Very aggressive horses

Wimbles

Wimbles

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I own a 16.3 ex racer who is a dream to ride (well most of the time), he has evented to Novice level and we really get on well when out and about.

The reason I was able to have such a great horse is that he has some "personality issues" to say the least.

He is hugely agressive and will bite, kick and lunge at you trying to crush you if given half the chance. He has improved off the scale since he came to us but you can never really let your guard down as he will literally tear a chunk out of you.

I was just wondering if anyone else has an aggressive horse and how you manage them?

We are very firm but fair with our lad, he would never be a horse that you could try to hit as he would just come back twice as hard.

I'm always interested in new ways to manage this horse to make his and my life easier.
 
Is this him in your pics? He is very handsome! I think you are doing everything right but presumably must be worrying not to mention scarey if he is so aggressive. I'm presuming you've had everything checked to make sure there aren't any issues with pain. Do you know what he was like when he was in training/racing? This may be a generalisation but when there are 50 odd horses on a yard to see to and exercise, patient, consistent and kind tactics are not usually the ones taken.
I have not had a horse as aggressive as yours, but I did used to ride a very large WB stallion but would happily take a chunk out of you or spin to get you, I dreaded ever falling off because I really didn't know who he would go for first, other horses, people or me! We did (my very experienced instructor) lots of groundwork with him and he did get better and more respectful of us. But it's a long and ongoing process. Best of luck, you are obviously doing plenty right if he is going so well ridden. x
 
Who is he bye as some stallions pass the aggression on to their off spring. But it sounds like you have gotten the best out of him and they do get better with time (just as long as you are not thinking of selling him on as that takes him back to square one). I've a mare I've owned for 9 years(must look in my diaries), who was a complete nightmare when I first got her and she still wears a muzzle when farrier comes and the vets stand on the other side of stable door, but she is 1000% better and alot relaxed in herself and with other people, I do spoil her as she gets fed first over the others and she likes that and she perfers being on her own in paddock, each horse is an seperate person and I treat them as such:D:D:D
 
My ex racer is rather aggressive in the stable. Hes fine when its just me and him but when someone else comes down to the stable he constantly trys to bite and grinds his teeth at people. There are some people he has taken a rather dislike to and will lunge at them like jaws!! Hes also like jaws when hes being groomed and will fling back legs around to threated to kick but never has actually kicked. My wee sister came up with a plan of, when he turns to bite make a high pitched screech to distract him and it actually works :eek: I wouldnt have an aggressive horse pts as long as you can control it around other people and whatever positives you have out weigh the negatives
 
He would only be pts is I could fail to keep him anymore which is highly unlikely but you always have to keep it in mind. I can manage him fine and I'm very lucky that my OH is very confident with him and I also have a friend that deals with him so all is good if I was ever injured/ill.

Join up with a professional has been tried and actually can work well some days but other days he just won't have it. It's very interesting when you take him out of his comfort zone as he relies on me to look after him and is like a different horse. I really have never known an animal like it.

He has lived in the best facilities for most of his life, being raced in Dubai and the US with Godolphin and then going on to event with a top olympic rider who did everything they could to give him a great life but it seems lots of turnout and slumming it suits him better!!! lol! He has had every check under the sun done but from speaking to his bredder he was always a bit of a "lad"

Here's the smiling assasin

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tigra.jpg
 
He's by Storm Cat and I've had him 2 and a half years now so we know every trick in the book!

One thing I will say about him though is that he is very professional when the farrier/dentist/vet come out to him which is a relief
 
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Wimbles said:
One thing I will say about him though is that he is very professional when the farrier/dentist/vet come out to him which is a relief
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He is gorgeous :D how olds he, if you dont mind me asking that is :D ... mine also is a different horse with the vet, farrier etc he even nibbles my farriers hat, its very cute!!! They must like there foot massages hehe
 
So bred in the purple so to speak. I think you doing a grand job with him and I think a racing or jumping or event stables aren't always the best place for a highly strung horse as they are busy busy busy. I have only 4 and my mare is happy with that system. I once had a warning from the county council about a dangerous horse(my mare). It turned out she didn't like blonde haired teenage girls with basball caps, which told me quite alot and I have a footpath that goes past her paddock, but as I have said things do get better, you have to lay out ground rules for yourself not just the horse and if you stick to them he will improve.:D:D:D
 
Monsters - first time someone has agreed with me, ever!

