using a twitch to assist loading.

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goldenchestnut

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Has anyone ever tried a twitch with a difficult loader. Pony will load ok, travels fine and unloads quietly but once he's loaded as soon as you make an attempt to put the ramp up he backs out at speed. Thought it might help if could use a twitch to calm him while some one puts the ramp up. He's fine once the ramp is up but it takes for ever (at least any hour). What do you think? Thanks.
 
have u tried putting a feed in for him to eat while ur doing ramp? if hes that flighty hed surely back out while u were putting twitch on. I certainly wouldn't use one in that situation, also next time he mightn't go in if he thought he was going to get twitched!
 
Have you got a breeching bar or strap? A bar might be better as it's solid. Don't know the pony so don't know if twitch would work, think pony might plant with twitch on.
 
HI, he will load him self and eat his feed but as soon as he senses the back bar or ramp going up he will back out at speed breaking the string if i've tied him up. He's a big softy and bomb proof apart from this. Once the ramp etc is up he is absoluty fine. So frustrating.
 
practice just letting him stand there in box eating. don't tie him. if you can, never unload backwards, always come out the front. when you have him standing happily eating, gradually lift ramp and put it down again til hel stand for that. then start lifting ramp further up. eventually you will be able to get it all the way. or practice gradually with a back bar the same way.
This would not be the right situation for a twitch.
 
I have spent lots of time doing everything that people suggest but with out success. He will stand on his own for ever in the trailor as long as you don't try and put the bar or ramp up.
 
If you have a nervous horse that fears being trapped inside the trailer, I would think putting up the bar is a formula for disaster! A lot of horses will have no difficulty breaking the trailer, themselves, or the handler - or all three at once!

Feed hay from a net with small meshes in the trailer. Start by leaving them in the trailer with the bar and ramp down. Leave them to it and go and have a cup of tea! If they want to come out, let them! Gradually build up on the distractions outside the trailer until they will tolerate that rather than leave the hay. Initially, just walk around. If they come out, that's fine. Take your time and load them up again. Eventually, you will be able to rock the trailer, rattle bars, lift the ramp a few inches and drop it again, etc. The message you want to get across is that the trailer is a safe place to be and she won't be trapped in there.

While you are doing this (but separately), work at ground training and pressure-and-release. Get the pony responding to light pressure (we use a rope halter which is quite harsh enough) and walking over various surfaces.

I've bought in several that were very bad loaders and had this problem. Do the above and after a while they begin to realise that they are quite safe in the trailer and won't be trapped so there is no need to go into high speed reverse. Personally, I would not use any form of force or punishment except in dire emergency. I'd also resign myself to possibly weeks of retraining. Pain and upset will become associated with loading and you will simply make more problems for yourself. "Softy-softly, catchee monkey". :)
 
Dry Rot said:
If you have a nervous horse that fears being trapped inside the trailer, I would think putting up the bar is a formula for disaster! A lot of horses will have no difficulty breaking the trailer, themselves, or the handler - or all three at once!

Feed hay from a net with small meshes in the trailer. Start by leaving them in the trailer with the bar and ramp down. Leave them to it and go and have a cup of tea! If they want to come out, let them! Gradually build up on the distractions outside the trailer until they will tolerate that rather than leave the hay. Initially, just walk around. If they come out, that's fine. Take your time and load them up again. Eventually, you will be able to rock the trailer, rattle bars, lift the ramp a few inches and drop it again, etc. The message you want to get across is that the trailer is a safe place to be and she won't be trapped in there.

While you are doing this (but separately), work at ground training and pressure-and-release. Get the pony responding to light pressure (we use a rope halter which is quite harsh enough) and walking over various surfaces.

I've bought in several that were very bad loaders and had this problem. Do the above and after a while they begin to realise that they are quite safe in the trailer and won't be trapped so there is no need to go into high speed reverse. Personally, I would not use any form of force or punishment except in dire emergency. I'd also resign myself to possibly weeks of retraining. Pain and upset will become associated with loading and you will simply make more problems for yourself. "Softy-softly, catchee monkey". :)
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Thank you for this, i use a rope halter but i can't tie him up in that. He gets fed everyday in it and i walk and rattle things around him. Just when i think i'm getting somewhere he goes into reverse.
 
