What diagnostic tools are there for poss back probs?

Angelbones

Angelbones

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A bit of an all encompassing title but what I mean is:

My horse has started to buck - never done this before other than the odd 'yippee' out hunting which was never unseating. He's now had 3 of us off over the past week.

Assuming saddle is correct (it has been checked recently) and I know his teeth are ok, and his diet is non heating (mainly roughage due to gastric ulcers for which he is on Gastroguard) and he has a good daily routine / management. He is regularly seen by a physio and there has never been an issue with his back

He's had Gastroguard before and we saw an improvement in his crabby personality within about 4 days and he stayed for several months. This time he is more crabby and his mood hasn't changed after 2 weeks of treatment.

So I'm wondering if he is bucking due to pain (not related to ulcers) and if so then what tests can be done to see if there is a problem? Xrays of the spine? Some sort of test to see if there is a trapped nerve?

He had a bone scan over a year ago when we had problems with his performance, concentrating mostly on his SI area which came back fine and they also did his hocks, both fine. I'm not sure whether they looked further forward up his back, but will ring RVC to see if they can tell me. This time it turned out to be 100% saddle related - but that's another long story (which ended in court!)

Basically I am nearing my limit with my horse who I did love but now don't want to get on. I have insurance so can pursue the issues but wanted pointers from anyone as to what may be available options?

Many thanks chaps :)
 
xrays, ultrasound - very under used...., bone scan and mri, depends where you want to start really.

There is a lot of research into back diagnositics, especially using readily available and cheap imaging modalities such as ultrasound scanning and xrays. We are diagnosing a lot more in our clinic with odd angles and using a probe for the scanner which has a smaller head and different frequency. Ligament and soft tissue injuries are frequently missed....

Hope that lends some encouragement.
Imogen
 
That's interesting Imogen.
My vet has offered a bone scan as the only option for trying to diagnose a back problem.
He said you 'could get lucky' with x-rays but it really is pot luck if you find something.
This is a well known equine specialist practice.
 
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foxy1 said:
That's interesting Imogen.
My vet has offered a bone scan as the only option for trying to diagnose a back problem.
He said you 'could get lucky' with x-rays but it really is pot luck if you find something.
This is a well known equine specialist practise.
Click to expand...

Yes, I used to feel the same way,but recently one of my collegues who is studying for his diploma in orthopedics went to attend a back course in the USA with the God of backs and learnt all sorts of handy info....now we are better!

Angle of the xrays can be varied greatly to show up the facet joints (previously not imaged or assessed) which is where arthritic change commonly happens and coincidentally where the nerve roots emerge! Plus the scans diagnosis supraspinous and interspinous lig damage and a strains...actually v commonly missed injuries. Also multifidous muscle injury which is very important in stability of the spine.

We diagnose a lot of stuff we never would have even a year ago....that makes us (and I hope my clients and their horses) very happy bunnies!!
 
Ah I see!

He also said the type of thing he would be likely to find wouldn't be easy to treat if at all treatable so not to bother (with the bone scan)

Would you agree?!
 
foxy1 said:
Ah I see!

He also said the type of thing he would be likely to find wouldn't be easy to treat if at all treatable so not to bother (with the bone scan)

Would you agree?!
Click to expand...

I used to :( but now NO! :D

We treat these very successfully with a combination of medication, physio and saddlery checks!! ;) Even shockwave can help!

Having a knowledgeable and proactive vet friendly physio is as important as a knowledgeable, proactive and physio friendly vet!! A lot can be treated.
 
quite agree with Imogen about
'Having a knowledgeable and proactive vet friendly physio is as important as a knowledgeable, proactive and physio friendly vet!! A lot can be treated'

Mine was diagnosed with facet joint DJD and lig damage by x ray and ultarsound which was good as because of insurace issues bone scan was not really an issue. with treatment we have made some positive steps forwards still a work in progress but looking good. She was medicated into the joints (using ultra sound) and also the spaces between the processes.
good luck
 
My boy had a spat like yours and after having many things checked my vet, equine touch lady and on site physio all thought that water treadmill treatment would help him, and it did he had bad muscle damage and using them was sometimes painful. I have never (touch wood) had a problem since. I rode him in an abbott Davis for months after to help him use his topline and when he's had time off, it's used for a couple of sessions to remind him, (also they can't buck in an abbott!) not sure if this is any help :s x
 
i would have his x-rayed to be on the safe side. My horse's bucking got worse and worse and they got bigger and bigger! we eventually took him to the vets with a lamness and he was diagnosed with kissing spine.

The vet did like a flex text along his back which you could mabey try at home.

He used the end of his pen and ran it down his neck across his back and right over his rump. The idea is that the horse flexes his back so he hollows when you run it over his back then when you run it over his rump he lifts his back. You do this on both sides my horse reponded on one side and hardly moved on the other.

Im no vet buit this is just what iv pick up from when iv taken my horse. that a healthy back they should show a big reaction they should lift their back well when you run the pen over his rump but if they dont then theirs a problem

i hope this makes sense
 
katy1986 said:
i would have his x-rayed to be on the safe side. My horse's bucking got worse and worse and they got bigger and bigger! we eventually took him to the vets with a lamness and he was diagnosed with kissing spine.

The vet did like a flex text along his back which you could mabey try at home.

He used the end of his pen and ran it down his neck across his back and right over his rump. The idea is that the horse flexes his back so he hollows when you run it over his back then when you run it over his rump he lifts his back. You do this on both sides my horse reponded on one side and hardly moved on the other.

Im no vet buit this is just what iv pick up from when iv taken my horse. that a healthy back they should show a big reaction they should lift their back well when you run the pen over his rump but if they dont then theirs a problem

i hope this makes sense
Click to expand...

This technique used to be used a lot - by me too! I have subsequently been taught that digital palpation is all that should be necessary (i.e. use you finger tips only!!):p

Imagine how you'd react to a pen pressure - it's pretty severe actually. I've had perfectly good response from finger pressure and it's ruled out a lot of the false positive responses I have seen using the pen...
(and besides I'm not about to argue with the equine back god - Jean-Marie Denoix!):D
 
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