What causes seizures?

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sonjafoers

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My beloved, beautiful rottie was pts late last night as a result of having a seizure. We lost our older boy in the summer so losing 2 within 6 months is heartbreaking. Whilst our old boy was poorly Storm wasn't, he had a huge seizure and I wonder if anyone can shed some light on what causes such things.

He had 3 operations over the summer on his elbow & shoulder so was finally recovering and back onto limited exercise. He has been on previcox but I'm sure that isn't related.

He was very quiet yesterday morning but seemed normal again in the afternoon, went out for a walk, had his tea and everything was normal when we went up to bed. I was woken about midnight by him fitting very aggressively, he initially tried to get up but couldn't use his back end and eventually lay fitting on his side. He fitted for over an hour with no let up before the vet eventually arrived, she gave him 3 doses of a sedative, I think diazepam, which is the maximum she could give as normally the first dose takes effect. Even after the 3rd dose there was no change and his temperature was sky high. The vet said the only option was to take him in and put him under a GA, almost like inducing a coma, but he was likely to have massive brain damage. My husband is in Iraq and I managed to get him on the phone and we made the decision to pts.

The vet wasn't my normal vet as it was an out of hours service and to be honest in the circumstances I didn't ask many questions but what could cause such a huge seizure in such sudden circumstances?
 
I am so sorry to read this, how traumatic and terrifying for you to witness and with your husband away as well. Ive no idea what could have caused this and dont even know if Rotties are prone to seizures. I would be like you searching for answers, can you make an appointment in a few days with your normal vet and discuss this with them, I dont know if you are prepared to go for a post mortem or even if this would provide you with any answers but would need to be sorted sooner rather than later. Hugs to you Sonja, I really feel for you. xx
 
sonja, how awful for you, and to cope with it alone, more so. Your husband made the right decision, of that there's no question. Only those who witnessed your dog's behaviour would be the ones to form conclusive views, I'd have thought. What did the visiting Vet say? Just a couple of questions, though they probably won't be of much help; was your dog conscious, or did you 'feel' that he was whilst he was fitting? I ask because you said that he was aggressive, so was presumably conscious. For others, would it be usual for a dog to fit, for an hour?

Regarding PMs, I've had them carried out, many times on sheep, though more often lambs, and despite having them carried out at the State Veterinary Centres and on lambs which were still living at arrival, I've never yet had a conclusive result.

A difficult night and day for you. I'm so sorry.

Alec.
 
Thank you Alec and Dobiegirl for you kind words, I am heartbroken as you can imagine. We have spent months rehabilitating him after his operations and he was finally getting there, he was bouncy and playing and starting to get his life back. He was allowed on the moors to sniff instead of being shut in the house and every walk we did I would say to him it's another walk closer to normality, it must feel good. Then for this to happen is so cruel.

The vet said he was completely unconscious when she arrived but he had been fitting for over an hour by then and continued to do so for the 30 minutes or so she was giving him medication, with no change at all.

Alec it was my poor wording, he wasn't aggressive in any way but the fitting itself was, not just twitching but very violent. We have wooden floors and he was frothing so much that I could hardly stand up as it was so slippery there was that much froth, I first thought this was why he couldn't stand because he couldn't grip but it was actually that he couldn't use his back end. Initially his mouth was clenched but at some point this changed as he was panting with his mouth open. I would say he was unconscious throughout as he seemed to have no idea I was there or trying to help him, I was trying to wet a towel and put it on his mouth but he had no idea I was doing so. When the vet came we put wet towels and ice packs on his body but he didn't know we were doing it.

I would say he was asleep when it started because there was no vocal sound, it was the banging of his feet on the floor that woke me so I am hoping he fell unconscious in his sleep.

The vet did say that to fit for so long was something she had never been aware of but other than that I didn't ask her anything, I think I was just in shock and was trying to hold him and comfort our other dog who was understandably distressed.

Dobiegirl I think it will be too late for a PM as I just asked for him to be cremated so we can have his ashes back, to be honest I didn't really want to know at the time as it wouldn't bring him back but now I am wondering if I missed any signs so I would like to know what caused it to know if I could have prevented it.

Alec are you saying we don't really know why these seizures happen, that there is no conclusive evidence as to why - so even if I could have had a PM I might not get a definitive answer?

