Vaulting, anybody's opinion

[copper100]

Having spent the last 2 years educating my partner, who was non horsey. To the point where he actually watches, researches and enjoys the horse world now. To be quite frank the vaulting on WEG has put me back months in terms of credibilityl. I am having to justify the sport of vaulting whilst listening to the cackles of my partner and parrot, which I'm finding hard to do, if you have a reasonable answer as to why this is considered as a serious equine sport please let me know. Any spelling mistakes are a result of tears blurring my vision from my partners constant witty observations. Please help!!!

 

[Kokopelli]

Tell him to go do gymnastics on a moving horse whilst being thrown about by other people That will shut him up!

 

[copper100]

Sorry to offend if I have but as a supporter of all horse sports I was disappointed to say the least. As I think you may have brought up the fact that maybe these people are gymnasts , and therefore maybe the whole equine world should be wondering why this fantastic sport has not been previously represented at the olympic games. My partner thinks we should start a petition to make this an equine discipline at the 2012 games, a sense of hilarity is always welcomed.

 

[missyme10]

I could possibly be shot down in flames here.................but I dont care

I really do not see the point of vaulting.
I love to watch show jumping, dressage, eventing, even down to the kids at pony club doing games, but vaulting......er no!

I believe hours and hours of training go into it weekly, and I just think poor horse, going around and around like that constantly at the same pace....all a bit boring for the said horse.

I can see why kids find it fun though if they have a love of gymnastics and horses, just dont think its any fun for the horse x

 

[Chavhorse]

I could possibly be shot down in flames here.................but I dont care

I really do not see the point of vaulting.
I love to watch show jumping, dressage, eventing, even down to the kids at pony club doing games, but vaulting......er no!

I believe hours and hours of training go into it weekly, and I just think poor horse, going around and around like that constantly at the same pace....all a bit boring for the said horse.

I can see why kids find it fun though if they have a love of gymnastics and horses, just dont think its any fun for the horse x

I caught some last night just in time to see some chap in white spandex with a sequined collar perform. Have to admit it did nothing for me at all. I can imagine it is a huge challenge to do gymnastics on the back of a cantering horse but to be brutal it brought back images of the Christmas Billy Smart's Circus from my youth.

 

[tallyho!]

Awww c'mon, just coz you can't do it

 

[NeilM]

I am sure it takes thousands of hours of dedicated training, and the level of skill involved is evident, but it just does not strike me as being a 'sport'.

It is one of those oddities of the sport world, rather like synchronised swimming.

 

[tallyho!]

I am sure it takes thousands of hours of dedicated training, and the level of skill involved is evident, but it just does not strike me as being a 'sport'.

It is one of those oddities of the sport world, rather like synchronised swimming.

Yeah and ice-skating and ballet and tai-chi and kung-fu and gymnastics and...................................................................................

 

[badgerdog]

I don't really see it as an equine sport but as a gymnastic one. As a rider it's not something you would naturally progress onto like dressage or jumping. I think it's very skillful but the people doing are mostly gymnasts, not equestrian people (I may be wrong?)

I would have loved to have done it when I was a kid, it looks great fun but I don't think I would have been any good at it. I've got nothing against it, if people enjoy it and the horses are well looked after then good luck to them.

 

[lialls]

I used to do it and can say that its mostly horsey people who do it, the group i used to do it with had alot of people who liked horses but had lost their nerve actually ridding them.

The horses we use dont only do vaulting but also compete to a high level in dressage and some of them also jump. Vaulting can be performed at different paces: walk, some trot and canter, it depents on the team/individuals performance and if its a free style or not. Alot of training gos in to the people but we dont use the same horse over and over again, it is important to practice on different horses and also on the barrels.

I think that it is a sport, okay so its not really a horse sport as you arnt ridding but it is a sport.

I'd like to see how many of you can do even basic vaulting movements on a moving horse. Its a lot harder than you will ever believe.

 

[lialls]

Also just to say that they actually use basic vaulting movements to improve dressage riders who follow the Alexander Technique.

This is who i used to train with, they have recently taken down their page about vaulting but you might be able to find a peice on there about the use of vaulting relating to dressage (the Alexander Technique)
http://www.arrowequestrian.co.uk/index.php

 

[HopeforMe]

I've done it too. Not well, as it is difficult.
I taught vaulting years ago as part of a horsemanship program. We only did the basic movements and it was a great for improving the riders' confidence and balance. The horses that were used in vaulting also did other things like jumping and hacking, but knew what it meant when they had their vaulting equipment on.
Is it a sport? Yes, just as gymnastics and dressage are sports.

 

[Dobby]

I'd like to try it but there's nowhere to learn around here and I'd definitely be immensely cr*p. It's interesting to watch although I'm not a fan of the spangly spandex costumes!

