Vettins - flexion test/trotting on lunge in small circle on tarmac

A

Ahrena

Well-Known Member
Joined
28 June 2007
Messages
1,884
Visit site
Just looking for a bit of info.
I had my dream horse vetted this morning. I've had him on loan since May and to me he is worth his weight in gold, I adore him, he's already made 3 of my dreams come true and has so so much more to give.

I'm currently eventing him PN and he has tonnes more scope, pops 1.40 at home, pn is feeling very easy and simple now so was planning on jumping NC over the winter then novice next season, and so on and so forth. He's the sweetest natured horse as well, my first competition type horse and whenever I mess up he figures it out for me, doesn't mind at all. He's good in every way, safe hack, very laid back, never stops, just tries his heart out.

His owner wants to sell him as bought a new horse so doesn't want him back.

But he failed. He showed lameness in 1 of his hocks after a flexion test (he has a thoroughpin and was going to have it x-rayed as part of vetting but vet wouldn't after this) and then on the lunge on tarmac in a tight circle he wasn't right, was shuffling along with no overtrack whatsoever (lacking about 30cm), and vet said he could see lameness in the same hind and also a foreleg. He said the hock was probably bone changes starting to form (he's 13).

So not sure what to so. Don't want to buy as I can't afford to get stuck with a third horse I can't do anything with (got 1 retired with severe navicular and 1 who doesn't have the temperment to do much more than hack and a bit of schooling, she's a rescue) but owner is blaming us as he passed the vet when she bought him 2 years ago..I want to get it further investigated but my mum is reluctant to pay if owner won't let us keep him on loan.

I'm beyond devastated, I ADORE this horse, his personality, temperment, talent..since may he's taken me from showing and 2 foot 6 sj to winning at BE and BSJA, because of him I gave up the idea of uni and am pursuing a working pupil placement at a yard..he also only has 1 eye so much cheaper than a normal horse like him which at the moment I can't afford..

I'm heart-broken. Quite feel like if I can't keep him I may as well give up as I need a horse I can learn on and I just can't afford a horse like him, plus I just love him to bits. He's my angel
 
Hi Ahrena ( long time no see !)

i am so sad to see this post - ive been watching your vids on youtube and you seem to be doing so well!

Its a difficult one - if the owners are so convinced the horse will pass, get *them* to pay for a vetting after a couple of weeks - at least if the horse has sprained something it gives him time to recover - plus i am surprised if he is that lame that you didnt feel something, especially in a foreleg.

The investigations would only tell you what is there clinically - not wether or not it was affecting the horses performance. Ive known of horses with terrible radiographs/OCD go on and compete to high levels.

You could also ask the owners to have him on loan for another X months to see if he stays sound.

He does sound like a one in a million horse - i hope he works out for you. Sorry to hear about Willow and Lacey - did that guy not sort her issues out in the end?
 
The vet wasn't as concerned about the front leg, as he went to an event on sunday plus there wasn't a problem in the flexion test..but he wasn't happy at all about the hock. The owner seems pretty insistant on selling, havn't properly got hold of her but she left a voicemail saying perhaps it was our fault as he passed when she bought him, plus the horse she had bought has just been lame for 2 weeks so couldn't we just buy him anyway?

Ideally I'd like to keep him on loan and investigate, if it turned out to be managable or fixable then perhaps we would still buy him at a reduced price but..god the idea of losing him is too hard.

Lacey is fine, well just back to Lacey now, but she's never going to be an eventer, she hacks, schools and is about to do her first SJ in 2 years at a yard show, but shes not gonna do what I want to do

just can't believe he failed, he's so lovely, the best thing thats happened to me besides my fiance
 
I totally know how you feel.

Hocks are generally 2 things from what i know, spavins and suspensories - If spavins it is arthritis, it can be managed with things like Tildren and injections into the joint, but will never be cured and is degenerative - you can slow/manage the degeneration though.

If suspensories - it can be rested and come back sound or iirc they can de-nerve it but im not sure to what level it can compete.

And no, you cant just 'buy it anyway'! Unless it was at a drastically reduced price given it may have soundness issues.

Good to hear about lacey - so will we be seeing you at the next c&t champs?

Hope willow is enjoying her retirement!
 
