What do you consider hard work?

Travel is physical work bracing and standing unable to move freely is a physical demand .
Going to shows is mental work and exhausts many when young its a mistake not factor this in when taking desisions about giving breaks .
As with anything with horses you need to be managing each horse watching and feeling how it's coping .
 
Goldenstar said:
Another thing to consider is how hard the horse finds the type of work it's doing for instance a heavy cob carrying a heavy rider will find a hard days in mud hunting harder work than a bred for purpose hunter carrying a fit light young person .
But the cob might find pulling a carriage easier ( I drive so that not intended as a cobbist remark.)
J my national hunt bred TB will gallop up hill all day with easy and grace Fatty an ID has to work harder at it but on a day where stamina and the sheer ability to keep going comes into play Fatty will do better part of that is stamina as fatty is older . .
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Comparing my current horse to the last one... the current one is a 15hh big pony/ little horse, probably connie x with maybe cob, and I'm becoming increasingly convinced he has some NF in too. The last one was a 17hh IDxTB, on the lighter side. The latter needed barely any work to keep fit. He could do a days hunting once every 10-14 days easily, didn't ever tire physically, though he would tire mentally towards the end of the day. He was fit enough for it with just hacking and a canter once a week, and would have completed a XC round without even getting out of breath. The current one just finds it all a bit harder. I assume it's because he is a pony/ native type, but he does find the fast work more difficult. He is harder to get fit and keep fit, and he tires more easily. That said, maybe age and strength has something to do with it as he's only been in "proper" work (schooling, jumping etc) for 18 months. The last one would stay up front out hunting all day. The little one burns out after a couple of hours.

So I think that type must play a part.
 
chestnut cob said:
Travelling doesn't count. Even when you are at a show, you are probably only jumping a couple of rounds (I'd imagine), so basically an hour's work if you include warm up, as the round itself will only be about 90sec-ish?
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Travelling does count - maybe not in work load but if you add that to the work the horse does when they get there they will tire quicker if they have travelled more than accustomed to. if they arrive to an event within 15 mins they will work longer and harder than travelling to a place that takes 4 hours.

For example, I mentioned travelling to Pc champs which takes us a minimum of 6 hours (and a lot quicker than it used to be!) including ferry. As a guide, we are recommended to arrive at least a day before to allow the horse to recover. When I first went to champs at sansaw it took just over 10 hours after getting off the ferry of 3 hours. That took a lot more out of them than now.

I wouldn't think of a summer camp of an hour jumping and an hour xc a day hard work, as that is the total time and not at competition.

Think of an eventer, who may only spend 5 mins in dressage ring but could have been warmed up for a hour beforehand, jumps 2 minutes in the SJ but could have been out 40mins before jumping and then 5-6 mins xc at gallop (say 1* speed) but again could have been out 30mins before hand.
Then add in the travel time to get there and then return home and suddenly it turns into quite a long day for the horse.

A racehorse only gallops for say 5 minutes and has a limited warm up but we all agree they are in hard work? Different jobs different expectations!
 
I would say Medium Work. My daugters horses/ponies Compete jumping once/twice a week, school for a hr twice a week, Dressage lesson once a week and long hack inc canter hillwork once a week. They all live live 24/7 except for night before competing on sat or sun. They have one day off. If daughters are busy I lunge instead on the days they are supposed to be schooled and they have a couple of horsey friends who help out with hacking and schooling as they don't have horses of their own.

Our are in as hard work as time and resources will allow but still compared to racehorses / competition horses still only medium work.
 
I think there is a certain amount of relativity involved. As if a horse that is ridden 5/6 times a week is in light to medium work, what is the one that is hacked once or twice a week. I don't think light/medium/hard quite covers it or whether it really matters so long as they are fit enough and fed enough to do what you expect of them.
 
only_me said:
Travelling does count - maybe not in work load but if you add that to the work the horse does when they get there they will tire quicker if they have travelled more than accustomed to. if they arrive to an event within 15 mins they will work longer and harder than travelling to a place that takes 4 hours.

For example, I mentioned travelling to Pc champs which takes us a minimum of 6 hours (and a lot quicker than it used to be!) including ferry. As a guide, we are recommended to arrive at least a day before to allow the horse to recover. When I first went to champs at sansaw it took just over 10 hours after getting off the ferry of 3 hours. That took a lot more out of them than now.
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TBF when you put it like that, I agree and stand corrected :)

I wouldn't think of a summer camp of an hour jumping and an hour xc a day hard work, as that is the total time and not at competition.
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I didn't say the work at camp constituted hard work. I said for mine it was at best medium work.

