Welfare case how can i help her.

Purple18

Purple18

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Hi everyone :)


I have been at my stable for a year in march there is a 19 year old cob I'm getting rather concerned about.


This horse was brought in for the summer paddocks 1st september after a month in the summer paddock . I don't remember the date exactly, it was either the 1st or the 2nd this horse had a shires medium weight turnout rug put on. After being out in all the rain from march 5th when i first met with no rug what so ever this rug has not been removed since then. She never had her feet looked at to my knowledge in nearly a year she struggles to eat coughs constantly and a shavings bed which is mostly black with the amount of wet ( she is deep littered ) she stinks I hate having to see her like this. I don't no what her weight is like due to the rug but there must be sores under there by now surely?

She also went from having no feed to having a whole bucket no gradual
introduction. Then her owner changed the feed from hifi orginal to safe & sound in one night.
There's more in horses in more need of charity help but I really now feel i need to do something to help her.

What would you do ?
 
I agree with Amymay. Speak to your yard owner and see what they say. Maybe talk to other liveries who may also be concerned and go see YO together. YO has a legal responsibility to ensure all horses on their property are properly cared for.
 
Are you saying the horse was turned out from March to September with no rug? Why would you think this was a problem? Did the horse have shelter? Natural or man made?

How do you know the rug has not been removed? The owner could visit while you are not at the yard and remove the rug and replace it? My horse has a turn out on in the stable, so his rug is not changed every day but I do remove it and check daily.

Do you know that the owner has not had the cough addressed with the vet? We have a horse on our yard that has a physiologial reason it coughs. It has a shavings bed so perhaps the owner is aware?

Have you raised your concerns with your yard owner?


What do you mean she struggles to eat? Clearly chagnging feed and feeding vastly more quickly is not ideal. Have you asked the owner about it?
 
amymay said:
Have you spoken to your yard owner?

Is this horse turned out?
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Yes fromaround 10am to 2pm would be out 24/7 but yard owner doesn't allow it in the winter
Wagtail said:
I agree with Amymay. Speak to your yard owner and see what they say. Maybe talk to other liveries who may also be concerned and go see YO together. YO has a legal responsibility to ensure all horses on their property are properly cared for.
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Other liveries are concerned the yard owner isn't the most understanding and will often just wlak off if you say something she doesn't like.

Pilib said:
Are you saying the horse was turned out from March to September with no rug? Why would you think this was a problem? Did the horse have shelter? Natural or man made?

How do you know the rug has not been removed? The owner could visit while you are not at the yard and remove the rug and replace it? My horse has a turn out on in the stable, so his rug is not changed every day but I do remove it and check daily.

Do you know that the owner has not had the cough addressed with the vet? We have a horse on our yard that has a physiologial reason it coughs. It has a shavings bed so perhaps the owner is aware?

Have you raised your concerns with your yard owner?


What do you mean she struggles to eat? Clearly chagnging feed and feeding vastly more quickly is not ideal. Have you asked the owner about it?
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I have no problem with the horse not wearing a rug. i have a problem with a horse that already had a thick coat being without a rug for months getting a good coat to help with the terrible weather then to put her in mediumweight rug on a already warm horse she must be boiling .

Me and the other liveries see her every morning and night and know the rountine.

Morning. she gets out of her car leaves the car engine running, gets the horse out puts it in the field. Does a 5mins muck out I may add has just as poo in it after she has finished. Throws some feed in the bucket she even has a water carrier in the stable so she doesn't have to fill the water up by walking to the tap alot of the times the water is black( i do change the water) . gets in her car and goes

Night time does the same with the car throws the horse in the stable and goes.

Yes " swapping over carefully is overated "
 
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Purple18 said:
Other liveries are concerned the yard owner isn't the most understanding and will often just wlak off if you say something she doesn't like.
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Unfortunately for your YO he doesn't have this option.......

So, if you're genuinely concerned that the horse is suffering neglect, your only option is to call the RSPCA.

Let us know how you get on.
 
Have you actuallly felt the horse under the rug to see if she is sweating? Some horses might be just right, even with a thick coat underneath; it's no different to the layers of rugs lots of people use on clipped animals.

While the feed changes aren't ideal, at the end of the day they are both just chaff of oat straw and alfalfa, so unlikely to cause major problems.

It sounds as if the livery is really pushed for time, but if the horse has its basic needs met then it isn't really a welfare case, even though it might be far from ideal.
 
