What can I do about problem riders?

Bannock said:
Thanks for all the helpful suggestions, you have reinforced my view that most riders *are* careful, and it's just a few idiots who make things difficult. I am considering fitting self closing gates, but that seems to be being unpleasant to the considerate riders too. I was hoping there was some rights of way equivalent to a restraining order! However, I'll wait and see what the rights of way officer says.

Thanks

Bannock
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I wouldn't touch a self closing gate personally.

I've taken one off it's hinges with a horse... the same gate that had previously shattered two horses pelvis'. I would rather turn around or find another route now.

You could do that but it would be a private matter not a police one. We have revoked access on a public crossing over our driveway and had the police visit the people and warn them to not come by in future and told us to get a restraining order if they did. It was a bit of a more extreme case but the police warning was enough...

Pan
 
Grrr riders like that really annoy me. They are very, very rude.

Please do not go fitting self closing gates straight away! Both my horse and my mum have suffered injuries as a result of self closing gates on separate occasions so I will no longer ride along routes which have them. It is a shame, at my old yard all but 1 of the bridlepaths had these gates fitted :(
 
OP has to protect himself from damage that his stock may do if they get out I don't see how he can do this without self closing gates it's sad but I just can't see how he can protect himself overwise.
 
i quite like the electric fence maze idea- if you got a friendly horse and rider to help plan the spacing to check it was negotiable, surely it would also help prevent your animals running through the gate if it was left open?
 
Also, make sure the fencing is VERY clearly signed and totally visible. You don't want someone cantering into it and having an accident... firstly because it would be awful (the riders are a pain but that's not the fault of their horses) and secondly because you'd be liable.

One of the country parks near home has post and rail fencing in a similar arrangement on the horse tracks every so often, presumably to stop riders cantering through blind gaps as many other people also use the park. Might be worth talking to the BHS RoW officer about the legality of doing something like this?
 
I like the padlock idea. WHY SHOULD YOU PAY FOR GATES AND FENCING FOR THESE IDIOTS !!

It's not YOUR problem to pay for, what a bunch of w@nkers !!

Everytime you see it open lock it and put up a sign saying please close the gate?
 
I am pretty sure that the electric fence maze idea is a non starter strict rules govern the use of electric fencing on rights of way it canot be a 'common nuisance' I think that's the highways act 1959 section 116.
There no point in Op getting into hot water over this.
 
niagaraduval said:
I like the padlock idea. WHY SHOULD YOU PAY FOR GATES AND FENCING FOR THESE IDIOTS !!

It's not YOUR problem to pay for, what a bunch of w@nkers !!

Everytime you see it open lock it and put up a sign saying please close the gate?
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OP cannot lock the gate that would be unlawful the landowner does havea duty to maintain the rights of way on his land and to fence and gate against his own stock escaping my cattle got onto the road because the gate was left open would be the reason but the responsibility would be OP's it's very unfair.
 
Basically, I think the answer is that you need to find someone that knows what they're talking about OP, rather than people getting steamed up on here and suggesting possibly illegal solutions! The BHS person would probably be a good place to start.

Another thought - some police forces have officers dedicated to rural areas, some even have officers focussed on equine matters... if your area has one, you could give them a call (on the non-emergency number of course) and ask them to have a word with the culprits about what they are doing. Again, the BHS bod could probably advise on this - or the council right of way person.
 
Spudlet said:
Basically, I think the answer is that you need to find someone that knows what they're talking about OP, rather than people getting steamed up on here and suggesting possibly illegal solutions! The BHS person would probably be a good place to start.

Another thought - some police forces have officers dedicated to rural areas, some even have officers focussed on equine matters... if your area has one, you could give them a call (on the non-emergency number of course) and ask them to have a word with the culprits about what they are doing. Again, the BHS bod could probably advise on this - or the council right of way person.
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The police idea is worth a go if OP knows where they live it might just do the trick.
 
Goldenstar said:
I am pretty sure that the electric fence maze idea is a non starter strict rules govern the use of electric fencing on rights of way it canot be a 'common nuisance' I think that's the highways act 1959 section 116.
There no point in Op getting into hot water over this.
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The fence does not have to be electrified, and provided the gap is wide enough (can't remember the specific width) then it does not constittute a nuisance, as far as I know.
The other issue of course is that for the council to take action, someone must complain, if signs are posted as to why, then I can't see local riders making that complaint.
 