Have you only tried him in a trailer?

Would he go in a reverse loading one? Does he prefer a lorry? Is herringbone more to his taste? Does he have a friend alongside? Does he prefer to load first or last if this is the case. Does he prefer one side over the other? Is your trailer completely pitch black and awful when the ramp is up (get in it and see)?

There are solutions that will eventually get him to load, but perhaps you could make it easier for everyone by accommodating his quirk a bit. I've had horses that were very into herringbone lorries and didn't like trailers at all. It was honestly easier to get my hgv than have to work loading with no expectation of time frame when we had to be somewhere at a specific time.

Also consider building a dirt ramp (doesn't have to be rocket science, a bit of work with a shovel can make one) that the ramp rests on. Some prefer to load like this, and not feeling the ramp sloping away as he panic backs out might reassure/ puzzle him enough to break the pattern a bit, do put stock gates or hurdles either side tho or locate it next to a wall. Also some don't like the hollow noise so a door mat on the surface can help. Cumulative spook factors and all that.
 
Read about a new product by Ceva called Confidence EQ. Helped us in the situation similar to yours, as long as you follow the instructions.
 
goldenchestnut said:
HI, he will load him self and eat his feed but as soon as he senses the back bar or ramp going up he will back out at speed breaking the string if i've tied him up. He's a big softy and bomb proof apart from this. Once the ramp etc is up he is absoluty fine. So frustrating.
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Don't ever tie a horse up with the back down - its the quickest way to cause major injury to the horse and frighten the life out of him.

They can flip over backwards when pulling back.

if you can have someone tap him on the bum from the side while you put the back up this may work

The other is to have a bum rope fitted to him, wrap the rope around the breast bar several times ensuring that at least one lap covers over the preceding layer. The bum rope will prevent him going backwards.
 
goldenchestnut said:
Thank you for this, i use a rope halter but i can't tie him up in that. He gets fed everyday in it and i walk and rattle things around him. Just when i think i'm getting somewhere he goes into reverse.
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No, don't ever tie him with a rope head collar!

When he is confident to stay in the trailer and pull at the hay net, they will sometimes go into reverse when you first go in the jockey's door simply out of habit. (He has self loaded and is standing untied pulling at the hay). Just gently take hold of the head collar and gently resist his attempt to walk backwards, that might be enough to forestall a reverse. If your ground training is up to speed, he will feel the head collar and decide it isn't worth fighting it and stay where he is and pull at the hay. You really need to be gentle with this step and use judgement.

Always always always slow and gentle. If he insists on backing out, let him. The problem is he feels trapped when the ramp goes up. It is that fear you must overcome and doing anything that adds to it will simply make matters worse. I suggest lifting the ramp a few inches (from the side!) and letting it drop. Do this repeatedly until he gets used to it. Obviously, watch yourself as he will probably come out at speed! After a while, he will realise he is being frightened by nothing and he might as well stay and eat.

Getting a professional in might be the best solution if you are making no progress. If I don't make progress with one training method, it is sometimes worth trying something else.
 
Desensitise him to the ramp, bit by bit.
Teach him to stand and reinforce that until he stands on cue. Then in stages, telling him to stand, have him inside and stand by the ramp. When he is relaxed about that reach down and touch it, then lift it an inch (from the side never lift from underneath in case he does run back) then lift it 2 inches and so on until he remains relaxed and happy at each stage, and you can reward him for standing while you do that stuff. As you have tried to trap him in the past by tying him each stage might take a while but it will be so worth it.
 
Dry Rot said:
Always always always slow and gentle. If he insists on backing out, let him.
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This, 100%. He needs to feel like he can escape easily at all times if he needs to. He panics because he feels trapped with no where to go; twitching him is probably the worst thing you could do here.

Start by lifting the ramp up a foot, then praise and put it down. Let him back out if needs be afterwards. Repeat until he's totally chill. Then lift it two foot, put it back down and praise. And so on and so forth.

Patience, patience, patience.
 