Is it half term already ;-)

You say the horse goes out from 10am - 2pm, but then you say " Night time she throws the horse in the stable and goes". I'm confused, where is the horse from 2pm to "night time?"
 
touchstone said:
Have you actuallly felt the horse under the rug to see if she is sweating? Some horses might be just right, even with a thick coat underneath; it's no different to the layers of rugs lots of people use on clipped animals.

While the feed changes aren't ideal, at the end of the day they are both just chaff of oat straw and alfalfa, so unlikely to cause major problems.

It sounds as if the livery is really pushed for time, but if the horse has its basic needs met then it isn't really a welfare case, even though it might be far from ideal.
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I would agree. I am not sure what you describe is a welfare case. It may not be the way you, or perhaps most of the people on here would keep their horse but it does sound as if it's basic needs are met.
 
The last time I felt she was damp not sure if she was sweating or wether the rain had being getting into the rug from the neck and dripping down there's also some what feels like a hard mass of something either scabbing or matted hair. I don't think the owner is trying to hurt her in anyway she's just rush for time and trying to cut costs as much as possible. she just seems to getting slowly worse.If something happened i'd blame myself for not trying to help her but don't want to look like a fool if someone came and she was okay which I feel is unlikely.
 
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sue_nf said:
Is it half term already ;-)

You say the horse goes out from 10am - 2pm, but then you say " Night time she throws the horse in the stable and goes". I'm confused, where is the horse from 2pm to "night time?"
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Im assuming she meant the horse comes in at 2pm and is then in until 10am the following morning when she is turned out?
 
If the owner is rushed for time, and you are concerned, why not offer to help the owner out. You will then be in a position to see if there really are issues and be able to do something about it.
 
To be honest with you unless you are prepared to risk taking the rug off and having a good look at her overall condition theres not much you can do from this point.

If you take the rug off and she is in very poor condition then your able to decide the next route you take...
If you take the rug off and she is in good condition then whether you agree or dont agree with the owners methods the horse is obviously getting what it needs in some measure.
 
before you call the RSPCA (if YO wont listen) then you need to firstly take a good look at the horse - without its rug - condition score it - check its feet etc.... then make a judgement - if it is getting fed and watered and is in ok body condition and has no obvious injuries/sores the RSPCA wont be able to do much but they may be able to have a chat with the owner. I woud still pin down the YO though - they are not going to be too happy about someone going over their head and calling the RSPCA wiithout their knowledge !
 
Beausmate said:
It's not a black cob, is it?
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it's dark bay mare :)
sue_nf said:
Is it half term already ;-)

You say the horse goes out from 10am - 2pm, but then you say " Night time she throws the horse in the stable and goes". I'm confused, where is the horse from 2pm to "night time?"
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Not a troll :)
oh sorry Afternoon time I'm trying to fit in all the important info i don't see how the time is important
Pilib said:
I would agree. I am not sure what you describe is a welfare case. It may not be the way you, or perhaps most of the people on here would keep their horse but it does sound as if it's basic needs are met.
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if she wasn't coughing and having a problem eating I would think the same as what you just said she wasn't as bad when i first arrived here if she'd stayed the same I might not even have been writing this today

i'll go in a have a good look at her tonight i'm hoping she won't be in bad condition I'd rather not have to upset anyone and possibly get kicked off..
 
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It's not something I'd normally recommend but could you remove the rug to check and put your mind at rest?

I'd hate it if someone did that to my pony but it could be your only choice in this situation if you want to push the situation as neglectful
 
WelshD said:
It's not something I'd normally recommend but could you remove the rug to check and put your mind at rest?

I'd hate it if someone did that to my pony but it could be your only choice in this situation if you want to push the situation as neglectful
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I'd be the same but seems like the only option. I think I owe it to her to atleast check her over, just hope i don't regret it later..
 
Either offer to do a morning or an evening session for the owner & then you can remove the rug to check,
or
If you do have concerns, then remove the rug to look properly anyway. Tho do be careful in doing this without owners permission, better to get YO to do this.

The welfare charities will agree that basic needs are being met: hay/feed/rug etc - yes, not up to others standards but BASIC needs.

If you have qualms about the horses condition after you have been able to look, then talk to owner of horse, also YO (has to accept responsibility for sick/welfare cases on his property) and if necessary call a vet & welfare charity worker (WHW, BHS or RSPCA)

I hope that the horse is ok
 
I agree you need to check the mare. If the owner is on such a tight time frame, wait until they have left for the night and quickly pull back the rug and check her condition and feet. If anyone asks what you are doing just say something like the rug had slipped/caught on something.

Then once you know her condition you can go from there.