Think of an eventer, who may only spend 5 mins in dressage ring but could have been warmed up for a hour beforehand, jumps 2 minutes in the SJ but could have been out 40mins before jumping and then 5-6 mins xc at gallop (say 1* speed) but again could have been out 30mins before hand.
Then add in the travel time to get there and then return home and suddenly it turns into quite a long day for the horse.
I know. This is what mine was doing in the summer. A couple of hour's travel to an event, DR warmup and test, SJ warmup and test, then XC warmup and round. That follows my comments in previous post above about how I found it difficult to get mine fit enough, compared to my last horse with plenty of TB in who just seemed to stay fit all the time. I know how tiring mine found doing some events in the summer, and compare that to taking him to do a couple of SJ rounds, it was totally different.

A racehorse only gallops for say 5 minutes and has a limited warm up but we all agree they are in hard work? Different jobs different expectations!
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But I wonder if that is because the every day work a racehorse does is pretty hard too? I kept my last horse on a pre-training yard for a while and even the babies who are training were working harder than the majority of the leisure horses on the yard. Canter work most days plus hacking and jumping. I suppose it's a bit like a person going running and working hard, aerobically and physically, every single day.
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One thing that hasn't been considered so far is "working" horses at riding centres. How would you class those?

Where I work in the summer, the most popular horses tend to be working 3 hours in the morning and the same in the evening. Now granted, they aren't working "correctly" and the majority of the work is in the school at walk, or hacking in walk with stretches of trot and canter in very hilly terrain. They generally have one day a week off if we could afford not to use them. However it was more likely they would only have a half day. (clearly, they were fed and shod according to their workload and fittened properly. They also only work at that intensity for approximately 3 months of the year, with 6 months of lighter work and 3 months off entirely.)

I would class this as hard work!

Some of the less popular horses were in medium work and some were in light work - it tended to be that the horses for more advanced riders were in lighter work as we didn't get that many people capable of riding them... the catch 22 is that this gave these horses more energy and made them need even more experienced riders! Therefore ride leaders almost always took out the horses that had had the least work that week, so the horses in light work were probably still doing a total of 5-8 hours a week, however it sometimes transpired that this would be on 2 days only.
 
E_Lister said:
One thing that hasn't been considered so far is "working" horses at riding centres. How would you class those?

Where I work in the summer, the most popular horses tend to be working 3 hours in the morning and the same in the evening. Now granted, they aren't working "correctly" and the majority of the work is in the school at walk, or hacking in walk with stretches of trot and canter in very hilly terrain. They generally have one day a week off if we could afford not to use them. However it was more likely they would only have a half day. (clearly, they were fed and shod according to their workload and fittened properly. They also only work at that intensity for approximately 3 months of the year, with 6 months of lighter work and 3 months off entirely.)

I would class this as hard work!

Some of the less popular horses were in medium work and some were in light work - it tended to be that the horses for more advanced riders were in lighter work as we didn't get that many people capable of riding them... the catch 22 is that this gave these horses more energy and made them need even more experienced riders! Therefore ride leaders almost always took out the horses that had had the least work that week, so the horses in light work were probably still doing a total of 5-8 hours a week, however it sometimes transpired that this would be on 2 days only.
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I was just about to say the same thing! When I was younger we would think nothing of hacking a good 40 mins plus to pony club or a show doing a few classes and then hacking back again on the school horses. They were very fit stamina wise. Another yard the popular ponies would easily do 3-4 hours hill work a day or 2 hours plus a jumping lesson with the stages students. These horses were all fed barelky anything compared to most leisure horses I know, they were mostly natives and they thrived!
I do think we overfeed massively for the work done, when I worked in Spain only 6 horses of the 40 were fed any hard feed and this included trekking ponies, jumping ponies and showjumpers competeing in 1.20-30s all were in good comdition and had at least 12 hours turnout if not 24/7 the grazing was very good though lots of varied meadow grasses and hedgerows (north west Spain).
 
ester said:
I think there is a certain amount of relativity involved. As if a horse that is ridden 5/6 times a week is in light to medium work, what is the one that is hacked once or twice a week. I don't think light/medium/hard quite covers it or whether it really matters so long as they are fit enough and fed enough to do what you expect of them.
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Exactly what i was thinking to people saying they would class mine in light to medium, i have definitely decided mine are in medium work but to the harder end of it, plus i never said mine were in hard work i think i'm sure i said reasonably hard work. To me hacking with a little bit of schooling and the odd show here and there is classed as light work.
People say going in a ring for 90secs isn't hard work but i dont know how you can say jumping 10-12 fences between 1.20-1.30 plus a jump off if you get in is'nt hard work on the horses? And travelling is definitely a factor i would say.
 
