Weird one

Roasted Chestnuts

Roasted Chestnuts

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Ok so this is something I’ve just clocked on to.

Faran changes your rise. No matter the rein he doesn’t want you on his outside leg sitting. I honestly couldn’t believe what I was feeling today. We were trotting round and he kept changing front legs like he was going to canter and actively changing my rise from outside leg to inside leg. Then when I changed it back he did it again, and again and again and I was like am I imagining this.

He’s just had a physio session so he’s had a clean bill of health there so next up is a saddle check which he had a few months ago but I want done again so that’s happening Sunday.

Has anyone else had a horse do this! I wish I had someone tape it. We have been having issues with right rein canter. He won’t lead with the inside leg he constantly wants to counter canter. Hence the physio check. I don’t think they are related however as he doesn’t want you on his outside leg sitting on the left rein either. He jumps you to the inside leg.

Doesn’t do it out hacking however. I can trot on either leg and he doesn’t bother. Only in the school.

Thoughts??
 
Baggs absolutely hates schooling with a passion, so we only do very little of it to break up hacking constantly and to occasionally install some brakes when he forgets that he can stop politely and nicely.....

In the school he absolutely refuses to canter - I had physio, chiro, vet and saddler all out to check him and after some investigations we found that due to his arthritis, it makes it a lot harder for him to canter in a contained space such as a school. If the very rare chance occurs and I do get canter, it's nearly always on the wrong lead, doesn't really last for long and is bloody awful to sit to!

School work can be quite hard on them which would explain why you are only getting the issue when in the school and not hacking. Also out hacking you aren't dealing with a constant change of bend and the constant rebalancing like you are in the school - you can often go for a decent period before having to swap diagonals/change bend etc. How old is Faran - could he possibly be struggling as that side is under developed for some reason - hence why he doesn't want you on it when in the school? x Does Faran do the same thing with anyone else on board too? x
 
ester said:
Yes, both times trying to put me sitting on the ‘good’ hind leg/shift me off the bad one. One early sign of spavin.
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He’s doing it on both reins. So he doesn’t have a good rein for it. Also when jumping he will change legs himself to the correct lead.

It’s a very strange one 👀 I have a flat work lesson booked for my instructor to have a look at him.
 
AppyLover1996 said:
Baggs absolutely hates schooling with a passion, so we only do very little of it to break up hacking constantly and to occasionally install some brakes when he forgets that he can stop politely and nicely.....

In the school he absolutely refuses to canter - I had physio, chiro, vet and saddler all out to check him and after some investigations we found that due to his arthritis, it makes it a lot harder for him to canter in a contained space such as a school. If the very rare chance occurs and I do get canter, it's nearly always on the wrong lead, doesn't really last for long and is bloody awful to sit to!

School work can be quite hard on them which would explain why you are only getting the issue when in the school and not hacking. Also out hacking you aren't dealing with a constant change of bend and the constant rebalancing like you are in the school - you can often go for a decent period before having to swap diagonals/change bend etc. How old is Faran - could he possibly be struggling as that side is under developed for some reason - hence why he doesn't want you on it when in the school? x Does Faran do the same thing with anyone else on board too? x
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He’s only 7 and I haven’t forced a lot of flat work from him. It was my plan this winter to concentrate on flat work now his frame is mature. He could just be weak on that canter lead . It was the constantly swapping me to his inside leg no matter the rein I’m in that got me.
 
He’s been checked over by the chiropractor and physio and has shown no issues or pain.

He’s seven and not done a lot of schooling or much of anything serious TBH. If he was a bit older or had done a lot of would be considering getting the vet out but he’s sound and other than these little things showing no other signs of pain. Having spoken to my instructor she thinks he could just not have done enough schooling work as he is very immature in his flat work.

Going to get his saddle checked on Sunday in case it’s that as he has changed shape a lot and we have been swithering if he’s needing a new one. If after this and some gentle schooling I need to involve the vet I will however I’m not jumping to that straight away.
 
TheMule said:
7 is the classic time to start to show hock arthritis in my experience. It’s easy to diagnose and very manageable
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Sorry but this would be my thought too- I’d want hock X-rays. I had similar issues with my mare and this was the outcome. The physio and chiro don’t have xray eyes, and especially if the horse has bilateral changes- they can look sound.

I hope it’s not the case at all for you! But I’d want to rule it out before pushing on as if it were a training/young horse balance issue.
 
