legally belong to sophie or the new people? i have a really bad feeling its not going to be in the condition she was left in. i really hope this isnt the case. we are just going to turn up after
 
Until completely paid for pony belongs to old owner.

If taking pony back, unless there was anything in the lwvtb agreement that stated penalties/anything with obvious financial implications has happened (e.g. overdue farrier if there was agreed trimming frequency/tack missing/etc) then I'd refund. At the end of the day the potential owner has paid to keep the pony for a little while so, whilst there is the hassle, there is also a livery/grazing saving for the old owner.

Most ponies should be fine out... and if clipped (and possibly not properly rugged) may even warmer out than in as they can move around.

Try to keep your friend calm if you can (assuming pony still has four legs) as it is usually easier to sort financials out if you're seen to be 'reasonable'.

Good luck!
 
If you have any concerns, take the pony away.
Does she have a contract? If so, identify which part of the contract you feel they have not adhered to and make it clear it is because of that you are taking the pony.

I agree with whoever said sort the money after.
Good luck and let us know how it goes.

ETS: Take copy of contract with you
 
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See pony if not happy take it back and refund money.

They have only paid part to horse still belongs to current owner.
They have paid livery etc, we hope!

I hope there was or contract?
While on loan the owner does have a say but once sold they don't so maybe owner should have done more checks before letting horse go and durring the loan.
 
this is all really good advise thank you. we will go today and way up the situation, hopefully everything will be fine but i cant help but think there is a problem
 
the girl is only a child, shes 15 and i cannot believe that when the agreement was made there was no adult supervision, i didnt know her that well at the time of sale but she has signed a contract which i have asked her to bring so i can have a read through
 
Do not seek advice on this on a forum. If you were do the wrong thing then criminal prosecution could follow and civil proceedings. Get legal advice. If you are a member of any riding clubs BHS or pony club they have legal people well versed in any situation to do with horses.
 
Unfortunately it is illegal to sell an animal to a person under 16. It is more likely than not that any contract signed between individuals under 16 will not be vaild in law either. You need to find out where the parents are. I'm sure a 15yr old won't be paying £200 a month!
 
I'd go immediately and check the pony, if all is well get the owners parents (who will actually be the real owners if she is only 15) to talk to the buyers.
If not bring the pony home and, personally I'd keep expenses necessary to get the pony back into the condition it was in when it left.

TBH her parents probably have been involved, nobody would hand money over to a child each month.
 
I'm sorry to say, once the buyer has handed over any money, even only 1pence, the pony belongs to her. I know this from past experience. I had a solicitor involved in my situation and could not do anything about it.
 
payments have been put directly into sophies account (the child) ive asked for her mum to come today, think thats best. i shall let you all know what happens today. I do hope the pony is ok
 
lelly said:
I'm sorry to say, once the buyer has handed over any money, even only 1pence, the pony belongs to her. I know this from past experience. I had a solicitor involved in my situation and could not do anything about it.
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oh no lelly, thats not good news :(
 
lelly said:
I'm sorry to say, once the buyer has handed over any money, even only 1pence, the pony belongs to her. I know this from past experience. I had a solicitor involved in my situation and could not do anything about it.
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That can't possibly be true. It's completely unworkable. Why would anyone continue to pay off car installments, or mortgage installments, if they own the item as soon as they've paid even 1p? Unless there's more to the story, it sounds to be like you got some pretty shoddy legal advice.

OP - get proper advice.
 
jackbobs said:
payments have been put directly into sophies account (the child)
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Did her parents not wonder why they weren't being asked to fund livery bills anymore? Or wonder why she wasn't going to ride/ check on the pony every day? Or wonder why their 15 y/o was suddenly rolling around in cash !!

My parents were very very non horsey but I think they'd have spotted if I'd have sold her without her knowledge !!
 
I agree somethings not right. So have a good look and talk to them

As for parent not bring involved. Its wrong but not unheard of. They obviously think she's older and wiser than her years or just don't care!
 
This isn't LWTB this is HP and the "goods" remain the property of the seller until the final payment is made.

However, the crux of the matter will lie in what the agreement actually says (if there is a written agreement).

Good luck!
 
How has it gone? In a normal case the contract would matter, but a contract is for 16+ so I doubt this one would stand up anyway. So definitely worth getting legal advice on it. Even if horse is fine the contract needs to be re adressed with her parents there to sign to it.
 
^ scrap that, think it's 18 plus? Either way it needs sorting with parents involved.

I'd also keep out the way if I were you and be careful getting involved in this one unless as a witness to pony condition with parents request etc.
 
amymay said:
Yep, pony is not sold until last payment made. So go with money to return tp loanee and take horse home.
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lelly said:
I'm sorry to say, once the buyer has handed over any money, even only 1pence, the pony belongs to her. I know this from past experience. I had a solicitor involved in my situation and could not do anything about it.
Click to expand...



Either could be true, it depends entirely on what the contract says.

The £200 could have been deemed a lease fee or a payment installment.

Your friend needs advice from a lawyer if they refuse to give the pony back and she wants it back.
 
A child under 18 cannot sign a finance agreement, without it being countersigned by an adult. This works for both selling on finance as well as buying, so the buyer actually has no valid contract at all.
 
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