 

[copper100]

Having started this thread I feel coming back to the subject almost 2 weeks later I need to have another say, sorry!! All you vaulter's out there have not convinced me in any way shape or form that this is any good for the horses you trot, or canter around in circles. Tell me where these horses have a life please? And do you always work them on the left hand rein?

My point actually in starting this thread was to point out that not one single horse from start to finish, did I see happy in what he was doing, and yet I as a horse sport person, I enjoyed watching the UK take medals in the dressage, eventing and whilst not in the showjumping, seeing Hickstead have so much joy in the finals of the jumping was pure magic. And not to mention the carriage driving..

Seeing a horse so stiff behind he should not have been allowed to canter on a circle for the sake of artistry, really gets my goat to be honest. If all is true about your sport, then post pictures of your vaulting horses, enjoying life as I would surely like to see them. The forum to do that is just a little lower called 'pictures', but please do not show any with failed gymnasts on them unless you can justify the action.

Thanks all for your comments, it's been in the majority possitive..

 

[lialls]

So tell me copper do you have a horse? and what do you do with it if so?


I will dig out some pictures this weekend and post them.

 

[gillianfleming]

Hi Cooper in answer to your questions.

Yes the horse do other things, they don't just vault, friends horse does dressage, HT, XC, side saddle and has been broken to drive.
At lower levels they compete on both reins, its only at the higher level, international competitions that they only go to the left.
In Europe a lot of people who start horse riding begin by vaulting first to improve their basic seat.
A very good friend of mine got into vaulting many years ago as she was unable to vault onto her 12hh pony in PC games.
Through her we have been followers of vaulting and have know Joey Eccles, world champ, since she was tiny.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/47015540@N00/3639756116/in/set-72157600512744955/
Bart Simpson, hunter, reserve champion hunter at the Border union show last year, competed at the Royal Highland Show this year.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/47015540@N00/3588979680/in/set-72157600512744955/
Ziggy allrounder, side saddle, driving etc
http://www.flickr.com/photos/47015540@N00/3588972968/in/set-72157600512744955/
Ash, previously a show horse but now seems to enjoy this far more.

Out of interest can i ask which horse you thought was stiff?

 

[copper100]

Thank you very much for the questions, and to answer then yes I do have a horse, we event, jump and do dressage in the intervening months, when the eventing season is off so to speak

I have been involved with horses for a good number of years in all diciplines apart from driving.

My point, sorry to reiterate yet again, is that any person 'new' to horses checking in to Eurosport that night, at that particular hour would have had a bad impression of horse sports and I will stand by that opinion. It was a pantomime, the Robbie Williams face paint and the 12ft high lunging whips.

I'm not attacking your 'sport' just trying to understand what purpose it has?

And I'm glad these horses have other lives, truly I am..

The Alexander Technique as I believe, is a posture 'person' technique, I have a few actor friends who have been to these classes.

Thanks for your comments though and I will look forward to seeing to pictures..

Best regards

 

[MrsMozart]

Interesting.

Whilst I have no doubt that there is a lot of skill and training goes into this, it's not for me.

One point though, next time some x stone soul asks if he/she is too heavy for a horse, they should have a look at the the pairs vaulting. Also, the subject of hats being worn by 'riders' (excuse me, I'm biased, I still have the picture of the bleed on my brain).

 

[Thelwell_Girl]

I have tried out vaulting once (albeit very much as a novice!).

A really beautiful Percheron, and I loved sitting on him. BUT. I am ashamed that I got on him without a hat I cant believe I actually clambered up on this un-known horse for a while without a hat. Yes, he was so sweet and kind, he probably couldnt be bothered to misbehave, but nevertheless I am NOT going to let this happen again. For me, it is helmet all the way, or no ride that day.

 

[Arabelle]

I am sure vaulting is very difficult and requires great athleticism...but....

it just looks so stupid and the constumes are soo deeply naff. I agree with the poster who said it reminded them of Billy Smart's circus, back in the day.

Synchronised swimming is the best analogy in terms of looking foolish. It is 'sport' Jim, but not as we know it

 

[JustMe22]

I personally haven't done it, but at a yard I worked at we had a horse who may have made a suitable vaulting horse, so took it through to a family who are well known for it in our area. Got talking to them, and they said all their vaulting horses have to do minimum Elementary dressage, preferably higher. Having said that, they are a family also fairly well known in 'normal' horse sports, SJ and DR and the like.

 

[copper100]

Not sure what to say right now apart from please check out Asset2004, comments on the other vaulting thread. I didn't mean to start a whole issue on this subject.

As I will reiterate again, I can't see how this is a horse sport and I can't understand how they got funding to go to WEG, when the carriage drivers did not, I know it's all about about money but there are some things that promote horse sports, ie horses enjoying themselves and there are sadly 'sports' that we in my humble opinion we should leave by the wayside.

I can't offer any more to the debate apart from my opinion, and sorry for the lateness of the post but I have a a good day out with man, had a great hack..