Why is everyone implying self-closing gates would be a nuisance? We have loads of bridleway gates by us, I would love it if they were self closing, rather than having to turn around and struggle to close them, some can be very difficult.

I can't believe these riders were so rude to actually say that to you, I would be mortified if a landowner caught me out behaving like that, I'd be most apologetic and grovelling!
 
ThreeTB's said:
Why is everyone implying self-closing gates would be a nuisance? We have loads of bridleway gates by us, I would love it if they were self closing, rather than having to turn around and struggle to close them, some can be very difficult.
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When you see the damage they can do to horse/rider you might think twice.

The rural riders police thing is a good idea :)
 
ThreeTB's said:
Why is everyone implying self-closing gates would be a nuisance? We have loads of bridleway gates by us, I would love it if they were self closing, rather than having to turn around and struggle to close them, some can be very difficult.
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Unfortunately a lot of us have had very bad experiences with self-closing gates. Battling to keep the things open while going through and not sandwiching the horse is not easy. Horses and people have been damaged (sometimes fatally) on them. BHS recommends very slow closing times if using them, however most self closing gates snap shut with a fair old amount of force. I wouldn't touch them with a barge pole.

Pan
 
Interesting question. We are currently involved in a similar dispute (walkers with dogs not horses). We have gone down the padlock route.

It is unlawful (although not criminal) and we have been asked by the council (twice) to remove it. I have met with said council employee and found her to be actually really sympathetic. She let slip that there was no way in these times of limted resources that they would take it any further.

In your case I would padlock and laminate a poster so that all of the riders (who don't deserve this) would be made aware of why you had done it and who was to blame.

You could then remove it once it had done its job. Sorry to sound hard-faced but sometimes you have to be.
 
I am really quite shocked that a couple of posters have advised making the route very dangerous for all the users of this bridleway (flappy flags, umberellas etc...). This punishes everyone and does not deal specifically with the selfish idiots that are causing the problem for the OP.

I have used bridleways with self closing gates and I found that I had to dismount to use them safely as they really do ping shut. This never was a problem as my mare stands nicely for me to remount.

I think that talking to the BHS is a good starting point and the slow self closing gates might be far better than the quick ones that I have used.
 
Good grief, that's incredibly rude of them! It makes me incredibly cross to think that those of us who ride with consideration - and appreciate how lucky we are to do so across other people's land - can be tarred with the same brush.

Am replying to this quickly (as am battling desk-from-hell while trying to eat lunch...) but would strongly recommend taking advice from your local highways officers before taking action.

Scarymare is quite right that it's unlawful to obstruct a right of way. It's a criminal offence under the Highways Act as well as a nuisance at common law. V good point made re. the highways authority having frankly better things to do with their time and money in this day and age BUT a user of the right of way can require them to take action to remove the obstruction, which the highways authority would be obliged by law to act on.

In case of any use, here's a (shamelessly self-promotional!) link to an article about cattle grids and bridleways: http://www.henmansllp.co.uk/rights_of_way

The law is pretty strict here, difficult for landowners though it is.
 
Take a photo of the rude riders, blow it up to A3 size, laminate it and put it on the gate. Padlock gate and put a note saying

"when these riders agree to close this gate behind them, the padlock will be removed"
 
Faracat said:
I am really quite shocked that a couple of posters have advised making the route very dangerous for all the users of this bridleway (flappy flags, umberellas etc...). This punishes everyone and does not deal specifically with the selfish idiots that are causing the problem for the OP.

It was tongue in cheek Faracat ;)
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RebelRebel said:
Faracat said:
I am really quite shocked that a couple of posters have advised making the route very dangerous for all the users of this bridleway (flappy flags, umberellas etc...). This punishes everyone and does not deal specifically with the selfish idiots that are causing the problem for the OP.

It was tongue in cheek Faracat ;)
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Sorry I miss read the tone. :)
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Personally before you do anything else, when you see them coming, I would just wait, really politely, by your gate, with a camera. Make a point of noting the time, and taking numerous photos of them and their horses leaving the gate unlocked.

