Using the same stallion again

[JanetGeorge]

Very good point JanetGeorge about old breeds (Arabs and TBs) being more prepotent. There is still of course much variation in prepotency within these old breeds. Some Arab stallions - and mares - stamp their stock much more strongly than others.

I know IDs are not as old a breed as Arabs or TBs, of course, but certainly some ID stallions seem to be highly prepotent - Archie being a good example! But I'm woefully ignorant about the breed as a whole - are IDs known for being particularly prepotent?

That's very true - some are more likely to stamp their stock than others. H Tobago DOES seem VERY pre-potent - I haven't seen a foal by him yet that doesn't have 'that look'!

Some IDs DO stampt their stock - you're right about Archie - I can spot even his grey foals from Raj's across the field! And Raj seems to stamp his too - one owner of a pure-bred Raj spotted a big grey gelding half obscured by a lorry and though hers had escaped! She went and introduced herself and asked about the horse's breeding - it was a 3/4 bred Raj x Brook youngster.

 

[htobago]

Where to begin!
Spry, my first mare had two by Embla Statesman, peas in a pod! Fiver (the yearling in this) is now 22 and still going strong.

Then she had two by Big Connaught (TB) a chestnut and a bay. Conway Gold won the HIS Sale Show and was top priced 2 yr old there while Jackson was a small bay who has just celebrated his 19th birthday.
Chestnut foal

A bad pic but used for advertising the next year after his win

I've had 4 by Bazaars Texas from 3 different bay TB mares. Again, all very similar. This is Joey and Dotty. Very sadly, my vet lost Joey last weekend when he struck into himself out hunting; to say we're all devastated is an understatement. Even regarding them all as special in their own way he did have to be the best I had bred; Joey had so much natural talent he was a machine cross country; we had high hopes of him, sadly no more.

I've had 4 by Fairlyn Gemini, 2 different TB mares; so alike it's like looking in the mirror (but sadly no pics)

I've also had 3 by Maurice Minor (ID) from 3 different but similar type mares that are peas in a pod although the filly, Tara is lighter boned.
Bear, working hunter champion and seriously good hunter, jumps anything, this as a 3 yr old before breaking

Tara, yearling earlier this year

Manny,

Now of course, I'm waiting for another H Tobago from Bea to match this one!

Sorry there are so many!

Oh that's so sad about Joey - tragic to lose such a super horse.

Great to see so many of your very impressive full siblings, and that's a nice pic of Sparks - can't wait to see the 2013 edition!

 

[htobago]

Wow, they are all absolutey stunning.

Really nothing between yours Ritajennings. Their dam really put a fantastic stamp on them all.

Realitycheck - what gorgeous babies, and so similar

This is very reassuring.

My first foal now 3 1/2 has just gone away for backing, and we are getting some very exciting vibes about him, its early days so i am keeping my excitement under control.

Shes had another foal by a different stallion, she has the same fantastic temperament as her brother, nicely put together, but different. Not in a bad way, just different. Just musing with the possibility of using the first stallion again.

Thanks

I'm a huge fan of Archie's dam too - fabulous mare! Although actually I'm seeing a lot of the sire in the magnificent trio Rita posted as well. Obviously a 'golden cross', quite rightly repeated!

Realitycheck's babies all look wonderful.

Xmasha it sounds as though the first stallion crossed particularly well with your mare - so although there are no guarantees you'll get an exact replica, it would make sense to use him again. Especially as you've had a chance to see how the first foal has matured, and you are still clearly delighted with him!

 

[htobago]

That's very true - some are more likely to stamp their stock than others. H Tobago DOES seem VERY pre-potent - I haven't seen a foal by him yet that doesn't have 'that look'!

Some IDs DO stampt their stock - you're right about Archie - I can spot even his grey foals from Raj's across the field! And Raj seems to stamp his too - one owner of a pure-bred Raj spotted a big grey gelding half obscured by a lorry and though hers had escaped! She went and introduced herself and asked about the horse's breeding - it was a 3/4 bred Raj x Brook youngster.