I would add while he is standing nicely in the float and before trying to raise the ramp move around, rattle the bum bars, perhaps have a string across for a bit of resistance, stamp on the ramp and make a bit of noise, if he stands nicely stop making the noise and reward. Soon he will ignore what is going on behind him....the principles of advance and retreat, also reward every try are as effective in this instance as always... :)
 
A lot of great advice.

I appreciate how infuriating this is when the pony will load fine and also travel fine, but you are not in charge when the ramp goes up. I have had a horse with this problem and he did become a good loader.

I don't like to use a strap in this instance as it can move up and over the horse's back.

I would take control of the forwards and back on the ramp. I would go half way up, and back out, 3/4 of the way up and back part way out and come forwards again. You need to be in charge of all areas of the ramp. Before I started work on the ramp I would work on this forward to back and back to forward again. I would also have it so we can start to unload out of the front ramp, change our mind, reverse a bit to the back ramp, change our mind, come forwards again. Really practice that, stage by stage, incrementally, until it is very light and relaxed.

Then same exercise with other people walking near the trailer, on the ramp (use a horse aware person!), banging the side, touching the horse, walking in and out of the other partition.

I don't use bucket feed but as a test I would not move on with each stage until the horse is comfortable enough to eat from the net. This way the horse paces the session.

Next the ramp can be lifted an inch or two and banged down. The last "trick" we used with mine was a blanket lifted as if it were a ramp by two people, one each side, so it can be lifted a foot and dropped, if the horse rushes back you can change this to a forward again and work the control on back and forward. Then interchange the lifting ramp an inch or two for the noise with the lifting blanket until the blanket can be lifted right up.

When the ramp goes up finally the horse is well practiced in all noises, sights, and with you in control.

I worked mine every day for about 2 weeks before he was sorted, but he was well in a rut with the unwanted behaviour. He never did it wrong again, as if he started to lift his head ready to go back he could be told to move forwards and he would.

Of course wear gloves, hat and toecap boots, and necer stand behind the ramp when lifting. Use competent helpers.
 
My horse used to be exactly the same. I solved it by putting the front ramp down so the I could lead him straight through the trailer. As we were going through somone would put the back ramp up so that he got used to the noise /movement. By having the front ramp open he didn't feel trapped but also learned that going backward wasn't an option.

Once he wasn't reacting to this I started making him stand for a few seconds (at the top of front ramp so not near the back) and repeated the above. If he got worried he could escape forward but he realised pretty quickly that it wasn't so scary.

I gradually built on this with the same approach until he was happily standing in the normal position and allowing the ramp to go up. It didn't take long to solve really, it was just a case of finding a method that worked and only moving onto the next step when he was happy.
 
How is he without a partition? Mine reverses high speed with a partition but stands nicely without (full width breast and breach bars are a must). Even if you do not want to travel like this long term it could be a useful half way stage for training. When I have no partition in instead of going out of the trailer to walk round to the back I walk down the inside next to the horse. It helps his confidence if he knows I am still there. Be very careful if you do this, always wear hat, boots etc. I also keep one hand on the horse which helps him know where I am and discourages him from moving into me if he gets upset. Also when you do tie up make sure you cross tie so he can not turn around and frighten himself even more.
 
I had the same problem - never if I had someone with me as his problem was me leaving his head, the second he thought he was on his own he'd be off. He wasn't frightened of the trailer (would load himself and stand like a lamb with company) but of being alone. A few things worked for me but the best was one of the buckets you hang over the door. I would hang it over the breast bar and put a very small handful of pony cubes in it, well spread out. As the bucket moved when he tried to eat out of it, the cubes would roll around and would be enough to keep him busy for me to get to the back of the trailer (along the inside of the trailer on the other side of the partition, always talking to him) and put the bar across. I would also use a lunge line so when he did shoot backwards he never got away from me as if he did it would take me 20 minutes to catch him and he would ususally find mud and roll. He's grey and I swear he knows he doesn't go on the trailer without a bath so it would mean another 20 minutes being washed off before I could try again! He never goes on his own these days as his competing days are over so only goes on fun rides and to the beach so haven't had this problem for a while. Loading him with another quiet horse he gets on with well might also help - at least to begin with?
 
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