Weight loss, feeding help !

[Friesianfoal1999]

So i thought I had my TB mare cracked as last winter we had our first winter with NO WEIGHTLOSS. A miracle for us. She was diagnosed with Kissing spine and many many issues so we are sure this had something to do with it.
But last winter was a lot warmer than this winter.

Last winter she was fed once a day typically:
> Turnout 24/7
> Hay once a day (around half a bale ish, we simply gave her enough to last her till we came the next day so it depended on how much she ate so id say ad-lib)
> Hard feed 1 and a half schoops of happy hoof, 1 scoop of Spiller High Fibre cubes, Glug of oil and Allen and page fast fibre in the coldest months. She alternated between having sugarbeet and fast fibre depending how cold it was.

This winter:
> Pretty much 24/7 turnout, but comes in for a few hours 4 days a week to rest her legs from the mud. On these days she gets an extra feed so two feeds in total. Plus Ad-lib haylage in the stable.
> Hard feed 1 and a half scopps happy hoof, 1 scoop spullers high fibre cubes, glug of oil and sugar beet 1 large scoop.
> Haylage in the stable and haylage in the field nearly constantly.
> 8 Acres to herself in the field and there is still grass there.

Yet she has managed to lose weight, do I put her back on the fast fibre? i found she went a bit nutty on it.

Any advice at all is appreciated. any additions to the feed. I cant feed her any more times than I do at the moment but can add to the feed. Pink mash? I am at a loss

 

[Kat]

I found Coolstance Copra was the final piece of the jigsaw to keeping weight on my poor diet. I feedit with micronised linseed and Alfa A Molasses Free

 

[AmyMay]

If you’re only seeing her once a day does she actually have hay left when you next visit?
Is she warm enough?
Does she have shelter in the field?
If you’re ‘resting’ her from the mud, how bad is the field really.
Is there a reason she can’t be stabled overnight?

 

[laura_nash]

I'd expect adlib haylage to keep the weight on any happy, healthy horse that's appropriately rugged and not in intense work. You say she has 8 acres to herself, is she out alone and if so was this the case last winter? A stressed horse (and most will be stressed alone even if they don't show it) will be more likely to lose weight.

 

[doodle]

All those feeds are low calorie. She needs more. Bring her in at night, make sure she is warm enough. Hay/haylage 24/7 so she always has some left. Use big holed nets. Give 2 (or 3) feeds a day of a higher calorie feed. I have had huge success with Allen and page sooth and gain. Also found linseed on its own successful (it is in the sooth and gain)

 

[Leandy]

You need to feed more often. At least twice possibly three times a day for a TB out 24/7 in the middle of winter which has a tendency to lose weight. There is a limit to the amount you can put in one feed so you need to feed more often. Horses need to eat little and often.

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

If you’re only seeing her once a day does she actually have hay left when you next visit?
Is she warm enough?
Does she have shelter in the field?
If you’re ‘resting’ her from the mud, how bad is the field really.
Is there a reason she can’t be stabled overnight?

Yes she is warm enough 100% sure of that, she has the really expensive premier equine 450g rug. Yes she has a double stable shelter in the field and a whole row of natural trees, Mud isn't too bad its more wet and it rests the ground and her, her hooves defo appreciate the rest. And she could if I wanted to but id rather not as she doesn't like it, she has been a 24/7 turnout horse for 4 years now and does fine normally, its just for say one month in the winter we lose a bit of weight and then I manage to get it back on. She is seen twice a day 4/5 days a week its only 2or 3 its once, but yes she has hay left but not loads as we know how much she eats pretty much x

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

I'd expect adlib haylage to keep the weight on any happy, healthy horse that's appropriately rugged and not in intense work. You say she has 8 acres to herself, is she out alone and if so was this the case last winter? A stressed horse (and most will be stressed alone even if they don't show it) will be more likely to lose weight.

Its probably me being a bit dramatic, vet came yesterday and said she looks fine. But i know its a little skinny for her but i cant see her ribs unless moving, ill try upload a pic. She has neighbours surrounding her, and she has been on her own for 4 years now.

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

All those feeds are low calorie. She needs more. Bring her in at night, make sure she is warm enough. Hay/haylage 24/7 so she always has some left. Use big holed nets. Give 2 (or 3) feeds a day of a higher calorie feed. I have had huge success with Allen and page sooth and gain. Also found linseed on its own successful (it is in the sooth and gain)

Thank you for your advice, I have owned horses for 12 years now so have some degree of knowledge. I wont be bringing her in at night, she has been a 24/7 turnout horse for 4 years now and it has worked for her. She cannot be stabled for long periods of time due to kissing spine but even so i wouldnt do it, natural is better for them. She is warm enough and has adlib hay/haylage. When you say she needs more if you could let me know what, she has to be on low calorie as she gets far too crazy with calories.