Sorry - I meant to mention Raj as another example - in fact I asked the question because he and Archie are the 2 ID stallions I am most familiar with, and have seen a lot of photos of their stock. Both seem to stamp them strongly, so I wondered if they are just particularly prepotent individuals or if the breed as whole tends to be quite prepotent.

The focus always tends to be on stallions, but I've come across some mares who seem to produce the same foal no matter which stallion they are bred to. Do you have any super-influential mares like this?

 

[Asha]

I'm a huge fan of Archie's dam too - fabulous mare! Although actually I'm seeing a lot of the sire in the magnificent trio Rita posted as well. Obviously a 'golden cross', quite rightly repeated!

Realitycheck's babies all look wonderful.

Xmasha it sounds as though the first stallion crossed particularly well with your mare - so although there are no guarantees you'll get an exact replica, it would make sense to use him again. Especially as you've had a chance to see how the first foal has matured, and you are still clearly delighted with him!

The Htobago foals are simply exquisite. He really does produce some amazing youngstock from a variety of different breeds, you must be so proud.


Thank you all for your replies.

Im going to give it a bit more time to see how he matures, and if he proves to be good under saddle. If he does, I will definitely use the same stallion.

Hes just come home from being started, and got good comments from the chap who backed him. But its early days, and im in no rush. Bring on 2013 !

 

[htobago]

The Htobago foals are simply exquisite. He really does produce some amazing youngstock from a variety of different breeds, you must be so proud.


Thank you all for your replies.

Im going to give it a bit more time to see how he matures, and if he proves to be good under saddle. If he does, I will definitely use the same stallion.

Hes just come home from being started, and got good comments from the chap who backed him. But its early days, and im in no rush. Bring on 2013 !

Thank you Xmasha - I'm so pleased that you like Tobago's foals. I have no mares of my own (he is my only horse), so this is all thanks to breeders like Maesfen, The Watcher, Cloppy, JanetGeorge and others who have shown such confidence in him. I'm very grateful!

I know it's early days, but your youngster does sound rather special - are there any photos of him on here?

 

[Asha]

Thank you Xmasha - I'm so pleased that you like Tobago's foals. I have no mares of my own (he is my only horse), so this is all thanks to breeders like Maesfen, The Watcher, Cloppy, JanetGeorge and others who have shown such confidence in him. I'm very grateful!

I know it's early days, but your youngster does sound rather special - are there any photos of him on here?

Here he is a foal

here he is at 2

Here he is at the beginning of the year

Havent got any recent ones. I tried taking a video while Jonathon was backing him, and unfortunately had pressed pause when i thought it was recording. Useless

He will always be special to me, regardless of whether he turns out to be talented enough for Jonathon to compete, or he ends up as my hack xx

 

[woodlander]

If you get what you wanted...do it again. At Woodlander we have bred the same way up to six times for full siblings. They have always had a common thread but also differences. As a breeder, while you need to keep an eye on fashion and progress, using a stallion that has given you a great youngster already is always a good plan. Although in one case we brd full siblings six times, we very regularly do it twice.

 

[JanetGeorge]

Sorry - I meant to mention Raj as another example - in fact I asked the question because he and Archie are the 2 ID stallions I am most familiar with, and have seen a lot of photos of their stock. Both seem to stamp them strongly, so I wondered if they are just particularly prepotent individuals or if the breed as whole tends to be quite prepotent.

They both come from very good mare lines. Archie's dam, Avanti Racey Gracie (I do like Rita's choice of names ) was a lovely mare by Snowford Bellman who produced very consistent stock. Raj is a butch, masculine version of his maternal grand-dam Glounbrack Lass 2 according to those who knew her.

I wouldn't say the breed overall was especially prepotent - certainly not so much as the TB and Arab - but there have been a number of stallions who really DID stamp their stock!