I'm sorry if I upset you saying I'd have him put down - obviously if you're managing it thats really great. I would just wonder whats going on in that gorgeous head that makes him that angry =[
 
No, it doesn't upset me in the slightest. You're not the first and certainly won't be the last to say that (My OH has been known to mutter the same phrase on a bad day!). You're not the only one that wonders what's going on in that head. It's so weird but as soon as the tack's on he just changes and loves being ridden and going out and about. He positively smiles and even we even gave a friend who was literally just learning to ride some lessons on him and she took him on a christmas ride! it's usually the other way round with horses isn't it!
 
My first thoughts with aggressive horses is are they in pain? But you say he has been checked out.
So it sounds to me like he is a very independant horse!!
Out of interest how does he interact with other horses?
In my experience a frim but fair approach is best and sounds like you are doing everything right by him. :)
Is he stabled or living out? We had an aggressive horse who was very intelligent and got very bored in his stable which he tried to tell us about by biting as anyone walked past and spinning and kicking when people were in his stable etc. we used stable toys,turned him out more and kept him stimulated as much as possible and with firm but fair handling he settled down considerably.
Just a few of my thought on the matter :)
 
He gets bullied by everything in the field, even our 12.2 pony will have a pop.

Other horses find him very rude as he has never really had a great deal of interaction with other horses 'till he came to us. He doesn't understand their subtle body language so wades in and gets a telling off.

We try and give him as much turnout as possible and for the first year he was just turned away completely and I think this has helped him no-end. Now he just comes in at night from Nov - March.

Thanks to everyone for replying, it's good to pick everyones brains whatever your opinion
 
flamehead said:
I would have a horse that violent put down. But I really hope you find something that helps.
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why? if it can be managed and has a talent? i had a mare like it she was as bbad to other horses and to hack and school she reared plunged and lept about .. that mares love in life was jumping show her a 1.60m fence and she would pop it from a trot. if you knew how to handle her she was fine, my novice hubby handled her all the time.. only in 2 years of owning her did he get a near splat against a wall and she sodded off at a dressage comp and tried to roll.. she would lunge over a stable door to the point people asked how did you go in the stable.. easy she learnt manners i said back she went back. never did i get kicked or hurt by her.

i think your responce was a little extreme. oh mine also had food agression! any way she went off hunting and bsja..
 
Wimbles said:
No, it doesn't upset me in the slightest. You're not the first and certainly won't be the last to say that (My OH has been known to mutter the same phrase on a bad day!). You're not the only one that wonders what's going on in that head. It's so weird but as soon as the tack's on he just changes and loves being ridden and going out and about. He positively smiles and even we even gave a friend who was literally just learning to ride some lessons on him and she took him on a christmas ride! it's usually the other way round with horses isn't it!
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my mares i later found out was all totally man made.
 
Tricky! I had an ex racer who found life in a racing yard very stressful, was a dreadful box walker and had a reputation for being vicious in the stable. I was always ultra careful around him, but one day he got me whilst I was skipping out last thing at night. He bit me on the side of my rib cage, leaving a huge vivid bruise right down one side of my body. I was so angry and shocked, I hurled my pitchfork at him before thinking. It hit him and he immediately backed off - I think I shocked him rather than hurt him (although the way I felt at that particular moment I can't say Id have been too bothered if Id chopped his head off!) and strangely he elected that the best course of action was to respect me after that.

He was an odd horse though, he never really 'got' the rules of body language. He would sometimes back up to you with an odd and aggressive look on his face, but if you brazened it out, all he wanted was his bottom scratching.

Not that I am suggesting for one second you beat your beautiful horse with a pitchfork, but that's how I (inadvertently) cured mine. :)
 
He is a lovely, lovely horse :D. D1 is totally smitten, despite the 'interesting' handling issues! :cool:

I think that from the horses I've seen handled and that I've seen in the past, he really is a one off. Under saddle he is as Wimbles says, a complete star :D; on the ground and you really have to respect this horse.

Having been stood in the way one day, when any other horse would have swerved round at the last minute, I just knew he wouldn't and I legged it :cool::rolleyes:.