Kal is schooled (on average) four days a week (flatwork and jumping), hacks once a week, is lunged once a week and probably competes (dressage, jumping, ODE (in season)) twice a month. He also hunts (in season) once every two weeks or so. I would say that qualifies as medium work (for what is essentially a leisure horse). If you measured his workload against a professional racehorse/event horse/SJer/endurance/polo pony, you'd say it was light to medium.

Don't forget that travelling is work for horses . . . the farthest we travel is just over an hour . . . pro horses travel much further and do regular plane and ferry journeys.

P
 
I would say mine are worked harder in the summer definitely as we travel to alot of shows down south with my boss quite alot so i take that into consideration when thinking about there work load, normally they have 2/3 weeks off this time of year but with having an easy summer this year i haven't bothered, but would still say they are in a reasonable amount of work with the furthest venue being 2 hours.
When i was writing the post i wasn't wanting people to comapre with professionals, i was just curious on what they would consider there routine with there own horses in whatever disipline to be whether is be light/medium/hard.
Wasn't quite expecting to be bombarded with people telling me that my horses are in light to medium or medium work. I said reasonably hard work and i still don't think i'm overly wrong, they do work hard, not hard as in they are ridden to being knackered every day but they do have a busy schedule!
 
Hard work is racehorses, three day eventers, hunters hunting twice a week, top level dr/sj, polo.

Medium work is novice eventing, regular hunting, medium dressage, fox hunter bs etc. I would also include trekking centre/riding school horses here for sheer hours of work without much rider help.

Light work is everything below. Now you have light hacking, and light schooling, or combination of both, but it's still light.

My horse is usually ridden 5-6 times a week, either schooled for an hour on the flat (working novice), jumped for forty minutes (90cm or so), or hacked out for 1.5-2 hours mostly at trot and canter, and lots of hill work. He also boxes out to lessons three to four times a month, has lessons at home once a fortnight, and competes probably once a month on average either low level unaff dr, sj or in summer ht. This is to me light work - more work than a twice a week hack for sure, and the hardest worker on y current yard, but just because other people don't work their horses as much doesn't mean his workload is higher - he is still in light work!

I feed him for medium work as he is a poor doer, but I'm under no illusions he does that.
 
sam_ said:
I would say mine are worked harder in the summer definitely as we travel to alot of shows down south with my boss quite alot so i take that into consideration when thinking about there work load, normally they have 2/3 weeks off this time of year but with having an easy summer this year i haven't bothered, but would still say they are in a reasonable amount of work with the furthest venue being 2 hours.
When i was writing the post i wasn't wanting people to comapre with professionals, i was just curious on what they would consider there routine with there own horses in whatever disipline to be whether is be light/medium/hard.
Wasn't quite expecting to be bombarded with people telling me that my horses are in light to medium or medium work. I said reasonably hard work and i still don't think i'm overly wrong, they do work hard, not hard as in they are ridden to being knackered every day but they do have a busy schedule!
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Then why did you ask the question? I must admit to being a tad confused . . .

P
 
Far from being knackered everyday I have found horses to be highly adaptable when fit if the wrok load is increased I consider 40 mins of elementary level schooling hard work for me as I am unfit and unused to it at the moment. Just because people consider it hard work doesn't mean it is though, I agree it is quite complicated when you consider what is mentally/ physically tiring what muscles are being used and how much, is it stamina or gymnastically challenging but I still wouldn't consider what you propose as medium/hard work (especially when they are staionary for the most part when stabled).
 
khalswitz said:
Hard work is racehorses, three day eventers, hunters hunting twice a week, top level dr/sj, polo.

Medium work is novice eventing, regular hunting, medium dressage, fox hunter bs etc. I would also include trekking centre/riding school horses here for sheer hours of work without much rider help.

Light work is everything below. Now you have light hacking, and light schooling, or combination of both, but it's still light.
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I totally agree with this ^^ I do still say that mine work at the harder end of the medium scale though! :)
 
PolarSkye said:
Then why did you ask the question? I must admit to being a tad confused . . .

