Watched a newly broken horse been given a bloody mouth yesterday

[Mule]

Hi, someone I know had the person who broke her horse (highly bred showjumping lines) a few months ago ride the horse yesterday. I was around to see it because a friend planned to use him to break her horse. This person is a showjumper who apparently has a good name for breaking and competes at high level afaik.

He was so rough with the horse my jaw nearly dropped. He was pulling backwards jerkily and using really strong leg to go forward at the same time. Afterwards he said the horse was fussy in the mouth and mentioned the mouth was bleeding.

I'm wondering why would someone ride like that ?? Was he trying to achieve something or do some people think that's a normal way of riding. How did he become successful riding that way. I've noticed some showjumpers using excessive hand while half halting (even ones on tv) but this was something else. The owner thinks he's marvelous (she's worked at high level sj yards in Germany so that sort of riding must be done there too)

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

I assume the 2nd person has decided not to give him her money to ruin her horse?

 

[Mule]

I assume the 2nd person has decided not to give him her money to ruin her horse?

You would assume right! It was lucky one of us were around to see it. I felt so bad for the poor horse. What an introduction to riding she's had

 

[Reacher]

Hi, someone I know had the person who broke her horse (highly bred showjumping lines) a few months ago ride the horse yesterday. I was around to see it because a friend planned to use him to break her horse. This person is a showjumper who apparently has a good name for breaking and competes at high level afaik.

He was so rough with the horse my jaw nearly dropped. He was pulling backwards jerkily and using really strong leg to go forward at the same time. Afterwards he said the horse was fussy in the mouth and mentioned the mouth was bleeding.

I'm wondering why would someone ride like that ?? Was he trying to achieve something or do some people think that's a normal way of riding. How did he become successful riding that way. I've noticed some showjumpers using excessive hand while half halting (even ones on tv) but this was something else. The owner thinks he's marvelous (she's worked at high level sj yards in Germany so that sort of riding must be done there too)

Ker-rist ?

 

[Bernster]

Not that extreme but yes I’ve def seen people whose idea of getting a horse working in a outline is to use very strong leg to go forwards and strong hand to pull backwards, and horse gets squished up into a horrible false outline. They seem to do quite well at higher dressage levels ?‍

 

[pistolpete]

Not that extreme but yes I’ve def seen people whose idea of getting a horse working in a outline is to use very strong leg to go forwards and strong hand to pull backwards, and horse gets squished up into a horrible false outline. They seem to do quite well at higher dressage levels ?‍

Off topic but the dressage habit of low hands acting like side reins came to mind. Horrid!

 

[clinkerbuilt]

Speaking as someone who has come back to riding after a long break, the normalisation of this kind of training has been really disorienting. Been on a dressage break where I was told this is how a certain breed of horse needed to be ridden. But watched the trainer of our trainers riding his (different breed) youngster with its chin folded into its shoulder. As a pupil, hard to challenge.

 

[Birker2020]

I saw someone try and drag a young horse over some poles in a grid work loose jumping clinic once when it didn't understand what was being asked of it whilst its owner happily smacked the horse over the backside from a distance with a lunge whip. It was obvious it hadn't done pole work before, and that and the strangers watching and the indoor school with which is wasn't familiar made it uncertain and scared. The poles were dark in colour and when laid on the floor of the school were difficult to make out as they were the same colour.

The horse kept sinking down onto the surface, presumably it was in shock. The woman giving the demo who obviously didn't want to lose face said 'it's being naughty and lying down to get out of work' although to me it was clearly in tremendous distress and shock.

In the end when neither person could 'force' the horse to do what they wanted it ended up being put outside the indoor school dripping in sweat and shoved onto the lorry until the end of the evening although it was only about 4c that evening. How I cried for that poor horse.

I thought at the time what a dreadful start to that young horses career.

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

OMG - I would have hauled his sorry arse off that horse and kicked him all the way down the road! Did she not object to his hand and leg action immediately, or did it not bother her? If the latter that would be one less friend on my Christmas card list and I would have told them exactly why too!

 

[windand rain]

Once watched in horror as a top dressage trainer hauled and beat my friends little horse until it was covered in white foam from head to tail He then was put in charge of a junior team for the Europeans so pulled my pony from the team due to his violence so no it doesn't surprise me

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

The arrogance of some of these so called professional riders that ride like this in front of owners and any other bystanders, and don't give a toss. Do they really think they have got it right riding like this?

 

[PurBee]

Its disheartening to read professionals handle horses so barbarically ?

It’s a hard call, but the only way the equestrian industry as a whole can make a change to treating horses like this is if any and all individuals who witness it, make their views known and then refuse to use such trainers or be taught/ride with the person.
It probable will cause fall-outs etc, but i cant see how the industry will ever progress and teach the younger generations good horsemanship, if blind eyes are turned.

Forcing compliance from an animal via physical pain is no longer a respected training method, and certain degrees of it are outright illegal.

 

[Mule]

I saw someone try and drag a young horse over some poles in a grid work loose jumping clinic once when it didn't understand what was being asked of it whilst its owner happily smacked the horse over the backside from a distance with a lunge whip. It was obvious it hadn't done pole work before, and that and the strangers watching and the indoor school with which is wasn't familiar made it uncertain and scared. The poles were dark in colour and when laid on the floor of the school were difficult to make out as they were the same colour.