Hi there, so sorry to hear about that, whilst looking for a new horse I was the victim of four failed vettings on horses who were supposed to be perfect, so I know how you feel.

Flexion tests are awful but a good judge of knowing about something that has happened in the past - my thoroughbred who went sound in the flexion test would now DEFINITELY not pass due to tearing his front right suspensory ligament with me.

My other, new, horse flew through the flexion test... Many horses don't pass that part but vettings are incredibly tricky. Unless they drive the price down significantly I'd be hesitant about buying this horse. I know it is a tricky decision and I know exactly how you must feel but you've got to think about whether you want a horse who might have leg problems down the road.
 
Personally, and I know its a risk, I would tell the owner that you are happy to keep him until he sells, but you wont be buying. The see how easy she finds it to sell a lame, one eyed 13yo horse. I bet you will have him for as long as you want!

I dont mean to be harsh by saying the last part, but buyers dont have the emotional attachment that you do. They will look at the hard facts. He sounds like a great horse, but don`t feel pressured.
 
Oh not sure if it came out wrong, the 'can't you buy him anyway' was owners suggestion, not mine. Not gonna do that, i've had the heartbreak of 1 horse with arthritis already - she had her hocks fused and after some very severe complications she can back fine, went out hunting jumping 6 foot hedges and county showing...until 4 years later she went lame with navicular.

Just so upset and disheartened. I adore him and he's made so many dreams come true...i've been in floods of tears since the vetting.

Why do I love my horses so much? They're my children and that's a very dangerous mindset now they're my job :(
 
I will go against the grain here. I think you should speak to the owner and say you want to get it investigated, at the moment she can't sell him as he wont pass a vetting but you are happy to loan whilst investigating. My youngster passed his 5 stage with flying colours, the vet was so impressed as he had never seen a horse so sound on flexions and on the lunge on hard ground. 5 weeks later he was lame and once investigated had a huge amount of damage to his stifles and OCD and holes in his collateral ligament damage to his front feet. He was not drugged for the vetting he was sound, so vetting isn't always the be all and end all.

On another note, my friend has 2 eventers, one that won the qualifiers in Athens for the Olympics but then blew his tendons and another competed to Novice level so both pretty good. Neither of them whilst running were 100% sound, they aren't sound now but still run well. If he ticks all the boxes then I would get the lameness investigated so you know what you are dealing with.
 
Out off interest why did they decide not to Xray the hock in the end? Has he been sound with you all the time since May? In a way I can see what the owner means, I'm not saying that you made him lame btw, but you've had him for 5 months, so quite a hood trail and there may off been changes happening to his hock during that time? I would think that a fair amount off horses who are older and done a fair bit off competing wouldn't nessecarily be sound on flexion tests. If it was me, if the horse had stayed sound during the time I'd had him, I'd have his hock xrayed and investigate the hind leg lameness, depending on results I would reduce the price (unless the say no chance that he'll keep competing) and buy him. I personally just think that vettings are designed to find something wrong, which is a good and bad thing, and would say that you should know the horse fairly well and have had a food trail on him now.
 
If he is really the horse of a lifetime, give him another chance, I have bought and sold horses that have "failed" flexion tests and they are only a guide to possible future problems. As a 13 year old that did an event on Sunday he could still be stiff and sore on Tuesday it is not really fair to vet so soon after imo. and to then fail him out of hand.

I would give him a few days off. maybe a little bute to help the legs settle down and then do a few days work, see how he is and arrange another vetting, start with the flexions and circles if he fails at that point then stop and walk away.
We bought a 13 year old event schoolmaster in January, the vet did not do front flexions as he felt that at his age he would show some degree of unsoundness and that he was still fit for purpose, he passed on the hinds.
A girl in the yard bought, again a 13 yr old that failed on its hinds two years later when sold it passed with no problems, in fact it moved off very well.
A pony I have recently sold failed its first vetting, I did what I have suggested you do and it passed next time no problem.

Sorry for the rather long ramble but I do feel that the flexions are so difficult to use as a vet can interpret them so differently, see the article in H&H a few weeks ago for more info.
It really is worth trying again, let us know what the outcome is, the price will have some bearing on any decision obviously.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top