I think Wimbles that you are doing everything that can be done with him and for him :). It makes for an interesting, if not a relaxing relationship, but he really is worth it :). You've made such a difference to his life. Maybe his mannerisms are now ingrained and he is how he is.

The only thing that I could think of, and I can't remember if you've tried this, is have Mickey Gavin out for a session.

By the way, absolutely love that picutre of you and the lad :D
 
My mare is a completely unfriendly creature. She doesn't actually bite or kick (unless you're my husband!) but pulls awful faces and lunges at the door. Not many people will go in with her, despite the fact that she's ok under the faces. Like your horse, once on the leadrein, or under saddle she is a dream. She's the one I'd trust the most once you've got her! After five years, I've just come to the conclusion that she's not a "people person". She likes her space. When she's ridden she would die trying to please, and has never bucked, reared or refused a jump... So I leave her be and let her have her space when she's not working. Interestingly we sent her away to stud for 5 months this year. She came back last month (not in foal) and has been virtually friendly since she came back - as if she can't believe her luck to be back. She follows me round if I go in the field (usually a nightmare to catch) and has been much nicer. Not friendly compared to the others who cuddle and play at every opportunity, but by her standards its positively gushing! I guess you just have to accept that some horses are like that (or have been made like that), and as long as everyone who handles them knows that, and is ok with that, then its ok.
 
I have owned my ex-racer for over two years and can see some major parallels with your lad!

I have over 30 years experience with horses and have handled some tricky ones in my time but the first couple of months with him were trying to say the least. He was trying to 'nibble' when I viewed him and I saw how tight his old owner tied him when tacking up but it didn't prepare me for the day after he arrived. I was grooming him (which I now realise he hates) and he snapped round and bit my elbow - I immediately reacted and hit his chest and he literally launched at me taking a massive bite out of my chest which left me with muscle damage, massive bruising and a haematoma. He then stood there shaking as meek as a mouse. It wasn't the last time he had a go but it was probably the worst.

Two months after I bought him he was hospitalised with a bout of peritonitis which nearly killed him and as part of the tests done he was scoped which showed some relatively low grade gastric ulcers. These were blitzed with GastroGard for two weeks and then I used and Equine America product for a couple of months. He still pulls faces but has never gone to bite and if I shout at him when he's pulling faces he looks guilty!! We've done a bit of join up and he will follow me around like a puppy when I'm poo-picking now.

Funnily enough, he has always been a gentleman with vets, farriers, dentist etc. He is also a completely different horse when tacked up and tries his heart out. I would trust him with anyone riding apart from a complete numpty.

It sounds like you're on the right track with your lad (who is GORGEOUS by the way!!) - I think some of it is learnt behaviour though and sometimes whatever you do it will never completely go away - but might be worth having him scoped (if you haven't already) as it was a turning point for Baz. :D
 
I had an aggresive horse once who we got from Ireland, something very bad had obviously happened to him as he was scared of people and his fight mode was constantly on as if he couldn't switch it off.

We unfortunalty had this horse PTS as when I fell off him one day he plunged at me and kicked me, luckily I had a BP on!!! I managed to roll out the way and he was left to his devices until we could get near him.

Once he was put down we asked to have his brain looked at as we would sure there was something wrong with him, turns out he had a severe blow to his head (the vet thinks a hammer) which made him loopy. I feel sorry for the poor boy and I never got angry at him even when he kicked me because I knew that would make it worse.

Best of luck with your boy, but he doesn't sound as bad as Congo, I'd just keep doing what you're doing you'll get there eventually! :)
 
Wimbles, you could be talking about my Grumpy :eek:
He is just not a nice person...
Interestingly, he gets bullied in the field, so he is turned out on his own.
He will lunge at the stable door to bite, spin round and try to kick and run you over if you stand in the way.
He is an absolute delight to ride and has a very good jump on him.
He's a WB, eventing bred and a little bit of a slow learner, but once he gets something, it stays there forever.
It does get better with time, he is completely dependant on me, attention seeking so and so.
He has suffered from ulcers and I manage him as an ulcer horse.
 
