Vets ... Clinical confidentiality

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Greylegs

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Just wondering if vets are subject to (either legally or morally) the same sort of clinical confidentiality that human doctors observe.

Went to the yard today and my favourite vet was there treating another livery. He's a lovely guy, a brilliant vet and would definitely be my vet of choice in the event my lad needed heavy weight veterinary care. He greeted me by name and we chatted about the weather and other inconsequential stuff, while he re-dressed a surgery wound on the horse's leg. I then asked him how <horse X> was doing. (The owner was not present ... ). He told me how the horse was progressing(OK), what surgery it had received (substantial), it's prognosis for recovery (not good!) and we discussed its future prospects (dodgy, sadly, as it's a lovely horse).

Whilst I knew most of what he'd told me already, I'm left wondering how I'd feel if my vet was chatting about my horse's health to another person in this way. My GP wouldn't chat like this about my own health (I hope!!) so should vets keep medical information confidential?

I'd be interested in opinions .....
 
that was inappropriate of the vet - there should be the same confidentiality as you would with your gp
 
I'm not sure the two can be compared. The horse's job prospects aren't going to be affected by medical history being made public, nor will he be treated differently by friends and family. If anything, if a vet knew something about a horse that made its level of work unsuitable, I would hope they would intervene. If you are worried I would just nicely ask my vet not to discuss treatment with others.
 
Confidentiality is covered in the RCVS professional code of conduct. You can read it on their website.
 
I would not be happy if my vet discussed my horse with somebody else,I would never ask a vet about someone else's animal either though so I don't see why you are that worried if you felt it was okay to ask/discuss a fellow liverys horse.

I did recently have to pull my farrier up for discussing my horse with someone else. He's a terrible gossip it's his only downfall.
 
stormox said:
The vet was put on the spot by you asking, really.
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He could have answered "fine" or "as well as expected", then changed the subject, no need to go into detail especially if the prognosis is poor it is down to the owner if she wants that information circulated round the yard.

As a YO I have an agreement with my owners that I can call out and arrange treatments for all the horses in my care, I have had to show this once to a new vet although the normal vets coming onto the yard know I am fully involved so it has never been an issue, if for some reason they wanted any treatment done without my involvement that would be fine and I would respect this and be discrete, I would expect the same of the vet.
 
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When you say you discussed the vice, do you mean he gave you all of the information or you made it clear you were aware of the condition?

Not that it makes much difference tbh it's still unprofessional.
 
I'd be very unhappy if that was my vet. We all know how hard it can be when your horse is unwell, so to then have that information circulated, and possibly have to deal with multiple other people's opinions on how you should approach the situation, would surely make it ten times worse.
 
Especially as if the owenr was trying not to think about it she can now read her horses future prospects on HHO!
 
be positive said:
He could have answered "fine" or "as well as expected", then changed the subject, no need to go into detail especially if the prognosis is poor it is down to the owner if she wants that information circulated round the yard.

As a YO I have an agreement with my owners that I can call out and arrange treatments for all the horses in my care, I have had to show this once to a new vet although the normal vets coming onto the yard know I am fully involved so it has never been an issue, if for some reason they wanted any treatment done without my involvement that would be fine and I would respect this and be discrete, I would expect the same of the vet.
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I should add that I asked casually "How's he doing?" As I was standing in the horses stable doorway at the time and it seemed like the polite thing to do as we were chatting ..... I was expecting a non commital "OK" sort of answer I guess.
 
My vets won't - they can't even tell you if they are treating another horse (although obviously if you see them that's different)
 
Perhaps it was unprofessional of you to approach the vet and stand in the horse's doorway. You had not called him out and you were not paying the bill so b...out? Having been rude enough to interfere in another livery's vet visit maybe it would be prudent not to blag about it on a public forum?
 
Greylegs said:
Just wondering if vets are subject to (either legally or morally) the same sort of clinical confidentiality that human doctors observe.

Whilst I knew most of what he'd told me already, I'm left wondering how I'd feel if my vet was chatting about my horse's health to another person in this way. My GP wouldn't chat like this about my own health (I hope!!) so should vets keep medical information confidential?

I'd be interested in opinions .....
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I imagine that if you were with your GP you wouldn't expect a fellow patient to stand in the doorway asking your GP about your health. By the same token, I wouldn't expect a fellow livery to be in the doorway of my horse's stable chatting to my brilliant vet about the weather etc let alone my horse's wellbeing. If it's something that now concerns you in regard to your own horse I really don't understand why you asked how the horse was doing. Or even why you were there in the first place.
 
You say you respect the vet.

YOU made the conversation, continued the conversation and clearly thrived in getting all this information. You then go on a public forum and insult the vet's professionalism for discussing something you were happy to talk about earlier!

I hope for the vet's sake you never call him out, as I wouldn't want you as my client/patient.

My vet discusses other cases with me sometimes, albeit not giving me their name, address and bill!

I CANNOT stand nosey horsey people who loiter and linger around visiting vets to ear wig or make conversation with the vet. I am sure the vets are sick of it too.
 
I'm probably one of those people! In my defence, if I know the person who's getting the vet and the reason, and I'm going to be at the yard at the time, I do ask first if I can watch or listen.
 
jaffa2311 said:
You say you respect the vet.

YOU made the conversation, continued the conversation and clearly thrived in getting all this information. You then go on a public forum and insult the vet's professionalism for discussing something you were happy to talk about earlier!

I hope for the vet's sake you never call him out, as I wouldn't want you as my client/patient.

