What happens to ex harness racers?

[Glitter's fun]

All this talk of ex racing TBs made me wonder.

There must be hundreds of them out there but I see very few ex harness racers advertised. Do they mostly get PTS? Are there specific charities that take them, like there are for greyhounds?

Whenever there's a thread on "what lives longest", "what has the best temperament", Standardbreds always get a mention but there doesn't seem to be a 'conveyor belt' to put them into homes. Are they too difficult to retrain?

(I'm not in the market for one - I don't have the facilities for wholesale re-schooling now. Just interested.)

 

[Kaylum]

Trotters are crossed with everything these days, more of cross with whatever they can find. If you mean where are the rehab charities for trotters it doesn't work like that it's a totally different world.

 

[webble]

This . A lot get sold on as riding horses, especially for endurance, many end up in the wrong hands. There are a couple of Facebook groups for them. It depends if you're talking nicely bred track raced on gypsy bred road raced too I guess

 

[Glitter's fun]

Trotters are crossed with everything these days, more of cross with whatever they can find. If you mean where are the rehab charities for trotters it doesn't work like that it's a totally different world.

Yes, I did mean that. I used to work with greyhounds & wondered if it was the same.
Thank you for the reply.

 

[Orangehorse]

I think quite a few in Wales end up as riding horses.

 

[Glitter's fun]

We seem very different from other countries where harness racing is popular. Australia has official procedures for retirement & rehoming, including that you have to officially notify HRA when a horse retires or dies, so it doesn't just disappear off the books. USA has a statutory maximum retirement age (14 I think) & rehoming charities. Interesting that we seem to have a lot less regulation. I'm surprised. I'd have said we were a high regulation country when it comes to animals. *

*Based on farming, where if my cow farts I have to fill a form in.

 

[webble]

You have to fill the form in before the cow even thinks about farting!!

I think there is a bit of a stigma around harness racing in the UK and many think of horses being racing up and down the roads rather than proper racetracks. When anyone asks my horses breed I airways feel like I have to justify him by saying he is well bred

 

[silv]

Sadly in NZ hundreds go to the meatworks, there are rehoming charities and lots go to private homes via trainers, owners etc but many are not so lucky. Just not enough homes for them unfortunately. Same with TB's.

 

[Glitter's fun]

Sadly in NZ hundreds go to the meatworks, there are rehoming charities and lots go to private homes via trainers, owners etc but many are not so lucky. Just not enough homes for them unfortunately. Same with TB's.

Actually I have to say if it's well supervised and kindly done there are a lot worse things that could happen to them.

 

[windswoo]

Many years ago I worked on a small harness racing yard and all the horses that were owned by the trainer were broken to ride, with half of their exercise work done under saddle. It meant that when they finished their career they had a good chance of being sold on as decent riding horses (they were all bomb proof on the roads). All the horses were pacers (not trotters), but under saddle they trotted and cantered like "normal" horses. The horses owned by other owners weren't traditionally backed, so it was less clear where they went.

 

[Kunoichi73]

My riding school had one on working livery for a while. He was fairly young (4 or 5 ish I think) and had been raced too young. He had the start of arthritis in his back legs from what I was told. I quite liked him, even though he was interesting to ride. He hadn't quite mastered having 4 legs! Trot to canter was interesting as he'd often try pacing. They were taking it easy with him, limited lessons and only certain people riding him. Lessons were often just as much about teaching him as about the rider

 

[FinnishLapphund]

In Sweden trotting is a way bigger sport than racing with Thoroughbreds. Some Swedish Trotters/Standardbreds competes in both trotting, and monté, so is at least used to having someone on their back. Not many, but a few trainers uses normal riding as part of their training.
Lots of Swedish trotters goes on to become riding horses, after that their careers as harness racers are over. But I've also heard that there's e.g. a four-in-hand driver (I don't think he was Swedish) who used ex trotters especially for indoor competitions.


