*Very long* I don't know what to do...

the shadster said:
I always found with my horse (who used to stand vertical, spin, buck etc when he didn't want to do something) that the 2nd tap of the whip was the most effective. The first tap he'd throw his toys out the pram scare me half to death, but if quickly used again he'd completely give in & realise I meant business. It does take some guts to do it because you fear an even bigger explosion but without fail he always gave in. This gradually gave me more confidence, and I think sometimes you just have to do it yourself rather than pay a better rider, because some horses will always test if they feel a weakness/fear & boy does it make you a better rider when you come out the other side. I've found the use of person on bike when first trying to hack solo a great help. The horse seems to see it as a horse/human hybrid & takes some comfort & gradually the cyclist can hang back a bit but you feel more confident because you know someone is close at hand if things start to go pear shaped. And sing out loud to yourself it definitely helps relax you!
Good luck!
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Thank you, the problem is I've got to survive the first tap of the whip! He's got this buck rear spin piece that is fairly unseating.

If/when I hack him alone I will take someone with me whether that be on bike or foot, it will only help me to feel more relaxed.
 
My last horse scared me to death.I was a complete scardy cat on him and I admit this without any shame.I loved him to bits on the ground and cried for a week when I knew I had to sell him.I paid for extra schooling for him and sent him to a good selling livery with the instructions that home was more important than price.They kept me up to date with all that was happening and I could go and see him whenever I wanted.They found him a perfect home where I am sure he was a lot happier and I found the perfect horse for me.Do I love him? You bet.
Louise Whitaker, as a child, got scared jumping at one point.Mixture of things but basically wrong pony and probably a bit too much pressure.Her family just let her stop jumping and when SHE was ready to start again found her a more suitable pony.How sensible.
 
putasocinit said:
and Elvis is saying if you stick with me and stop being a scaredy cat, I am going to make a better rider out of you, so breathe, forget what happened yesterday, you fell off or whatever, today is a new day and be positive and relax, I am sure you will find Elvis works better for you.
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er, I don't think that's what Elvis is saying AT ALL. It probably goes more like "Right, I've bucked you off because I can; how'd you like me to do it again?". Bad horses (or just plain not-the-right-one) do not make good riders; good, well trained horses do.
 
Cortez said:
er, I don't think that's what Elvis is saying AT ALL. It probably goes more like "Right, I've bucked you off because I can; how'd you like me to do it again?". Bad horses (or just plain not-the-right-one) do not make good riders; good, well trained horses do.
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Thank you.
 
You're going to send him to a pro if you decide to sell, so why not send him now and ask for their honest assessment. Go and watch them deal with him and if you feel ready have some lessons with the pro on him.

Whilst he's away at boot camp continue lessons on other horses to build your confidence, if none are available consider lessons on a simulator.

Elvis said:
Stop being a scaredy cat...right and how do you go about that?
Apologies if this comes across rudely, but my confidence is something I really try to work on and push, and the thing that has often kept me going is telling myself that doing this will make me a better rider. All I want to be is a brave rider, I long for that more than anything else.
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Talk to Jo Cooper and see if she can help you re the above. http://www.equestrianconfidence.com/
 
To me, doesnt sound like you are ready to give up yet!!

Take a month off, send him away, have some one else ride him, and find a confidence giving but not push button ride horse for you to continue riding, and learning on, get one or both or a new instructor to ride him a few times for you, so they can 'get a feel for him' and then on you pop.

I dont know if these things work but how about a bit of rescue remedy or Kalms, to ease your nerves a little (even if it is a placebo) and work slowly with your instuctor/dive in the deep end, which ever works best for you.

If all else fails, if he isnt the horse for you, then that is just what he is. Not. the. horse. for. you.

Good Luck OP
 
gunnergundog said:
You're going to send him to a pro if you decide to sell, so why not send him now and ask for their honest assessment. Go and watch them deal with him and if you feel ready have some lessons with the pro on him.

Whilst he's away at boot camp continue lessons on other horses to build your confidence, if none are available consider lessons on a simulator.



Talk to Jo Cooper and see if she can help you re the above. http://www.equestrianconfidence.com/
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Thank you for the link, I'll look into that. :)

And when I do send him to a pro (I need to find someone first) I will be visiting regularly to see how they deal with him, and depending on what they think, I will then have lessons on him.