P
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I didn't ask what they thought my horses workload is classed as, was just giving my opinion and was curious on other peoples workload with there own horses and what they would class it as. Just interesting to see how peoples opinions differ on the matter that is all.
 
Ah, remembered what my old school instructor called the step below light work - OCCASIONAL WORK. So a twice a week hack is in occasional work, someone hacking/schooling up to 5 times a week low intensity is still light work.
 
I wouldn't say what your horses are doing is much different form the average horse I know, therefore I'd say medium. At the various yards there are horses hunted twice a week all season so are hard working, then there are horses and ponies like mine who are youngsters or retired so are doing nothing. The 'average' is turned out at least during the day, ridden at least 6 days a week with a mixture of hacking, schooling and lessons and then out and about doing something every weekend all year round with probably longer/more intense sessions in Spring & Summer.
 
Cloball said:
Far from being knackered everyday I have found horses to be highly adaptable when fit if the wrok load is increased I consider 40 mins of elementary level schooling hard work for me as I am unfit and unused to it at the moment. Just because people consider it hard work doesn't mean it is though, I agree it is quite complicated when you consider what is mentally/ physically tiring what muscles are being used and how much, is it stamina or gymnastically challenging but I still wouldn't consider what you propose as medium/hard work (especially when they are staionary for the most part when stabled).
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Yes of course, i know this, i can come out of the school needing a wash down and a cooler more than my horses do at times! I just class it as medium/hard work as it takes alot to keep them at the fitness levels needed to be going and doing what they are doing, yes it is not as strenuous as 3 day eventers, racehorses i agree with that whole-heartedly, but i still consider showjumpers have a full on hard working life. Maybe i'm just biased because thats what i do and you see injuries occuring when horses are not at fitness/strength levels to cope with it.
 
It is amazing how people's views differ so much. My horse was worked 6 times a week including flatwork, jump, lunge, hack and usually boxed out to a comp or lesson once a week. Usually 40 mins - 1 hour of work a day. I would say that's medium work, if that, but it was much more than anyone else on my yard. Poor pony is lame at the mo and I've heard yard mutterings that it's unsurprising given how much hard work I made her do :-(
 
khalswitz said:
Harder end of medium? So as a show jumper I'm assuming you're jumping 1.30/1.35? Considering foxhunter is the lowest level of SJ I'd consider being medium work?
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They are both jumping fox's but one has just started jumping 1.30's, hoping to get last fox double clear this weekend! My other one's limit will prob be 1.20/25's he's better at the speed classes!
 
khalswitz said:
Hard work is racehorses, three day eventers, hunters hunting twice a week, top level dr/sj, polo.

Medium work is novice eventing, regular hunting, medium dressage, fox hunter bs etc. I would also include trekking centre/riding school horses here for sheer hours of work without much rider help.

Light work is everything below. Now you have light hacking, and light schooling, or combination of both, but it's still light.
.
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This.

Just because your horse is ridden every day, does not mean it is in hard work.
 
Ansiscool said:
It is amazing how people's views differ so much. My horse was worked 6 times a week including flatwork, jump, lunge, hack and usually boxed out to a comp or lesson once a week. Usually 40 mins - 1 hour of work a day. I would say that's medium work, if that, but it was much more than anyone else on my yard. Poor pony is lame at the mo and I've heard yard mutterings that it's unsurprising given how much hard work I made her do :-(
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Yes it really is! I wouldn't listen to the mutterings personally, the yard i'm at the moment i have had the same with people saying i work my horses too much, clearly not, i should make them read this then they will realise i'm actually quite a normal workload and theres would be classed as occasional/light work!
 
sam_ said:
Yes it really is! I wouldn't listen to the mutterings personally, the yard i'm at the moment i have had the same with people saying i work my horses too much, clearly not, i should make them read this then they will realise i'm actually quite a normal workload and theres would be classed as occasional/light work!
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A couple of years ago, when I has my last horse (was a 17hh IDxTB, v good doer), I had these sorts of snarky remarks you mention sam_. I had him hunting every 10-14 days, he kept up no problem, was schooling 1x week, lungeing/ LR once a week and hacking the other days. Hacks would be 1-2 hours, marching out and working properly, including trot and canter work. I was told by one livery that he was too thin, being worked too hard (this from someone whose horses were obese, with bellies down to their knees), and it was cruel to hunt him on just chaff. He thrived on it, and I would always rather have my horse a bit lean than the other way. He was the only horse on the yard actually doing a job rather than pottering around the short block for 20 mins, and getting 20 mins in the arena a couple of times if they were lucky...
 