I have an aggressive mare. She's always been well cared for, and I know her breeders well and nothing has ever happened to make her the way she is. She is talented and is an out and out SJ horse. She will pull a pretty face over the door then go to bite you, you can't go in her stable with her as she will pin you in the corner and go with both barrels. It's all about management, she's not a "nasty" horse, just likes her own space and is a bit of a stress head to boot. We never go in the box with her, everything that needs to be done she is tied up outside to do. She hates being rugged or girthed up so you have to be careful then, but normally if you girth up very slowly she is better. I have an old half chap sitting by the stable door, sometimes I think she's not actually wanting to "bite" as such but put something in her mouth and has somewhere along the line been told off or it, hence the aggression, if you go up to her when ears are forward and hold the manky old half chap she will happily chew on this and not you and be quite happy to be fussed over the door. Funnily enough she loves being groomed when tied up outside and is very tactile and will groom you back. She also loves other horses. When riding at home she also is of the opinion that she knows best and is quite difficult and pig headed, when you get her to a show or new environment she is like a different horse and very rider reliant. She is just very fussy with her personal space, if you put her somewhere new she's nice as pie for a week till she settles then gets terrotorial, we gave her a holiday for a few weeks in the spring with no handling at all and if anyone went in to try and do something to the fence, or one of the other horses she would chase you out the field! This is a horse that in the wrong hands would be deemed as aggressive or even dangerous to handle, but often once you understand these horses its all a matter of common sense and playing by their rules on space and interaction. There has only been one horse that I have known that was os aggressive it needed to be PTS and that was a stunning 14,2hh coloured gelding. He came in to a place I used to work as boss had bought him from a dealer, he was obv. unbroken and had been doped when she tried him as was wild as you like, and had been severly mistreated somewhere. He was very difficult as even with lots of ground work he would panic and go for you. Some how I managed to break him in, all was going well and he was riding round fine until one day he exploded in the school, I came off and he litrally went for me while I was on the floor. All I could do was curl up in to a tight ball and wait for someone to get him off.
 
PS interesting what everyone says about the ulcers, I also am thinking about having my mare scoped, but until then am trying the global herbs acid X stuff which a friend used on her similar ulcer horse and worked wonders. I also make sure she has ad lib hay.
 
as ive been reading all ur posts i cant help but think....that sounds like my boy....now when i say boy i mean my son...he has autism and adhd....but the similarities in temperment are unreal....loves to do things he likes, but is agressive when asked to do something hes not interested in...hits out when hes scared or asked to do something hes unsure of....likes stability and routine etc etc......do you think some horses can have autism?????????:rolleyes::rolleyes:.....it would explain all ur horses actions
fortunately my horse is as quiet as a mouse..:-))))):):)
 
suzanneand bayley said:
as ive been reading all ur posts i cant help but think....that sounds like my boy....now when i say boy i mean my son...he has autism and adhd....but the similarities in temperment are unreal....loves to do things he likes, but is agressive when asked to do something hes not interested in...hits out when hes scared or asked to do something hes unsure of....likes stability and routine etc etc......do you think some horses can have autism?????????:rolleyes::rolleyes:.....it would explain all ur horses actions
fortunately my horse is as quiet as a mouse..:-))))):):)
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Funny you should say that - my OH often compares Grumpy to an autistic child...
I believe that he is just permanently misunderstood and socially awkward.
 
flamehead said:
I would have a horse that violent put down. But I really hope you find something that helps.
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:(:(:(:(:( Lucy was so agressive you couldn't even go in the field with her for 6 months. If you did she would just chase you out and if you didn't run she would try to kick you in the head. :(She was agressive because she didn't trust people. But just look how she turned out once I gaind her trust. :D
Herbie was also agressive when I got him. He would bite and kick to get his own way. He would launch at you on the lunge. I have to admit Sometimes it was quite scary. I found I had to stand my ground. He had just lurnt how to intimidate people to get his own way. I had to show him I wasn't scared. I didn't hit him as this just made him worse. I found just saying "NO" in a ferm voice very effective. I give him lots of praise when he's being nice. I just got on with what i wanted to do and ignored all his protests. The trick with Herbs is not to loose your temper because that is what he wants. I just stay calm and deal with him in a firm but fair mannor. Herbie is slowly getting better although I still don't trust him 100% yet. I hope one day he turns out as lovely as Lucy did.
I hope you find a way to help your horse as he sounds lovely in evry other way. :)
 
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