And I'll continue my lessons on other horses as it really is very beneficial.
 
Zero00000 said:
To me, doesnt sound like you are ready to give up yet!!

Take a month off, send him away, have some one else ride him, and find a confidence giving but not push button ride horse for you to continue riding, and learning on, get one or both or a new instructor to ride him a few times for you, so they can 'get a feel for him' and then on you pop.

I dont know if these things work but how about a bit of rescue remedy or Kalms, to ease your nerves a little (even if it is a placebo) and work slowly with your instuctor/dive in the deep end, which ever works best for you.

If all else fails, if he isnt the horse for you, then that is just what he is. Not. the. horse. for. you.

Good Luck OP
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Thank you, I just don't want to give up and then regret it later.
I will try Kalms, but my nerves aren't obvious, at least to me, I don't fear getting on him, it's just I'm not as relaxed on him as other horses. And then when he has a paddy I perhaps don't push him as far as I should.
 
Do you still look forward to riding him? Or does it always fill you with a sense of dread? I dont mean every now and then (I adore my horse but there are days when he is being such a bu**er I dont want to get on)! I mean in the last say two months, how many rides have been enjoyable and how many have been a chore?
 
Fun Times said:
Do you still look forward to riding him? Or does it always fill you with a sense of dread? I dont mean every now and then (I adore my horse but there are days when he is being such a bu**er I dont want to get on)! I mean in the last say two months, how many rides have been enjoyable and how many have been a chore?
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I guess I feel indifferent about riding him- I don't look forward to it, I don't dread it, I just hope that I manage to achieve something.

And I'd say all but 1 flat lesson have been disappointing. And the one I enjoyed was because we used poles and worked on canter. But I've enjoyed the jump lessons. So bearing in mind I mostly flat I'd say 60-70% of lessons have been dejecting.

(All my lessons on other horses have been enjoyable, mostly because I can do no stirrup work and focus on myself properly and then the horses work correctly and I find that very rewarding)
 
Hi OP, i've not read all the reply's but i just wanted to say that it doesn't sound to me as though he is the right horse for you.

I sold a coloured cob to a local lady this time last year. He wasn't anything special & had his own little quirks. The lady had lost all of her confidence after battling for 10 years with a grumpy, moody mare that had scared her half to death. I was a little hesitant about her riding my cob as i felt that he took confidence from his rider. I was very up front with her & she came over to me with a mutual friend of ours & rode & played about with him 3 or 4 times. I was still concerned so i boxed him over to her's & she hacked him out on her busy roads in awful, windy, snowy conditions. We introduced him to her many different animals, including goats, llama's & donkey's!! He took it all in his stride & she decided to buy him. I kept in touch with her & was glad to hear that he settled in well & it was going smoothly.

After about six months i bumped into her near the end of a sponsored ride. She had the BIGGEST smile on her face & was giving leads to her friends through the water & over jumps. She told me how grateful she was to me for selling her the little cob & said that she done more with him in six months, RC clinics, dressage comps & sponsored rides, things she'd always wanted to do, but hadn't managed in ten years with her other horse.

I was sooooo pleased for both her & my funny little cob, just goes to show that there's the right horse for everybody. I hope that you can find yours & start having some fun. Good luck.
 
HazyXmas said:
Hi OP, i've not read all the reply's but i just wanted to say that it doesn't sound to me as though he is the right horse for you.

I sold a coloured cob to a local lady this time last year. He wasn't anything special & had his own little quirks. The lady had lost all of her confidence after battling for 10 years with a grumpy, moody mare that had scared her half to death. I was a little hesitant about her riding my cob as i felt that he took confidence from his rider. I was very up front with her & she came over to me with a mutual friend of ours & rode & played about with him 3 or 4 times. I was still concerned so i boxed him over to her's & she hacked him out on her busy roads in awful, windy, snowy conditions. We introduced him to her many different animals, including goats, llama's & donkey's!! He took it all in his stride & she decided to buy him. I kept in touch with her & was glad to hear that he settled in well & it was going smoothly.

