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Roasted Chestnuts

Roasted Chestnuts

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Ok out of curiosity how many of you would have a horses tendons scanned at the vetting??

Also how many of you haven't and found issues later on causing heartbreak and frustration??

And once more how many of you would have a youngsters legs scanned at vetting or have a 5stage done on an under 4??

Curiosity is niggling at me here :)
 
I've never scanned tendons and never had any issues but if there had been a previous injury then I probably would for peace of mind.

I've bought all my horses as youngsters though (4/5) and if any of those had issues at that age I would walk away TBH. I 5 stage vet on anything that's ridden. My recent lad had only just turned 4 and he was given a 5 stage.
 
It would depend on the price & what I wanted to do. I've only ever bought cheap younger or unbroken horses, with the exception of one who did cost a bit but I knew the history of very well.
 
Im just curious after readinig stories both on here and other forums of clean vettings then sudden tendon and ligament injuries happening within the first few months of ownership, just struck me as odd. And having had my mare do a tendon only to find out she had probs done it before this (old adhesions found on scans) and it hadnt been picked up.

Would people do it on native or their crosses?? My next one would be either Connie or Welsh D and I know some folk might laugh but Im thinking save a heartbreak and same situation and just spend the cash or is this ludicrous on a native??

Mind you wont be for a few years yet and policies might have changed on horse vettings ;)
 
Well any horse can do a tendon, so no not draft. If I saw a horse and had tendon issues but the price was right and a truely fab horse then I would get them scanned. However I have never had that opt before. Last horse I brought was a untouched 3 yr and only got him 2staged vetted. But he was only £300 as well but is hopefully going to be a forever horse
 
I bought my 2yo and had a 2 stage done on him. I was offered a 5 stage but didn't feel it necessary on such a young horse
 
Given the price of connies & the fact a lot are used as competition ponies makes as much sense as getting any other horse done. (No offence to sec. d owners, just not clued up on them so don't want to comment)
Not had one scanned for purchase but its not that expensive for injury diagnosis, so if you're going to the expense of a good horse that's done a fair bit & the cost of a 5 stage I suppose it could make sense.
 
A 5-stage vetting isn't really feasible on anything unbacked. With expensive youngstock, further investigations are often sought (TB babies presented at the sales will often have x-rays/respiratory scope results available) and if I was going to buy an expensive unbacked (prob WB) youngster for myself, I'd opt for x-rays in addition to a 2-stage vetting (but wouldn't bother with scans).

If purchasing an expensive backed youngster, in addition to it passing a 5-stage vetting I'd get x-rays and scans done of all 4 distal limbs.
 
Not sure about getting scans but, I have often thought that I would like to see the clinical history of the horse I was buying before purchase.
 
Depends, if anything showed up on a vetting one a horse I was keen for then xray and scan that area. It's not always black and white though, as friend is looking at the moment for top eventer and found one, passed vet but failed on flexion after exercise. Had it xrayed and scanned and found nothing, but her owner still backed out sadly. Vet could not give a firm answer, although personally I think it was likely knock or slight weakness in a young horse that showed up after work and in all fairness would prob improve with more work. I also think a lot of tendon injuries are the fault of bad / inconsiderate riding. I have never had a horse do a tendon and think its prob because I am always considering ground conditions, don't pound my horses when unfit and also know when to stop. My horses are only booted up when needed and hunt, jump, hack etc. Sadly a lot of people don't have consideration for their mount! Conditioning work on different surfaces will always help minimise risks, ie. roads, deeper going, grass etc. And if this is done slowly enough then the legs should be strong enough to withstand hard work.
 
Natalia I can understand some of your post but TBF just because YOU have never had a horse blow a tendon doesn't mean that everyone else is doing sommat wrong to their horses, rather judgemental and shortsighted view in all honesty.
 