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

You need to feed more often. At least twice possibly three times a day for a TB out 24/7 in the middle of winter which has a tendency to lose weight. There is a limit to the amount you can put in one feed so you need to feed more often. Horses need to eat little and often.

We survived feeding once a day and ad-lib hay/haylage for two years now. Plus she gets 2 feeds a day for 4/5 days of the week. She also has constant grass and good quality grass. So if you have any advice id appreciate that, i cannot get down to feed her anymore for personal reasons that i wont discuss on a forum.

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

I found Coolstance Copra was the final piece of the jigsaw to keeping weight on my poor diet. I feedit with micronised linseed and Alfa A Molasses Free

I have never heard of this, thank you so much for the recommendation! I have heard about micronised linseed, how did you find it?

 

[VioletStripe]

Could it be worth adding a gut balancer, so she can better digest and use the calories she's taking in?

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

Could it be worth adding a gut balancer, so she can better digest and use the calories she's taking in?

Thats. a really good point, she used to be on a gut balancer because I thought she had ulcers, she did not as I got her scoped in the end and had a perfect gut so stopped. I will discuss this with the vet . thank you

 

[VioletStripe]

Thats. a really good point, she used to be on a gut balancer because I thought she had ulcers, she did not as I got her scoped in the end and had a perfect gut so stopped. I will discuss this with the vet . thank you

I use pink powder but that's also my general vits and mins. I know a lot of people have had great success with the Protexin gut biotics

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

I use pink powder but that's also my general vits and mins. I know a lot of people have had great success with the Protexin gut biotics

I used protexin gut, I think shes missing some general vitamins and minerals

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

natural is better for them. She is warm enough and has adlib hay/haylage. .

I agree natural is best. It is unnatural for a horse to live on its own, they are herd animals and could well stress weight off when feeling vulnerable. Linseed is good for putting weight onto a horse and a mugful is usually enough. Ask your feed merchant or buy it online


ETA, PinkPowder made our 2 riding horses footy and spooky I wouldn't give it your horse.

 

[ihatework]

Sorry if I’m teaching you to suck eggs but here goes ...

Horses primarily need fibre right? The majority/all of that by the sounds of it can be met by the ad-lib haylage and grass she is getting.

So to improve weight you need to increase calorie input. Shovelling down more bucket fibre isn’t really going to do that, especially when those fibres are mostly low calorie laminitic type fibres - they just take up stomach space that could be better utilised.

I understand when you say horse goes crazy on calories. But there are different ways to get calories in - oil based rather than starch based in general. Sometimes it’s a bit trial and error. In general I’d go for a commercial compound feed aimed at horses with gastric ulcers, they usually are best option for feed reactive horses.

You can also use a top dressing of something like omega rice.

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

I agree natural is best. It is unnatural for a horse to live on its own, they are herd animals and could well stress weight off when feeling vulnerable. Linseed is good for putting weight onto a horse and a mugful is usually enough. Ask your feed merchant or buy it online

I hate when people just suggest stabling, I prefer natural for horses. And completely agree about the herd environment, I'm a big advocate of it, we are buying a second horse just so she has company. Shes my world so gets everything, also have a livery coming into her field with her, but the horses next door and her always hang out together and almost act like a herd just over the fence!

 

[VioletStripe]

I used protexin gut, I think shes missing some general vitamins and minerals

Maybe try some pink powder then - it's definitely made a difference for my boy. If she's on Haylage primarily though, they also do a haylage balancer.

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

Sorry if I’m teaching you to suck eggs but here goes ...

Horses primarily need fibre right? The majority/all of that by the sounds of it can be met by the ad-lib haylage and grass she is getting.

So to improve weight you need to increase calorie input. Shovelling down more bucket fibre isn’t really going to do that, especially when those fibres are mostly low calorie laminitic type fibres - they just take up stomach space that could be better utilised.

I understand when you say horse goes crazy on calories. But there are different ways to get calories in - oil based rather than starch based in general. Sometimes it’s a bit trial and error. In general I’d go for a commercial compound feed aimed at horses with gastric ulcers, they usually are best option for feed reactive horses.

You can also use a top dressing of something like omega rice.

Appreciate your advice, I do know most of what you've said. She has been on feed aimed at horses for gastric ulcers for a long time, I have most my horses on that due to trying to prevent ulcers as much as I can (I hate them). But found she was better with happy hoof. When speaking to the spillers representative they said they use these nuts for ulcer horses which is why she is on them. Any oil based recommendations?

 

[VioletStripe]

Its probably me being a bit dramatic, vet came yesterday and said she looks fine. But i know its a little skinny for her but i cant see her ribs unless moving, ill try upload a pic. She has neighbours surrounding her, and she has been on her own for 4 years now.