After about six months i bumped into her near the end of a sponsored ride. She had the BIGGEST smile on her face & was giving leads to her friends through the water & over jumps. She told me how grateful she was to me for selling her the little cob & said that she done more with him in six months, RC clinics, dressage comps & sponsored rides, things she'd always wanted to do, but hadn't managed in ten years with her other horse.

I was sooooo pleased for both her & my funny little cob, just goes to show that there's the right horse for everybody. I hope that you can find yours & start having some fun. Good luck.
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Thank you, that's a lovely story. =]
 
For now I'd stick you body protector on, put a grab strap between the D's of your saddle and a neck strap. It gives you something to hold on to and I know a few people that always put a bp on because it makes them feel more confident.

But I'd be looking at sending him to a pro for a few weeks for them to see if they can sort him out and teach you how to deal with him. I'd also probably get them to compete him for you.
 
dafthoss said:
For now I'd stick you body protector on, put a grab strap between the D's of your saddle and a neck strap. It gives you something to hold on to and I know a few people that always put a bp on because it makes them feel more confident.

But I'd be looking at sending him to a pro for a few weeks for them to see if they can sort him out and teach you how to deal with him. I'd also probably get them to compete him for you.
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Thank you, I already ride with an air jacket and neck strap, which I do get confidence from =]
 
Elvis said:
My goals with Elvis or any horse I have is to do a bit of everything. I don't want a world beater I just want to be able to hack alone and in company and be 100% relaxed, I want a horse that I can hunt, take cross country, do some show jumping and some dressage. Maybe I'd get there with Elvis one day, at least I'd hope so with the dressage and Showjumping, the hacking and hunting are dubious though.
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Are you, as a rider, capable of doing all those activities now? Or are they things that you would like to be able to do sometime in the future? If you would be able to do them tomorrow on the right horse then Elvis is the wrong horse for you. If not although you might well be over-horsed atm, you do seem to have plenty of support and if you are not sure that you want to sell him, it might be worth persevering
 
fwiw, I too was in a fairly similar position I got a young horse who absolutely terrified me, I didn't realise it at first though but slowly slowly he chipped away at my confidence, taking me from what I thought was a fairly confident if a little rusty rider to a nervous wreck, he too had his problems with confidence, bad previous handling - had to have him re-backed and professionally schooled. I kept on with it hoping that things would get better, praying they would cos I didn't want to get rid of him, fast forward 6 1/2 years and lots of falls, tears, should I sell him, should I keep him things are improving! Last year we did a couple of pleasure rides, intro dressage tests and we almost always hack out alone (no-one else at yard hacks!). Hacking alone was a no no, he had no confidence and would only go behind another horse, if I tried to go alone he would spin, run backwards, rear and drop his right shoulder and I did out of fear give in to him!
Things have had to change in the past 6 months though otherwise I would never ride him, today we had a 10 minute paddy cos he didn't want to go past a house we pass on every hack as someone was doing work in the garage! I do (only in last few months) use a whip, usually just a reminder tap to the shoulder, always leg on, if he really argues and messes about he gets 2 cracks on the bum. I talk away to him, sometimes sing and actually love riding him on our own as he is much more forward going. I do remember how I felt even a year ago, I am still far from brave and probably wouldn't dream of jumping what you do on Elvis but I love riding my horse and I am so proud of how far we have come.
Not really sure what I am trying to say but either way you have to make up your mind about how far you will go with him, if you stick with him have a plan set yourself targets, don't beat yourself up if things go wrong now and again or as others have said call it a day and move on. Good luck with whatever you decide, stay safe and enjoy your horse :-)
 
Elvis said:
The problem is he can get me off,
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This is the crucial point for me. you don't have a confidence problem, you have self preservation. If you carry on as you are you could get seriously hurt. Even if you keep telling yourself "man up, kick on, get better, etc", that fact remains. I wouldn't have another horse I knew could or would put me on the floor, its so, so much nicer to have one that tries to look after you, you feel like a team which is much nicer than trying to prove something that isn't worth proving IMHO. I'd chuck it in IIWY.
 