The horse kept sinking down onto the surface, presumably it was in shock. The woman giving the demo who obviously didn't want to lose face said 'it's being naughty and lying down to get out of work' although to me it was clearly in tremendous distress and shock.

In the end when neither person could 'force' the horse to do what they wanted it ended up being put outside the indoor school dripping in sweat and shoved onto the lorry until the end of the evening although it was only about 4c that evening. How I cried for that poor horse.

I thought at the time what a dreadful start to that young horses career.

 

[Mule]

OMG - I would have hauled his sorry arse off that horse and kicked him all the way down the road! Did she not object to his hand and leg action immediately, or did it not bother her? If the latter that would be one less friend on my Christmas card list and I would have told them exactly why too!

I got the impression she thought it was normal.

 

[j1ffy]

I got the impression she thought it was normal.

? Poor, poor horse. It doesn't sound like producing a 'happy athlete' is top of their priority list

 

[ycbm]

I took a horse to somebody who had been recommended to me to back a very sharp horse and I saw several of the horses in for breaking had sore corners to their mouths. He saw me looking and said something to the effect "you need that to happen to show them who's in charge". I made it clear that wasn't what I wanted for mine, that all I needed was for him to be sat on and he was to leave his mouth alone. I picked him up after 4 days.
.

 

[humblepie]

I have mentioned in on other threads but was at a clinic once and the professional dressage rider (well known) was working own horse and there was socking in the mouth whilst kicking - and as you say that was in front of a group of clients.

 

[Cragrat]

These are such sad stories.

There was a thread a while back about leaving riding lessons if you are have been unhappy with them.

It far too easy to be so in awe/polite/ scared / respectful/ whatever that in the moment, at the time, we don't speak out. it is only later we realise that actually, we should have said or done something. Though even worse, some people remain so awe-struck of the 'professional' that they don't ever realise it was wrong

 

[eahotson]

Not that extreme but yes I’ve def seen people whose idea of getting a horse working in a outline is to use very strong leg to go forwards and strong hand to pull backwards, and horse gets squished up into a horrible false outline. They seem to do quite well at higher dressage levels ?‍

Sadly that is correct.

 

[eahotson]

I have mentioned in on other threads but was at a clinic once and the professional dressage rider (well known) was working own horse and there was socking in the mouth whilst kicking - and as you say that was in front of a group of clients.

Sadly I am not suprised.

 

[eahotson]

Oh my G*d.

 

[snowangel5]

I saw someone try and drag a young horse over some poles in a grid work loose jumping clinic once when it didn't understand what was being asked of it whilst its owner happily smacked the horse over the backside from a distance with a lunge whip. It was obvious it hadn't done pole work before, and that and the strangers watching and the indoor school with which is wasn't familiar made it uncertain and scared. The poles were dark in colour and when laid on the floor of the school were difficult to make out as they were the same colour.

The horse kept sinking down onto the surface, presumably it was in shock. The woman giving the demo who obviously didn't want to lose face said 'it's being naughty and lying down to get out of work' although to me it was clearly in tremendous distress and shock.

In the end when neither person could 'force' the horse to do what they wanted it ended up being put outside the indoor school dripping in sweat and shoved onto the lorry until the end of the evening although it was only about 4c that evening. How I cried for that poor horse.

I thought at the time what a dreadful start to that young horses career.

? I completely agree

 

[PoppyAnderson]

Not that extreme but yes I’ve def seen people whose idea of getting a horse working in a outline is to use very strong leg to go forwards and strong hand to pull backwards, and horse gets squished up into a horrible false outline. They seem to do quite well at higher dressage levels ?‍

DL by any chance.

 

[Lyle]

Oh my I start mine in a rope bosal- so bitless. They learn how to be nice riding horses and to enjoy being ridden first, before any discipline specific schooling. They hjve their whole careers ahead of them.

 

[Spotherisk]

A former hho’er who I knew personally told me to give my being backed young horse ‘a few good socks in the gob so he learns to stop when told’, ur no thanks, he was taught to halt politely by the excellent young professional I chose for him.

 

[Sandstone1]

No doubt some on here think thats the way things should be done. Very sad.

 

[View]

It's so wrong. These magnificent animals should be our partners and wanting to please us.

Many years ago, I could always tell when horses came in started by one so called professional. We would spend months showing them patience, kindness and respect to rebuild their trust.

 

[Mule]

A former hho’er who I knew personally told me to give my being backed young horse ‘a few good socks in the gob so he learns to stop when told’, ur no thanks, he was taught to halt politely by the excellent young professional I chose for him.

?

 

[tristar]

A former hho’er who I knew personally told me to give my being backed young horse ‘a few good socks in the gob so he learns to stop when told’, ur no thanks, he was taught to halt politely by the excellent young professional I chose for him.

yes, so much nicer to ride ones newly backed horse into a gentle hold by using legs and seat so they learn to halt in balance,

but who am i to argue with genius`s of the horse world

 

[windand rain]

The kid riding one of my very forward ponies was told to "pull it's back teeth out" when it got strong in a lesson so don't think its gone yet.