Equi I wonder what could be infected though? Wouldn't there have been signs of an infection severe enough to cause such a massive fit?
 
Fits can be caused by a brain tumour or liver dysfunction. They can also happen for no reason and just suddenly come out of the blue with no warning.

Dogs that are epileptic can have triggers, things like stress can certainly cause them to have a seizure.

I think it may help you to talk to the vet that came out to your boy. They are unlikely to be able to tell you what caused the fit but will help to put your mind at rest. If it helps in anyway I've been a vet nurse now for 23yrs and cases of status epilepticus (prolonged seizures) don't have good outcomes.

I'm very sorry xx
 
sonjafoers said:
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Alec are you saying we don't really know why these seizures happen, that there is no conclusive evidence as to why - so even if I could have had a PM I might not get a definitive answer?

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Yes, sadly, that's exactly what I'm saying. Another question, was he during his fitting displaying any form of 'straining'? By straining, I mean was he going through convulsions, and 'stretching' himself, or were his movements more of a 'paddling' nature, with the fits being more as 'tremors'? Descriptive words aren't that easy to find, so I apologise if I'm being clumsy.

Alec.
 
Supertrooper said:
……..

I think it may help you to talk to the vet that came out to your boy. They are unlikely to be able to tell you what caused the fit but will help to put your mind at rest. If it helps in anyway I've been a vet nurse now for 23yrs and cases of status epilepticus (prolonged seizures) don't have good outcomes.

……..
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I'm sorry, I missed your post as I was typing. Would Epilepsy in dogs bring about fitting for such a prolonged period? I've never had or seen a dog with Epilepsy, but I have seen people, and their 'attack' never seems to last more than a few minutes. I'm asking out of interest.

Alec.
 
Santa's-a-scam said:
I'm sorry, I missed your post as I was typing. Would Epilepsy in dogs bring about fitting for such a prolonged period? I've never had or seen a dog with Epilepsy, but I have seen people, and their 'attack' never seems to last more than a few minutes. I'm asking out of interest.

Alec.
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yes they can, I have witnessed prolonged epileptic siezures that have only come under control with drugs and reduce stimulation and even then sometimes when the drugs wear off it all starts again or light or noise can set it off-it can take a fair amount (hours) of time to bring an episode under control
 
twiggy2 said:
yes they can, I have witnessed prolonged epileptic siezures that have only come under control with drugs and reduce stimulation and even then sometimes when the drugs wear off it all starts again or light or noise can set it off-it can take a fair amount (hours) of time to bring an episode under control
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Thank you. I suppose that with humans, and assuming that the patient had already been diagnosed, then as they'd be on permanent medication, the effects of the fitting wouldn't perhaps be quite so prolonged or intense.

Another question, would canine epilepsy be likely to start it's influence in an adult dog?

Alec.
 
I am so sorry, how awful for you. I had something similar in a GSD bitch many years ago, although from your description she was nothing like as bad, just collapsed and started paddling. She spent 24 hours anaesthetised at the vets and did come out of it and never had another seizure. My vet at the time attributed it to barbiturate poisoning, as far as we knew the only possible source could have been the raw tripe we fed at the time. This came from a slaughterhouse that killed for human consumption so it does seem unlikely an animal got into the system that had been medicated.
That probably doesn't give you answers for your lad I know. As suggested I think the best thing would be to talk to the vet.
 
Santa's-a-scam said:
Thank you. I suppose that with humans, and assuming that the patient had already been diagnosed, then as they'd be on permanent medication, the effects of the fitting wouldn't perhaps be quite so prolonged or intense.

Another question, would canine epilepsy be likely to start it's influence in an adult dog?

Alec.
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it is usually first diagnosed in young adult dogs, I think the usual age range is 1-2yrs but it can occur outside that age range too
 
Thank you for your replies everybody, he was never diagnosed as epileptic and this was his only seizure so I guess I will never know. I will talk to my vet when I go to collect his ashes as he will have received the notes by then and will chat things through with me.
 
Yes Alec they can have prolonged seizures, it's rare but we have certainly had dogs that we've had to give continuous medication too or anaesthetic to suppress the seizures.

I've seen epilepsy start at any age from around 1-2yrs xx
 
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