Pearlsasinger said:
Are you, as a rider, capable of doing all those activities now? Or are they things that you would like to be able to do sometime in the future? If you would be able to do them tomorrow on the right horse then Elvis is the wrong horse for you. If not although you might well be over-horsed atm, you do seem to have plenty of support and if you are not sure that you want to sell him, it might be worth persevering
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Yes I am capable of all of the above, and have done so in the past on other horses. That's not to say I wouldn't be a little nervous the first couple of times (competing) but I would be able to go out and do all of the above tomorrow on a horse I trusted.
 
janei said:
fwiw, I too was in a fairly similar position I got a young horse who absolutely terrified me, I didn't realise it at first though but slowly slowly he chipped away at my confidence, taking me from what I thought was a fairly confident if a little rusty rider to a nervous wreck, he too had his problems with confidence, bad previous handling - had to have him re-backed and professionally schooled. I kept on with it hoping that things would get better, praying they would cos I didn't want to get rid of him, fast forward 6 1/2 years and lots of falls, tears, should I sell him, should I keep him things are improving! Last year we did a couple of pleasure rides, intro dressage tests and we almost always hack out alone (no-one else at yard hacks!). Hacking alone was a no no, he had no confidence and would only go behind another horse, if I tried to go alone he would spin, run backwards, rear and drop his right shoulder and I did out of fear give in to him!
Things have had to change in the past 6 months though otherwise I would never ride him, today we had a 10 minute paddy cos he didn't want to go past a house we pass on every hack as someone was doing work in the garage! I do (only in last few months) use a whip, usually just a reminder tap to the shoulder, always leg on, if he really argues and messes about he gets 2 cracks on the bum. I talk away to him, sometimes sing and actually love riding him on our own as he is much more forward going. I do remember how I felt even a year ago, I am still far from brave and probably wouldn't dream of jumping what you do on Elvis but I love riding my horse and I am so proud of how far we have come.
Not really sure what I am trying to say but either way you have to make up your mind about how far you will go with him, if you stick with him have a plan set yourself targets, don't beat yourself up if things go wrong now and again or as others have said call it a day and move on. Good luck with whatever you decide, stay safe and enjoy your horse :-)
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Thank you, this is the niggle at the back of my mind, what if I continued and he turned into the most fantastic horse.
 
Flame_ said:
This is the crucial point for me. you don't have a confidence problem, you have self preservation. If you carry on as you are you could get seriously hurt. Even if you keep telling yourself "man up, kick on, get better, etc", that fact remains. I wouldn't have another horse I knew could or would put me on the floor, its so, so much nicer to have one that tries to look after you, you feel like a team which is much nicer than trying to prove something that isn't worth proving IMHO. I'd chuck it in IIWY.
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This is the thing, I don't feel like I have a confidence issue, I'm happy to ride most horses, jump, xc etc.

Every time I say to my instructor that I want to keep trying she says 'that's fine, just don't end up hurt' and I know what she's getting at, I've been lucky with my falls and have come away unscathed.
 
Elvis said:
Thank you, this is the niggle at the back of my mind, what if I continued and he turned into the most fantastic horse.
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this is your million dollar question, you don't know the answer and nobody else does, I guess that was my point I went with my heart, rightly or wrongly. Lots of people said to me and have said to you, your horse should be fun and you should enjoy it - they are absolutely right. You are not wrong if you decide to sell him neither are you if you really can 100% say you want to continue with him. I still have a long way to go with my horse we are not perfect don't get me wrong but I am now enjoying the journey x
 
janei said:
this is your million dollar question, you don't know the answer and nobody else does, I guess that was my point I went with my heart, rightly or wrongly. Lots of people said to me and have said to you, your horse should be fun and you should enjoy it - they are absolutely right. You are not wrong if you decide to sell him neither are you if you really can 100% say you want to continue with him. I still have a long way to go with my horse we are not perfect don't get me wrong but I am now enjoying the journey x
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6 1/2 years is a veeery long journey.........
 
I have been in a similar situation had previous horse and he was very sweet on the ground fine to hack out in company and loved jumping but hated schooling had me off too many times to remember plus very experienced riders, and it wasn't that i was frightened of him just fed up of getting no where with him! Eventually accepted he wasn't going to do the things i wanted to do and i got a new one and finally remembered what it was like to enjoy riding again.
Its never an easy decision but only you can decide whats best! Good luck
 
You could continue, work super hard, send him away to a pro, get lessons on others and maybe at the end of a long journey you MIGHT have a fantastic horse.