In case someone haven't seen monté, to get one with English commentator, I've found this example from USA:

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

In Sweden trotting is a way bigger sport than racing with Thoroughbreds. Some Swedish Trotters/Standardbreds competes in both trotting, and monté, so is at least used to having someone on their back. Not many, but a few trainers uses normal riding as part of their training.
Lots of Swedish trotters goes on to become riding horses, after that their careers as harness racers are over. But I've also heard that there's e.g. a four-in-hand driver (I don't think he was Swedish) who used ex trotters especially for indoor competitions.


In case someone haven't seen monté, to get one with English commentator, I've found this example from USA:

That just looks damned uncomfortable!

 

[Red-1]

In Sweden trotting is a way bigger sport than racing with Thoroughbreds. Some Swedish Trotters/Standardbreds competes in both trotting, and monté, so is at least used to having someone on their back. Not many, but a few trainers uses normal riding as part of their training.
Lots of Swedish trotters goes on to become riding horses, after that their careers as harness racers are over. But I've also heard that there's e.g. a four-in-hand driver (I don't think he was Swedish) who used ex trotters especially for indoor competitions.


In case someone haven't seen monté, to get one with English commentator, I've found this example from USA:

I have never seen that before. Is there a penalty if they break stride and gallop? What does the speed compare like, compared to gallop?

 

[Glitter's fun]

In Sweden trotting is a way bigger sport than racing with Thoroughbreds. Some Swedish Trotters/Standardbreds competes in both trotting, and monté, so is at least used to having someone on their back. Not many, but a few trainers uses normal riding as part of their training.
Lots of Swedish trotters goes on to become riding horses, after that their careers as harness racers are over. But I've also heard that there's e.g. a four-in-hand driver (I don't think he was Swedish) who used ex trotters especially for indoor competitions.


In case someone haven't seen monté, to get one with English commentator, I've found this example from USA:

Thank you for posting this. It's amazing!

 

[millikins]

I think the increased cost of horses is doing them a favour and raising their profile a little, I certainly see more advertised on "respectable" sites, not just DD. As people are priced out of ISH, some are looking for cheaper alternatives and SB can be very good all rounders even if many wouldn't win a beauty contest.

 

[Dave's Mam]

As a kid, I helped out looking after some racing trotters / pacers near my home.
Track types, not road racers. Oh what gorgeous, kind lovely, horses to deal with. They aren't pretty, but I love their faces, bumpy noses & all. Absolutely love a standie.

 

[Blanche]

Many years ago I worked on a small harness racing yard and all the horses that were owned by the trainer were broken to ride, with half of their exercise work done under saddle. It meant that when they finished their career they had a good chance of being sold on as decent riding horses (they were all bomb proof on the roads). All the horses were pacers (not trotters), but under saddle they trotted and cantered like "normal" horses. The horses owned by other owners weren't traditionally backed, so it was less clear where they went.

I too worked a season with harness racehorses, mainly pacers with a few trotters. Everything was ridden and though the backing process was very quick they were very quiet.( you were legged up in the round pen and if you could trot and stop that was it , off you went. They wore a driving bridle for the first few rides.)

 

[Dave's Mam]

& yes, I should have added that the ones I helped with were ridden too. They really adapted. Saddle on, be a ridden horse. Sulky on, racing horse or training horse.

 

[FinnishLapphund]

I forgot to mention that we also have separate races for cold bloods/North Swedish trotters (the North Swedish horse breed have separated in to 2 breeds, North Swedish horse, and North Swedish trotter). The most famous of them all this far is Järvsöfaks, he became a household name that most Swedes had heard about when he was active, whether they where interested in trotting or not.

In Sweden Standardbred mares are allowed to compete from 2 years of age, and until the year they're 10. Gelding, and stallions are allowed to compete until the year they're 12. Cold bloods, regardless of gender, are allowed to compete from 3 years of age, and until the year they're 15.
Järvsöfaks competed from 1997-2009, and won 201 out of 234 races.

2003, 2004, and 2005 he was voted Horse of the Year, which is usually always won by a Standardbred. He's the only privately owned horse that has been allowed to join, and ride in the front of the Swedish Royal Horse Guard (his trainer who rode him at the event, did his military service in the Royal Horse Guards, so was thereby able to be allowed to ride in their uniform).