chestnut cob said:
A couple of years ago, when I has my last horse (was a 17hh IDxTB, v good doer), I had these sorts of snarky remarks you mention sam_. I had him hunting every 10-14 days, he kept up no problem, was schooling 1x week, lungeing/ LR once a week and hacking the other days. Hacks would be 1-2 hours, marching out and working properly, including trot and canter work. I was told by one livery that he was too thin, being worked too hard (this from someone whose horses were obese, with bellies down to their knees), and it was cruel to hunt him on just chaff. He thrived on it, and I would always rather have my horse a bit lean than the other way. He was the only horse on the yard actually doing a job rather than pottering around the short block for 20 mins, and getting 20 mins in the arena a couple of times if they were lucky...
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I'm glad you said this, it is awful at some yards, so much b****ing and everyone seems to have an opinion on how you should do this, that and the next thing and like you i am the only one there that is doing a job with them but yet they know best and again like you half the people that have an opinion there horses are disgutingly obese and unfit! Its an interesting subject when coming to feeding also, one of mine isn't a good doer in winter and you would think i'm feeding a racehorse(maybe slight exxageration!) to keep the condition on yet my other horse thrives on chaff and sugerbeet and looks a million dollars and they are basically in same amount of work. One livery the other night was making feeds up at the same time and just looked over and said 'is that all he gets' so i now starve my horse because he's not obese!
 
Most riding/lunging/whatever under an hours duration that doesn't cause a horse to sweat is just exercise. Horses in proper work would need a minimum of an hours exercise plus a work session on top; the exercise could be hacking, a session on the walker or light lunging, etc. Work might be canter, gallop, plus schooling lateral movements, flying changes, some very collected stuff. Whenever I have to get horses ready for proper work they will go out twice a day for over an hour each time, and be worked until they sweat. When they are working (display/stunt horses) they will probably be out for 7 - 10 hours, but not working the whole time.

The vast majority of horses in leisure ownership today are barely exercised, if they are lucky.
 
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I'd not met many leisure horses until I came back to riding in my thirties after a break - before that, as a horseless young person, I'd only really been involved in a private 'riding school' that also took hunter liveries and then doing hunters and keeping ponies fit for local families while the kids were at boarding school - that kind of thing. Plus a stint on an event yard and a couple of seasons helping prepare a horse for the Golden Horseshoe. Fit horses were a completely normal thing to me and it was a bit of a surprise to meet so many horses who hardly did anything and so many owners who had only the sketchiest idea of methodically getting horses fit for a job. The two worlds are poles apart, I think (with the inevitable exceptions, before I get jumped on), and the one can't conceive of the other...
 
Burnttoast said:
I'd not met many leisure horses until I came back to riding in my thirties after a break - before that, as a horseless young person, I'd only really been involved in a private 'riding school' that also took hunter liveries and then doing hunters and keeping ponies fit for local families while the kids were at boarding school - that kind of thing. Plus a stint on an event yard and a couple of seasons helping prepare a horse for the Golden Horseshoe. Fit horses were a completely normal thing to me and it was a bit of a surprise to meet so many horses who hardly did anything and so many owners who had only the sketchiest idea of methodically getting horses fit for a job. The two worlds are poles apart, I think (with the inevitable exceptions, before I get jumped on), and the one can't conceive of the other...
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THIS THIS THIS. Drives me nuts that my friends think I work my horse too hard. They're like, he should be getting more days off/he's sweating too much, you should tone it down /isn't he due a holiday. I'm like, he's in light work, honey, your horse just does nothing.
 
khalswitz said:
THIS THIS THIS. Drives me nuts that my friends think I work my horse too hard. They're like, he should be getting more days off/he's sweating too much, you should tone it down /isn't he due a holiday. I'm like, he's in light work, honey, your horse just does nothing.
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I used to get this from the girls at school when I was running, being sweaty is a crime apparently :p Horses need to be fit in order to do the work we want them to do without injury just like people do and fitness requires regular activity and maintenance (depending on breed of horse) but then I love being geeky and working on fitness and training schedules, muscle groups, heart rate, stretching etc. people and horses ;)
 
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