Or you could sell him and buy something which you can go out and start having fun on now which is already a fantastic horse.

Maybe I seem impatient but you've already spent time, money and effort trying to make thing work between you. Are you really willing to spend another indefinite amount of time on him "just in case" he turns out to be a superstar - it could be a year, 2 years, 10 years or never before he turns into your dream horse.

Difficult choice. Good luck x
 
Brimmers said:
Are you really willing to spend another indefinite amount of time on him "just in case" he turns out to be a superstar - it could be a year, 2 years, 10 years or never before he turns into your dream horse.
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And during the early stages of this long journey, you need to be up to sticking to him for the most part or your body could be too screwed from injuries to enjoy him if he does eventually come good for you. I don't think this gets said often enough tbh. Its not just a choice between persevering and an easy life - remember not to take silly chances with your body, you only get the one and it won't always heal after a bad fall.
 
Elvis said:
This is the thing, I don't feel like I have a confidence issue, I'm happy to ride most horses, jump, xc etc.

Every time I say to my instructor that I want to keep trying she says 'that's fine, just don't end up hurt' and I know what she's getting at, I've been lucky with my falls and have come away unscathed.
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After your reply to my previous post OP, I was going to say 'then you have the wrong horse' but now I think you have the wrong instructor. She should be boosting your confidence and giving you strategies to deal with his behaviour not saying 'don't end up hurt'. No wonder you don't relax. Find a new RI, who will help not hinder.
 
Shadster kind of said it, I think. Talking about a naughty horse with a friend this week, she watched a novice tap him, horse objected, she couldn't get him into canter. Friend said she would have tapped again and he would have gone on. I agreed.

Another girl told me I was stupid to keep my horse if he wasn't the right one-too small, too spooky. She's right, but I can't sell him, I adore him, so I can see the problem. You love the boy and it's damned hard to sell/loan. I can't do it.

However, I think if you want to compete, you have various options, including lots of time and money with instructors on what might be a very talented but sharp horse, or think about another horse that is already schooled and a joy to ride.
 
Not read all replies - I've just sold my gelding - though I love him to bits he's too sharp for me and I don't enjoy the riding part as I should. Lots of people told me to persevere but what I actually wanted was someone to tell me that I'd done all I was capable of and to sell and buy something I'd enjoy. I'm not saying this is the case with you OP but I knew deep down for a while that he wasn't fulfilling my criteria and would benefit going to someone more confident/competent. All I'm saying is life's too short to struggle so why make it hard work when it doesn't need to be. Appreciate a difficult decision to make - don't envy you.
 
realistically, the horse isn't going to turn into a superstar. It will probably turn into an average horse with slightly less issues or a rider who handles them better eventually. Life isn't a film and struggling for years doesn't mean you get the reward you deserve. It sounds harsh but i know from experience. I have a rescue horse who is lovely on the ground but a nightmare to ride, he used to rear and flips on others. Luckily i was able to get another horse who is just my dream horse, he was cheap but he's confident, fun and we can go anywhere and enjoy it. I had stuck my difficult one for years, in the same belief we would have a breakthrough and all would be worthwhile. We did have a breakthrough, and I have a horse i enjoy riding now, but he has his limitations, and he is what he his.I won't be out hunting, or competing at a high level on him, but luckily i have the other one to do that stuff with. Sometimes you just have the horse you have, and you either accept it or change.

I don't think my years struggling with the nightmare horse improved my riding at all, it just made me think other horses were remarkably simple and safe compared to him! It made me ride defensively, constantly on guard for dangers and unable to progress as we were taking baby steps to get him forward and concentrating with no messing. I have come on 100% more with the confidence giver. I can concentrate on fine tuning and tiny details, and pushing myself over jumps and cross country with instructors.

If you say you want to continue with the horse and the instructor says ' don't get hurt' then I think thats saying a lot. Why would you risk serious injury. It sounds like its just pride, fondness for the horse and that you don't want to admit defeat. That's not the case though, you have buckled down and tried to ride it through. 6 years is too long to be struggling with a problem. the chances are you will be in the same place in another six years time. Why not get a horse you click with and can enjoy properly.
 
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