Afterwards the public was able to meet Järvsöfaks, and from what I've read, it was one of the most visited Royal Horse Guard parades ever in Sweden.
It was in the national TV news when he died in 2020, 26 years old.

Anyhow, basically, even though our Standardbreds outnumbers the North Swedish trotters, we don't only have off the track Standardbreds in Sweden, we also have off the track North Swedish trotters. Even though it's not likely that any of them will, like Järvsöfaks, be allowed to lead a Royal Horse Guards parade, many of them do go on to be normal riding horses, doing anything from jumping, to western, and working equitation.

 

[FinnishLapphund]

I have never seen that before. Is there a penalty if they break stride and gallop? What does the speed compare like, compared to gallop?

As far as I understand it, Sweden have the same rules for harness racing, and monté.

If a horse gallops more than 2 times in a race, it's disqualified.
If a horse gallops during the first 350 metres of the race, it has to come down to trot again within 150 metres (these distances is due to that horses might be overexcited from the starting procedure), or it becomes disqualified.
If a horse gallops after the first 350 metres, but before the last 100 metres of the race, it must come down to trot within 100 metres, or it becomes disqualified.
If a horse gallops at all within the last 100 metres of a race, it becomes disqualified.
Lastly, a horse is not allowed to gain any advantage in the race by galloping. This rule is why you usually see galloping trotters in a race being pulled up, and sometimes ending up being several horse lengths behind the other horses.


A Standardbred at elite level can trot a race at an average speed of 55 km/h.
In Sweden Thoroughbred races is usually galloped at an average speed above 60 km/h. But note, that's the average speed of a whole race I'm talking about, I've heard that Thoroughbreds can run a lot faster than that, but I'm not sure if that's counted over a whole race, or if that's just the maximum speed they can keep for lets say 400 metres?
It's also fully possible that we simply have far from the fastest Thoroughbreds here in Sweden.

The fastest Standardbred pacers runs faster than trotters, but slower than a Thoroughbred, however I'm crap at math so don't ask me to explain anything about what the different times mean, I'm only quoting what I've read online.

The current record for fastest Standardbred trotter is 1.07,6 by Homicide Hunter, done in a 1609 metres race in USA. According to Wikipedia 1.07,6 = 1:48.4 in the American way to measure this.
The current record holding pacer is Bulldog Hanover, with 1:46.2.

There's clearly a difference, but if that's a few seconds in the way "normal" people measure time, or an enormous amount of seconds, I have no idea.

But I do know that the record for the fastest cold blood trotter is from 2005, when Järvsöfaks, which I mentioned in my reply above, won a 1640 metres race on 1.17,9. No other cold blood trotter have been really close to that time, the closest is the Norwegian Spikeld, who earlier the same year won a race on 1.18,6.
When Spikeld set his record, it meant he was the first cold blood trotter to run a race under 1.20,0. Järvsöfaks had been very close several times, but annoyingly for us Swedes, the Norwegian was the first to actually do it. On the other hand, Järvsöfaks was the first cold blood trotter to run under 1.18,0, and still holds the record.

If anyone wants to see Järvsöfaks record race

I think he was driven quite nicely.


By the way, we also have quite a few amateur trotting races for ponies. There's 2 classes, Kat A = mainly Shetlands, and Kat B = mainly Gotlandsruss. There's races both in harness, and monté. Not sure there's any age restrictions on the ponies, but I know there's rules about the humans.
You're allowed to compete with a Kat A pony in trotting from when you're 8 to 15 years old, and with a Kat B pony from when you're 13 to 25 years old.

Here's a Swedish Monté Championship Kat B video from a few years ago

 

[Red-1]

As far as I understand it, Sweden have the same rules for harness racing, and monté.