Actually I agree with Natalia, that's the methods I have always been taught to condition a horse though I know many people who don't bother with the old fashioned way of getting a horse fit. Many people start with lunging and schooling on a surface rather than the walking on the roads now, horses go hunting that are only ridden once a week.

Back to the subject, I wouldn't bother with scans myself but my horse has had a suspensory injury which several vets have looked at and couldn't find anything. I have had him scanned and he has passed fit to do any job including event but still needs to be brought into work slowly.

It would be possible to have sold this horse without declaring his previous injury as he is sound and the vets couldn't find anything amiss with his legs.
 
BlacknWhite said:
A 5-stage vetting isn't really feasible on anything unbacked.
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Of course it is! We HAVE to get 2 year old fillies 5 stage vetted for grading - only ever had one with a hiccup and she showed a slightly odd heart murmur after exercise (on lunge.) Had to have the heart u/s scanned to make sure there was nothing sinister going on - but she was fine. Obviously they have to be well handled so flexions can be done without vet getting head kicked in!
 
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Where I have bought led /childrens ponies, I have not had a vet check done.

When the kids got older I had vet checks done on their pony club ponies (price range still not high $3000-4000AUD), but this has been for peace of mind.

I have never bought a really expensive horse and if I did I certainly would look at scans/x rays. There is a lot of investment in a horse beyond the initial purchase price, so while these things have a cost, they also have a benefit. I think if I was buying a horse over $10 000 (unlikely), I would be looking at this extra investment.

The last two horses we bought had no vet check at all, one because it was given to us in exchange for a debt, and I knew the horse, had spoken to the farrier that attended the horse and was reasonably confident it was sound. The other because it was not expensive, and again we knew the people we were acquiring it from, and its history.


A vet check and any other tests really are only good for the day they are done on, for example you could have a horse vet checked, and arrange to pick it up in a weeks time. The owner could give it a bit of a bashing in that week (ride it excessively- say the day you are due to pick it up), and the horse could go lame (say the next morning, after you have collected it). This happened to me in fact - and while the horse came sound, it was not without some anxiety and expense.

Most owners/sellers are not this irresponsible, however, it would be the same situation if an accidental injury/overwork occurred prior to collection that did not give rise to an immediate obvious lameness.
 
I can see the point of not wanting its legs clipped but in all honesty its only hair at the end of the day and grows back :)

Pinklilly I'm sure those who have had horses (like) me who have blown tendons would contest that we haven't done the work required.

How many times have we seen top eventers pulling up horses on tracks as summat has went wrong??

Its quite offensive really to say to somone who's horse has blown a tendon 'you caused that you know' when horses can do tendon and ligament injuries in the field without being ridden.

I want opinions on vettings not judgements on why horses blow tendons, why not make another thread on that subject :)
 
Black Beastie said:
I can see the point of not wanting its legs clipped but in all honesty its only hair at the end of the day and grows back :)
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So, someone has a county level native pony for sale - going well at the shows in the ribbons etc. They put it up for sale, you come along and request scans, legs clipped. Now if you go ahead with the purchase you cannot show it for the rest of the season, and more importantly, nor can the owner if you back out of the purchase. Now the owner is stuck with an unsellable top class county native???? NO WAY would I allow my D to be scanned, 5 stage, x-rays, I have no problem with, but scans? NO.
TBF you can spend alot of money scanning and vetting a horse yet it could break it's leg in the field the next day, that's horses for you.
 
JanetGeorge said:
Of course it is! We HAVE to get 2 year old fillies 5 stage vetted for grading - only ever had one with a hiccup and she showed a slightly odd heart murmur after exercise (on lunge.) Had to have the heart u/s scanned to make sure there was nothing sinister going on - but she was fine. Obviously they have to be well handled so flexions can be done without vet getting head kicked in!
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That's fine if your 2yr olds can lunge and you are happy to work them hard to exacerbate any underlying conditions. However, the vast majority of 1/2yr olds I have come across cannot lunge and if I were selling a baby, I'm not sure I'd be happy for it to be doing excessive fast work for vetting purposes.
 