Looking forward to seeing your picture posts though, please reassure me?

 

[Starzaan]

Before you knock vaulting, watch my friend's troop "Jive Pony" perform. They've got videos on youtube, and have a website too now.

Once you've seen what Beccah and Rosie can do, you'll appreciate vaulting a whole lot more!

 

[copper100]

One last post on this subject and then I have other things to do sorry.

If you can do nothing than comment on the face make up then, hey ho I completely understand. The team must have been sponsered by Robbie Williams .

Still waiting for the photos, hope you get over the technical differences.

I'll be back again in a couple of weeks to have a look cos you are not getting the point..

Thanks as always for your opinion though..

 

[lialls]

Vaulting did not get any money to go towards to cost of going to WEG, the teams had to do the fund raising themselves!

 

[Kallibear]

A rather childish attitude isn't it?: it doesn't appeal to me so it therefore must be pointless and stupid............ On that basic we should get rid of football and netball and rugby and running and golf and babminton and squash and all the matrial arts.......Because they're 'pointless' too.

What's the point of dressage? To ponce round looking pretty and making the horse dance? What a complete waste of time and effort......... As the ridiculous jumping rubbish - why the hell do you want to make a horse hurle themselves over flimsy bits of wood?

Valuting is very definitly a 'sport' and a great many people enjoy it. In fact, thats rather the point - unlike normal riding, which is a very selfish affair, many people can enojoy just one horse. It's used extensively in European riding schools for that reason.

It's difficult and takes a lot of athletic ability. I agree that it's much more to do with gymastics then 'riding' but it requires and horses and that therefore makes it an 'equestrian sport'

As for the horses - a very high level of schooling is required to preform like that and hence most of them compete at dressage/jumping/eventing. It is rather boring for them to canter round for 15mins but we do plenty of boring things to them. They're plenty fit enough to do it. The very slow, almost 'stilted' canter is encourage because the last thing you cant when you're standing up on their back is them bouncing round in medium canter!

And as for hats - hats are MORE dangerous than not. You vault exclusively on a soft surface and it's alsmost impossible to fall off. Some novices do wear a hat when riding solo but when there's two of you on a horse it's dangerous to to have big. baulking, hard hats .

And the weight they carry - they carry up to 20st at a time and it's spread over a VERY large area of the back - over the shoulders (a very strong area), over their hips and on the very thick, stiff pad over their whole back. The vaulters are all light children and as soon as you hit 16 (or 18 poss) you have to do individual dsiplays only. And these horses carrying 3 vaulters are BIG - 17hh+ usually. Entirely different for 20st of lard ass squished into an english saddle

I used to teach RDA vaulting (which is brilliant as it gives many riders a change to canter that would otherwise never have got to, or gives some the extra support someone on with them). I could stand up in canter and preform some of the easier moves but I was too old and stiff to do much more.

 

[copper100]

I post on both, because sorry I started the original post titled 'vaulting, your opinions'. 'WEG' Vaulting' thread was nothing to do with me but out of interest I have read the posts, maybe you should in depth as well and don't try to stop people having an opinion.

You are completely correct we will never agree on this subject and I never expected to having seen all the posts, but please dont presume to shut peoples opinions down. This is a peoples forum after all. And thanks you 'asset2004' for you opinion.

As I have said all I would like is an understanding of this and all I get is a defence reaction..

Enough said can't be asked any more.

 

[PippiPony]

Before you knock vaulting, watch my friend's troop "Jive Pony" perform. They've got videos on youtube, and have a website too now.

Once you've seen what Beccah and Rosie can do, you'll appreciate vaulting a whole lot more!

Saw them at the CLA game fair last year & they were great.

I like to watch the vaulting. Couldn't do it in a million years. but a lot of top German riders did vaulting before going on to other disciplines eg Isabel Werth

 

[tallyho!]

Why don't you give it a go then you can categorically say if it is a sport or not.

I hate football - but I've played a five-aside ladies team and won the series. I still hate it. Therefore I can say that because I've done it. I've formed an opinion by taking part in the activity.

Actually, come to think of it... shooting birds/animals/hunting foxes/fishing etc are called sports - why?

You're quite foolish to just dismiss things based on your own prejudices.

 

[gillianfleming]

Copper i'm slightly confused, you have a valid opinion but i have asked you a simple question (twice) and you can't even answer it.
I have also posted photos and videos, as you asked.
What is the point in putting the same posts in 2 threads?
You say that you want an understanding off it but from what i've read your not even reading other peoples points.
As Kallibear said they have now started up disabled groups, giving the children a chance to canter on their own, which they usually wouldn't get the chance to do. Ziggy the black horse in the earlier photo, does rda vaulting, one of the boys in the group has progressed to being part of one of the younger teams.
Oh and the point about the makeup was light hearted, he's the top male vaulter in Britain and a good friend.