There might not be anything the police can do to stop them, but they don't know that.
 
I quite like self closing gates. OP, what about fencing a track around the edge of the field from one gate to the next, or does the bridle path run right through the middle of the field? Not that you should have to but it would stop your animals being let out.
 
monkeybum13 said:
When you see the damage they can do to horse/rider you might think twice.
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PandorasJar said:
Unfortunately a lot of us have had very bad experiences with self-closing gates. Battling to keep the things open while going through and not sandwiching the horse is not easy. Horses and people have been damaged (sometimes fatally) on them. BHS recommends very slow closing times if using them, however most self closing gates snap shut with a fair old amount of force. I wouldn't touch them with a barge pole.

Pan
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I do understand where you're coming from, but we have problems with 'normal' gates closing on us, especially if they're not weighted correctly. It's very difficult at some of them to swing them open enough to then run through before they get you. Just sounded like a good idea to me - thought they would be nice and slow like the ones at the vets and local show venue :)
 
On several occassions our local farmer has roped off a bridleway due to users abusing the facility, going on land that is not part of the bridleway, cantering on his grass on the side of his drive etc.

Every time he has done this the local Bridleway Association Rep and the Local Council have been out. After discussions he has taken the rope down, not got into trouble.

I really sympathise with him and likewise with the OP

I wouldn't advocate making the bridleway impassable as it could have a big impact on a genuine rider who is not a nuisance (I was nearly late taking my husband to hospital when my farmer closed the bridleway with no warning, it was near the end of my circular ride!).

OP you could also ask your local bridleway association to put something in their next communication with their members stating what problems you are having. Also speak to all the horse riders who do shut the gate. They can also moan at the riders who are being so disrespectful. Maybe shame them into behaving?!

This farmer has had some success with signs along the lines of "some people are doing XXXX and it is not acceptable please only do YYYYY"

He also has spoken to all the "good" riders and we do help him police his bridleways. If we see anyone doing anything they shouldn't be we immediately speak to them and also let him know. Sometimes they genuinely don't realise they are in the wrong place / abusing his land. If anyone is riding his bridleways that we don't recognise we tend to stop them to chat and drop into the conversation what problems he has been having and how we can all help to keep things amicable.

Over time this has proved effective. Not perfect, but much better than it was.

OP I'd get some signs up quick - just laminated paper - as this is a cheap and easy start.
 
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PingPongPony said:
or llamas, they seem to be scary too :D
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Stuff the horse - I'm scared of Llamas :D

I'd speak to the local rag and see if they would do a piece in the paper about it.

And while it's again money you need to spend, I would print off leaflets stating your intention of putting self closers on the gates due to the mis-use by some riders and drop them off round the farms/properties with stables in the vincinity. And the local tack/feed shops.
 
Thank you so much everyone for your helpful suggestions, and my apologies for the slowness of my response - I took the day off yesterday to get wet at the Royal Highland Show! I haven't finished reading all your responses, but I wanted to say thanks as soon as possible.

Great advice about talking to the local BHA, I'd not thought of that. I will talk to the rights of way officer when they return. I'll also use the idea of a solicitor's letter pointing out that they will be liable for damage. It's great news that some of you have had people barred from using a bridleway for repeated bad behaviour; maybe that information might make these riders see sense.

As a last resort I will look at (slowly) self closing gates, but I don't like the idea, especially in view of the fact that a horse could be injured.

Thanks also for all the suggestions re llamas, pigs, geese, bird scarers, padlocked gates etc. I have muttered about such measures while stomping around closing the gates, but the fact remains that it IS a public bridleway, and there are innocent riders/walkers who'd also suffer. In addition, such measures mainly frighten the horses, who aren't to blame for their riders' behaviour. (I also prefer to remain legal, it's easier to sleep at night).

What I wanted to know was who else I could turn to for help, and you've certainly provided that!

Thanks again

Bannock
 
Having now read through all the suggestions, the idea of taking photos sounds good, and I'll also go for putting up the laminated signs warning I'm considering installing self closing gates; as you point out, it's inexpensive and doesn't cause problems for the law-abiding majority.

Thanks again, and you have indeed reinforced my view that most people who use bridleways, whether riders, walkers or cyclists are actually thoughtful and care.

Bannock
 
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