If the vet said she's fine, and you can only see her ribs when she's moving then could she be fine with the current routine? Spring is just around the corner, I personally like them a little leaner going into spring.

Could you give some grass pellets too? I know a lot of people have had success with grass pellets for non-heating, natural weight gain. You could put them in a trug for her to pick at in the shelter, or in a treatball?

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

Maybe try some pink powder then - it's definitely made a difference for my boy. If she's on Haylage primarily though, they also do a haylage balancer.

Thank you, I will look into it.

 

[VioletStripe]

Appreciate your advice, I do know most of what you've said. She has been on feed aimed at horses for gastric ulcers for a long time, I have most my horses on that due to trying to prevent ulcers as much as I can (I hate them). But found she was better with happy hoof. When speaking to the spillers representative they said they use these nuts for ulcer horses which is why she is on them. Any oil based recommendations?

Not trying to be obtuse but personally with an ulcer-y horse, I would never feed most commercial high-fibre cubes as they're full of molasses and fillers which are not ulcer-friendly. I much prefer hay cobs or grass nuts or alfalfa pellets (a lot of horses are sensitive to alfalfa though, and you mentioned she can be sensitive/loopy!)

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

If the vet said she's fine, and you can only see her ribs when she's moving then could she be fine with the current routine? Spring is just around the corner, I personally like them a little leaner going into spring.

Could you give some grass pellets too? I know a lot of people have had success with grass pellets for non-heating, natural weight gain. You could put them in a trug for her to pick at in the shelter, or in a treatball?

Normally I would say yes she should be fine, but it often happens and then we change something, up the feed or use the mash etc and she puts the weight back on so back to normal within a few weeks. Im just looking for a way to maybe prevent this by having a more suitable feed in general. She does bloom in spring very much so, you have a good point!

Grass pellets sound good, she has a treatball so this could defo work!

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

Not trying to be obtuse but personally with an ulcer-y horse, I would never feed most commercial high-fibre cubes as they're full of molasses and fillers which are not ulcer-friendly. I much prefer hay cobs or grass nuts or alfalfa pellets (a lot of horses are sensitive to alfalfa though, and you mentioned she can be sensitive/loopy!)

Honestly, i am all about learning so any advice you have is advice ill take! Thats what the nutritionist recommended and on the labelling it even says designed for ulcer prone horses? She is sensitive to alfalfa, can colic easily. She doesn't have ulcers at all, i had her scoped though its more out of my preference.

 

[VioletStripe]

Normally I would say yes she should be fine, but it often happens and then we change something, up the feed or use the mash etc and she puts the weight back on so back to normal within a few weeks. Im just looking for a way to maybe prevent this by having a more suitable feed in general. She does bloom in spring very much so, you have a good point!

Grass pellets sound good, she has a treatball so this could defo work!

Totally understand - I am always looking/striving for ribs on my Connie, so opposite prob!

 

[VioletStripe]

Honestly, i am all about learning so any advice you have is advice ill take! Thats what the nutritionist recommended and on the labelling it even says designed for ulcer prone horses? She is sensitive to alfalfa, can colic easily. She doesn't have ulcers at all, i had her scoped though its more out of my preference.

Unfortunately I don't trust a lot of feed company nutritionists or labels.. I always look at the ingredients myself and make a decision with the reading around. Generally, high fibre cubes aren't great as they're packed with crap and flavoured with molasses - not good for sensitive tummies or horses. Generally, grass nuts and hay cobs are great extras. I know some people have fed Simple Systems grass nuts with good success for upping condition without adding starch etc. - lots of good digestible fibre, and if combined with some oil and extras, can be good for putting on condition.

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

Unfortunately I don't trust a lot of feed company nutritionists or labels.. I always look at the ingredients myself and make a decision with the reading around. Generally, high fibre cubes aren't great as they're packed with crap and flavoured with molasses - not good for sensitive tummies or horses. Generally, grass nuts and hay cobs are great extras. I know some people have fed Simple Systems grass nuts with good success for upping condition without adding starch etc. - lots of good digestible fibre, and if combined with some oil and extras, can be good for putting on condition.

I will do this from now on then, thank you! Off to go take a photo of ingredients. x

 

[Friesianfoal1999]

If anyone has any advice on what I can do to change or add to the feed id really appreciate it, routine etc cannot change

 

[Merrymoles]

My friend's oldie thrived on pink mash when he started to lose weight because his teeth were getting iffy. I'm not sure what is in it but it's non-heating and obviously very palatable. It does need ten minutes to soak though. His teeth have subsequently got a lot more iffy and he can no longer eat forage but he is still doing extremely well on a combination of pink mash and some kind of fibre pellets - the latter are to keep him fuller for longer.