If a horse gallops more than 2 times in a race, it's disqualified.
If a horse gallops during the first 350 metres of the race, it has to come down to trot again within 150 metres (these distances is due to that horses might be overexcited from the starting procedure), or it becomes disqualified.
If a horse gallops after the first 350 metres, but before the last 100 metres of the race, it must come down to trot within 100 metres, or it becomes disqualified.
If a horse gallops at all within the last 100 metres of a race, it becomes disqualified.
Lastly, a horse is not allowed to gain any advantage in the race by galloping. This rule is why you usually see galloping trotters in a race being pulled up, and sometimes ending up being several horse lengths behind the other horses.


A Standardbred at elite level can trot a race at an average speed of 55 km/h.
In Sweden Thoroughbred races is usually galloped at an average speed above 60 km/h. But note, that's the average speed of a whole race I'm talking about, I've heard that Thoroughbreds can run a lot faster than that, but I'm not sure if that's counted over a whole race, or if that's just the maximum speed they can keep for lets say 400 metres?

The fastest Standardbred pacers runs faster than trotters, but slower than a Thoroughbred, however I'm crap at math so don't ask me to explain anything about what the different times mean, I'm only quoting what I've read online.

The current record for fastest Standardbred trotter is 1.07,6 by Homicide Hunter, done in a 1609 metres race in USA. According to Wikipedia 1.07,6 = 1:48.4 in the American way to measure this.
The current record holding pacer is Bulldog Hanover, with 1:46.2.

There's clearly a difference, but if that's a few seconds in the way "normal" people measure time, or an enormous amount of seconds, I have no idea.


But I do know that the record for the fastest cold blood trotter is from 2005, when Järvsöfaks, which I mentioned in my reply above, won a 1640 metres race on 1.17,9. No other cold blood trotter have been really close to that time, the closest is the Norwegian Spikeld, who earlier the same year won a race on 1.18,6.
When Spikeld set his record, it meant he was the first cold blood trotter to run a race under 1.20,0. Järvsöfaks had been very close several times, but annoyingly for us Swedes, the Norwegian was the first to actually do it. On the other hand, Järvsöfaks was the first cold blood trotter to run under 1.18,0, and still holds the record.

If anyone wants to see Järvsöfaks record race

I think he was driven quite nicely.


By the way, we also have quite a few amateur trotting races for ponies. There's 2 classes, Kat A = mainly Shetlands, and Kat B = mainly Gotlandsruss. There's races both in harness, and monté. Not sure there's any age restrictions on the ponies, but I know there's rules about the humans.
You're allowed to compete with a Kat A pony in trotting from when you're 8 to 15 years old, and with a Kat B pony from when you're 13 to 25 years old.

Here's a Swedish Monté Championship Kat B video from a few years ago

Thank you for that. Järvsöfaks looks amazing, so smooth and powerful.

I love the look of the harness racing. It just looks right.

The trotting under saddle assaults my senses. I am taken back to when I would ride to bloodhounds way back and a horse would get a silly trot on and I would think, goodness, canter already! It just looks awkward and uncomfortable.

 

[Glitter's fun]

As far as I understand it, Sweden have the same rules for harness racing, and monté.

If a horse gallops more than 2 times in a race, it's disqualified.
If a horse gallops during the first 350 metres of the race, it has to come down to trot again within 150 metres (these distances is due to that horses might be overexcited from the starting procedure), or it becomes disqualified.
If a horse gallops after the first 350 metres, but before the last 100 metres of the race, it must come down to trot within 100 metres, or it becomes disqualified.
If a horse gallops at all within the last 100 metres of a race, it becomes disqualified.
Lastly, a horse is not allowed to gain any advantage in the race by galloping. This rule is why you usually see galloping trotters in a race being pulled up, and sometimes ending up being several horse lengths behind the other horses.


A Standardbred at elite level can trot a race at an average speed of 55 km/h.
In Sweden Thoroughbred races is usually galloped at an average speed above 60 km/h. But note, that's the average speed of a whole race I'm talking about, I've heard that Thoroughbreds can run a lot faster than that, but I'm not sure if that's counted over a whole race, or if that's just the maximum speed they can keep for lets say 400 metres?