It could be assymetry in his body from lack of schooling to build his muscles up equally on both sides of his body plus the resulting shortened muscles on one side. I have been working on that with my pony for the last year now. Mine definitely has one hind leg weaker than the other, one shoulder and one foot larger than the others and he was exhibiting the same symptoms. He did have a thorough work up at Donnington equine hospital where he was given a clean bill of health (apart from the raised muscle enzymes after exercise but that is a different story). By doing regular in hand work plus slow ridden work, including lateral work, he is finally suppling up and becoming more evenly muscled. The trot diagonals now feel the same and the canter is coming. We do fairly classical work in hand combined with the ideas of Diana Waters (Power of walk). If you are interested I can recommend Dressage Training in-hand by Kathrin Roida and Dressage in Hand by Josepha Guillaume. Ten or fifteen minutes in hand followed by ridden work doing the same things from the saddle can really help the horse develop properly. I found the combination brings about faster results than just trying to do it all from the saddle and is less stressful for both of us as the horse and I already know how to do the exercises when it comes to riding.
 
So update

Saddler today. Tried on a good few saddles. Some were just no from me, one was an epic no from him, he’s NEVER bucked under saddle like this in his life! And a few were good. So we have one home to try as we have a flat work lesson this week and a jumping lesson so it will get thoroughly tested.

Interestingly enough the ones he was fine with we had no chopping and changing legs and correct right leg strike offs. Two master saddlers looking at him and I think I’m going to do a video as when he actually engages his core and raises his back he has a completely different back profile. So this is what we will be working towards as the thought process is that he isn’t using himself correctly. When he lifts his back he’s a flat backed typical Welsh. However as he is standing at rest he’s a curvy back so a completely different fit.

Lots of thoughts from both saddlers on him and yes it’s good I’ve left him mature but now it’s time to get him using himself and even him out. So I’m going to have to embrace the schooling and gently over winter (with help!) get us both flat work fit.

If this doesn’t help then I will look at other options. It was a loooooong morning at the fitters they were extremely thorough!

Photo of said pony who has had a nice fresh clip and is a lovely dark liver colour. I wish he stayed this colour all year I love it 🥰

IMG_8749.jpeg

Ps you can see the rubs from the saddle now that I’ve clipped him 😔 saddler thinks they should go with the next coat change 🤞🏼
 
I have a horse with a similar back in that his really flattens when he uses himself. If a saddle fits at the halt and walk, it doesn't at the trot and canter. If it fits at the trot and canter, it doesn't fit at the walk and halt, and he cocks a leg every time he halts to relieve pressure at the back of the saddle because the tree is too flat in those gaits.

It's freaking annoying. With current saddle he gets perfectly square halts, and has a nice walk. The saddle has movement at the back in trot and canter though. He seems more ok with this than it being the other way around so 🤷🏼‍♀️

Sometimes you just find what works for them even if it's not textbook in all ways. Atleast you have a good team of fitters and I do find the signs he was showing to be interesting! Glad you're on your way to get it sorted. Love his colour!
 
CanteringCarrot said:
I have a horse with a similar back in that his really flattens when he uses himself. If a saddle fits at the halt and walk, it doesn't at the trot and canter. If it fits at the trot and canter, it doesn't fit at the walk and halt, and he cocks a leg every time he halts to relieve pressure at the back of the saddle because the tree is too flat in those gaits.
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I'm not saying you *should* do this - I know some people don't get on with treeless saddles - but have you ever tried something treeless, like a Ghost or a Treefree? I'm genuinely curious because by the sounds of it his back changes shape so much you need a saddle that will accommodate that, hence wondering whether you'd ever tried treeless and if so, how you got on. It sounds incredibly frustrating!
 
Widgeon said:
I'm not saying you *should* do this - I know some people don't get on with treeless saddles - but have you ever tried something treeless, like a Ghost or a Treefree? I'm genuinely curious because by the sounds of it his back changes shape so much you need a saddle that will accommodate that, hence wondering whether you'd ever tried treeless and if so, how you got on. It sounds incredibly frustrating!
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I've thought about it. I've had my doubts for a few reasons, but if I actually had some knowledgeable locally (or within a few hours) that could walk me through what to know and have me try a few before buying, I'd be open to it. I just haven't been able to find anything. I'd be going in rather blind otherwise.
 
What’s going on here out of interest?
Is it weird muscling or a metabolic type fat deposit? I’m assuming you are dealing with ?metabolic issues. (He actually looks pretty trim & fit for his type so don’t take that as a criticism….

IMG_3321.jpeg
 
ihatework said:
What’s going on here out of interest?
Is it weird muscling or a metabolic type fat deposit? I’m assuming you are dealing with ?metabolic issues. (He actually looks pretty trim & fit for his type so don’t take that as a criticism….

View attachment 166864
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He’s always had that shape there. It’s become more apparent the more trim he’s gotten.

He’s always been more square haunched than round if that makes sense. 🙂
 
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