A friend of mine keeps her horse similarly. She's a hairy, fat coloured cob. Heavily rugged, fed about 3 stubbs scoops of conditioning mix a day, not exercised and only leaves the stable on a fine day as she "doesn't like the rain". I dont agree with this but, she doesn't agree with my way of keeping my pony out 24/7 unrugged on hay and fast fiber. Unfortunately, unless the horse is in a poor condition there isnt much you can do.

Has anyone spoken to the owner? It really might be worth speaking to them and telling them your concerns/offering help. While they may not take too kindly to it, they may also be really grateful.

If nobody really knows them, they may have a lot going on in their life and be struggling. Maybe they are novice and dont realise they should be doing certain things?

I know its hard as there was a neglect case at my last yard and I did call the RSPCA much to the annoyance of the YO who ignored my concerns.
 
touchstone said:
You could always say her rug had slipped and needed righting to give her a check. ;)
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thank you :)
The Fuzzy Furry said:
Either offer to do a morning or an evening session for the owner & then you can remove the rug to check,
or
If you do have concerns, then remove the rug to look properly anyway. Tho do be careful in doing this without owners permission, better to get YO to do this.

The welfare charities will agree that basic needs are being met: hay/feed/rug etc - yes, not up to others standards but BASIC needs.

If you have qualms about the horses condition after you have been able to look, then talk to owner of horse, also YO (has to accept responsibility for sick/welfare cases on his property) and if necessary call a vet & welfare charity worker (WHW, BHS or RSPCA)

I hope that the horse is ok
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Thank you :) I'm going to try and check her over tonight she's such a sweet mare it's such a shame.
HaffiesRock said:
I agree you need to check the mare. If the owner is on such a tight time frame, wait until they have left for the night and quickly pull back the rug and check her condition and feet. If anyone asks what you are doing just say something like the rug had slipped/caught on something.

Then once you know her condition you can go from there.

A friend of mine keeps her horse similarly. She's a hairy, fat coloured cob. Heavily rugged, fed about 3 stubbs scoops of conditioning mix a day, not exercised and only leaves the stable on a fine day as she "doesn't like the rain". I dont agree with this but, she doesn't agree with my way of keeping my pony out 24/7 unrugged on hay and fast fiber. Unfortunately, unless the horse is in a poor condition there isnt much you can do.

Has anyone spoken to the owner? It really might be worth speaking to them and telling them your concerns/offering help. While they may not take too kindly to it, they may also be really grateful.

If nobody really knows them, they may have a lot going on in their life and be struggling. Maybe they are novice and dont realise they should be doing certain things?

I know its hard as there was a neglect case at my last yard and I did call the RSPCA much to the annoyance of the YO who ignored my concerns.
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From what i know it was the ladys daughters horse and the daughter became pregnant and with that she could no longer look after the horse so now the mum looks after her. I get the feeling at one point she was a much loved pony who was probably looked after amazingly. Life has moved on for everyone else besides the pony i'bve heard other liveries say before that they beileve it would be better if there was something wrong and that the pony who finally have peace.Not sure if i quite agreed with that veiw tbh.
 
Purple18 said:
thank you :)

Thank you :) I'm going to try and check her over tonight she's such a sweet mare it's such a shame.


From what i know it was the ladys daughters horse and the daughter became pregnant and with that she could no longer look after the horse so now the mum looks after her. I get the feeling at one point she was a much loved pony who was probably looked after amazingly. Life has moved on for everyone else besides the pony i'bve heard other liveries say before that they beileve it would be better if there was something wrong and that the pony who finally have peace.Not sure if i quite agreed with that veiw tbh.
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That's very sad :( Does the daughter never visit anymore?

Maybe someone could suggest a sharer or something to help the lady out? Sounds like a case of lack of knowledge to me :( Hard one to bring up with the lady though x
 
HaffiesRock said:
That's very sad :( Does the daughter never visit anymore?

Maybe someone could suggest a sharer or something to help the lady out? Sounds like a case of lack of knowledge to me :( Hard one to bring up with the lady though x
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Sometimes she comes in the car when the mums comes but rarely gets out the last time I saw her actually out of the car was april time.

I have thought about it there's plenty of people on the yard that would happliy look after it's seems a case of they can't afford to keep her but can't bring themself to let her go.
 
Managed to take alook at her checked all of her feet which were totally packed full of mud and wet bedding sadly couldn't get it all as it's terribly packed. Very possible thrush looks like the packed bedding is the only holding her hoofs together.mud fever atleast to the knee. I didn't want to put her through to much stress so will take the rug off tomorrow put my hand down the neck was super oily in there and when i brought my hand out it was covered in fur (molting?) felt pretty hot too. doesn't sound good so far :(
 
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