I find the whole tendon thing very interesting. When I was a child, horses/ponies I knew got lami, colic and broken legs. That was it pretty much. We did all sorts of silly things as children but warming up properly, cooling off, and watching out for the going when out and about, were drummed into us again and again. I hadn't ever seen a boot of any kind until I was about 18, everything lived out, and whilst many hair-raising childhood adventures were had (who needs Alton Towers if you have ponies!!), no-one got hurt. Now tendons are well-known to go, lami and colic are more common. I often wonder why tbh.

So vettings? I haven't ever scanned for tendon issues, but I've only bought unbacked or just backed babies.
 
I bought my 13 year old mare (ex-eventer) this time last year, I only had a basic 3 stage vetting and she passed, fast forward one year and I may have to have her put to sleep :(:(:(

On/of lameness since I bought her, took her to vets and found out she has:
- problems with soft tissue surrounding her pedal bone
- problems with the pedal bone
- ligament and tendon damage
- severe changes to her navicular bone
- issues with her deep digital flexar

And this is in BOTH feet.

None of this would of showed up on a 5 stage vettting, or xrays actually. Only picked up via ultrasound, she has to go for an MRI on tuesday.
 
To the poster who talked about a county level showing horse, I'm talking youngsters here possibly unbacked, and or buying out of season anyways :)

And I'm sure if it was myself requesting the scanning then I'm sure I could survive for 6months whilst the feathers grew back :)
 
Black Beastie said:
To the poster who talked about a county level showing horse, I'm talking youngsters here possibly unbacked, and or buying out of season anyways :)

And I'm sure if it was myself requesting the scanning then I'm sure I could survive for 6months whilst the feathers grew back :)
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But you are missing the point. Why should the seller be stuck with an unsellable horse for weeks on end while it's hair grows back if you don't want it?

Youngsters and unbacked? I wouldn't waste my money on scans. I would have x-rays on a valuable horse, but anything else, quite frankly I wouldn't bother.
 
No I think your missing my point, its only HAIR and if someone doesnt want to buy a horse because its got some hair clipped off then they werent serious int eh first place, its cosmetic and if they cant see past that to its good looks and confo then maybe they need to go back to the books.

Ive seen some horses is horrendous states, bought, fittened and fed and really come into the potential they showed DESPITE looking like hatracks and little/no musculture, you could see past the horror that was in front of you.

I think someone was hiding summat if they werent willing to have xrays etc done in all honesty and might be a question I would ask just to weed the wheat from the chaff so to speak ;)
 
I'm fairness tho black beastie, showing is based largely on appearance & is strict on how horses are shown. Showings never been my thing, but I can appreciate that clipping the legs of a show standard sec d, obviously prevents it in the short term from doing what it was produced to do. If I was to view a sec d with clipped feathers it wouldn't bother me cos I don't show. But I imagine the majority of those viewing a show standard sec d would want to show.
 
littlelegs said:
I'm fairness tho black beastie, showing is based largely on appearance & is strict on how horses are shown. Showings never been my thing, but I can appreciate that clipping the legs of a show standard sec d, obviously prevents it in the short term from doing what it was produced to do. If I was to view a sec d with clipped feathers it wouldn't bother me cos I don't show. But I imagine the majority of those viewing a show standard sec d would want to show.
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See I can appreciate it as I show BUT buying someone elses knackered horse only to find that I CANT Show it due to issues would RELLY put a dampner on my showing debute with it ;) :D

Im only asking IF people would do it, scan tendons as having had a horse with issues (that probably came with them TBH) im now wary of it happening again and going through the same experiences that I just have done :(
 
Natalia, you can condition bone, hoof, muscle, but not tendons after 2 years of age. This is the current scientific understanding.
 
Owned six horses now and had everyone vetted to five stage with bloods. But never had their tendons scanned as I've never felt the point.
 
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