My vet discusses other cases with me sometimes, albeit not giving me their name, address and bill!

I CANNOT stand nosey horsey people who loiter and linger around visiting vets to ear wig or make conversation with the vet. I am sure the vets are sick of it too.
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In my experience most vets enjoy having a conversation while they are on the yard, as long as it doesn't interfere with the job in hand, they take an interest and will ask how a horse they treated in the past is doing, will speak to other people on the yard to pass the time of day, discuss the weather, they are normal people and enjoy a chat like anyone else, the day they get sick of talking about horses and their ailments is the day they should retire.

The OP did say she asked out of politeness how the horse was expecting a brief response, not the whole detailed reply she got, probably, as I have said above, the vet was enjoying a chat with a client, it was not professional but is probably fairly normal on a livery yard where the same vets deal with most of the horses.
 
Just a thought, I have no opinion on this really but this popped in my mind: a lot of threads have focussed on vet/professional fees recently. I wonder if another side to this post could be: my ver came out for xyz today, and my vet bill is £xxx. I wouldn't necessarily mind but they spent most of the time chatting to a fellow livery and I dont think it's fair to pay such an amount when my xyz wouldn't have only taken x time had they not have chatted. Also I would like them to be totally focussed on my horses treatment and not chatting.
 
I have chatted with my vet when we've bumped into each other after she's visited a patient. I've had my mare in hand and she's been interested in how she's coming on, which is nice. Wouldn't have dreamed of asking about the patient though, not even flippantly. Just not my business, not my place to ask and not hers to tell.
 
My vet would often tell me about interesting cases he had (all species, it was a traditional mixed practice) because he knew I was particularly into veterinary things, but there was no way I could have identified the yard, far less the horse from what he told me. I was pleased to have the opportunity to increase my knowledge. The staff would often tip me off if they had any cases of horses with seizures, but again, with no way of identifying the animal and I would always just leave them with the invite for the owner to contact me if they wanted to (I collect information and statistics on the subject).
 
I think you're all getting a bit silly about this.
If you keep your horse at the same yard then you probably have a pretty good idea of what's wrong anyway. I would have no problem about others on the yard knowing why I had called the vet, or even what he said. When I kept my horses at livery everyone was interested when the vet was called, some would want to share the call out fee, others were just interested, everyone would chat with the vet. If anyone received bad news about their horse all would rally round with support. Just because the vet talks to others at the same location doesn't mean he is blabbing to complete strangers.
When did everyone become quite so precious about such information. No wonder so many complain about livery yards. If all the clients exist as islands, then they are never going to be happy places.
 
I would probably ask the vet about my horse's fieldmate's well being if his owner wasn't there - because I am very fond of him and his well-being matters to me. However, I know his owner would not have an issue if I asked her whether that was OK.

On the other hand, I always make myself scarce during a visit if the owner is there as I think they need to focus on what they are being told and not have a third party butting in with questions. That is the way it has always been at other yards I have been on. However, current yard owner actually likes having someone with her when the vet comes to her horses as she says it is useful if she forgets to ask something or forgets what the vet has said about something specific.
 
cobgoblin said:
I think you're all getting a bit silly about this.
If you keep your horse at the same yard then you probably have a pretty good idea of what's wrong anyway. I would have no problem about others on the yard knowing why I had called the vet, or even what he said. When I kept my horses at livery everyone was interested when the vet was called, some would want to share the call out fee, others were just interested, everyone would chat with the vet. If anyone received bad news about their horse all would rally round with support. Just because the vet talks to others at the same location doesn't mean he is blabbing to complete strangers.
When did everyone become quite so precious about such information. No wonder so many complain about livery yards. If all the clients exist as islands, then they are never going to be happy places.
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IMO there is a world of difference when the owner is present, rather than a random livery hanging around in the hope of getting the gossip on the vets opinion, possibly before the owner does. Both the vet and the OP were in the wrong as far as I am concerned, what sort of livery hangs around the horses stable door while the vet is working on someone elses horse? By all means say good morning, maybe offer a brew, but leave the vet to get on and the vet should know better, unless of course the OP gave the impression that she was there as the owners representative, in the owners abscence.
 
My horse doesn't give two hoots if other people know her ailments. In fact, if she has something interesting I invite yard staff to be around when the vet is there. Occasionally it's something unusual that the yard staff may not have seen before, but having them in the loop also means they know the diagnosis and treatment without the problems caused by frequent retelling, and I have somebody to check with if I've forgotten precisely what the vet said (although that can be a double edged sword as my vet repeats himself often, but slightly differently each time, so it depends which version you were listening to!). My first horse was diagnosed with very bad kissing spine and I was so upset I couldn't talk about it, but the word spread quickly and people from the yard would just come up and give me a hug, which was lovely. I much preferred that than having to tell everybody individually.

Similarly I might enquire about a horse's wellbeing on another yard if I know them reasonably well. I wouldn't expect to be told anything sensitive, but it's nice to hear that an injured horse is on the mend.
 
I called vet in for my loan horse, and got chatting as he is very approachable, and made a comment about the loaners other horse who I know had been really ill. Vet quite rightly said he couldnt discuss it with me, and I felt slightly embarrassed, but he was of course right !
 
I've known my vet for 20 years and would consider myself very rude if I didn't say hello and exchange a few words if he was at the yard treating someone else's horse. Furthermore it's highly likely conversion would include a casual how's the horse in question from me to which I would expect a generic non-committal answer from him. I wouldn't hang about and interfere with his work and I wouldn't expect the owner to have a problem with my having spoken to him briefly.
 
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