The fastest Standardbred pacers runs faster than trotters, but slower than a Thoroughbred, however I'm crap at math so don't ask me to explain anything about what the different times mean, I'm only quoting what I've read online.

The current record for fastest Standardbred trotter is 1.07,6 by Homicide Hunter, done in a 1609 metres race in USA. According to Wikipedia 1.07,6 = 1:48.4 in the American way to measure this.
The current record holding pacer is Bulldog Hanover, with 1:46.2.

There's clearly a difference, but if that's a few seconds in the way "normal" people measure time, or an enormous amount of seconds, I have no idea.


But I do know that the record for the fastest cold blood trotter is from 2005, when Järvsöfaks, which I mentioned in my reply above, won a 1640 metres race on 1.17,9. No other cold blood trotter have been really close to that time, the closest is the Norwegian Spikeld, who earlier the same year won a race on 1.18,6.
When Spikeld set his record, it meant he was the first cold blood trotter to run a race under 1.20,0. Järvsöfaks had been very close several times, but annoyingly for us Swedes, the Norwegian was the first to actually do it. On the other hand, Järvsöfaks was the first cold blood trotter to run under 1.18,0, and still holds the record.

If anyone wants to see Järvsöfaks record race

I think he was driven quite nicely.


By the way, we also have quite a few amateur trotting races for ponies. There's 2 classes, Kat A = mainly Shetlands, and Kat B = mainly Gotlandsruss. There's races both in harness, and monté. Not sure there's any age restrictions on the ponies, but I know there's rules about the humans.
You're allowed to compete with a Kat A pony in trotting from when you're 8 to 15 years old, and with a Kat B pony from when you're 13 to 25 years old.

Here's a Swedish Monté Championship Kat B video from a few years ago

Thank you for your posts that is very interesting. It is lovely to hear about equine sports that are so different from what we have here.

 

[Glitter's fun]

& love the guy at the back playing euphonium while riding!

(Will save that to tell my instructor later this morning. I collect funny tales to distract her when I'm out of breath.)

 

[stangs]

As far as I understand it, Sweden have the same rules for harness racing, and monté.

If a horse gallops more than 2 times in a race, it's disqualified.
If a horse gallops during the first 350 metres of the race, it has to come down to trot again within 150 metres (these distances is due to that horses might be overexcited from the starting procedure), or it becomes disqualified.
If a horse gallops after the first 350 metres, but before the last 100 metres of the race, it must come down to trot within 100 metres, or it becomes disqualified.
If a horse gallops at all within the last 100 metres of a race, it becomes disqualified.
Lastly, a horse is not allowed to gain any advantage in the race by galloping. This rule is why you usually see galloping trotters in a race being pulled up, and sometimes ending up being several horse lengths behind the other horses.


A Standardbred at elite level can trot a race at an average speed of 55 km/h.
In Sweden Thoroughbred races is usually galloped at an average speed above 60 km/h. But note, that's the average speed of a whole race I'm talking about, I've heard that Thoroughbreds can run a lot faster than that, but I'm not sure if that's counted over a whole race, or if that's just the maximum speed they can keep for lets say 400 metres?

The fastest Standardbred pacers runs faster than trotters, but slower than a Thoroughbred, however I'm crap at math so don't ask me to explain anything about what the different times mean, I'm only quoting what I've read online.

The current record for fastest Standardbred trotter is 1.07,6 by Homicide Hunter, done in a 1609 metres race in USA. According to Wikipedia 1.07,6 = 1:48.4 in the American way to measure this.
The current record holding pacer is Bulldog Hanover, with 1:46.2.

There's clearly a difference, but if that's a few seconds in the way "normal" people measure time, or an enormous amount of seconds, I have no idea.


But I do know that the record for the fastest cold blood trotter is from 2005, when Järvsöfaks, which I mentioned in my reply above, won a 1640 metres race on 1.17,9. No other cold blood trotter have been really close to that time, the closest is the Norwegian Spikeld, who earlier the same year won a race on 1.18,6.
When Spikeld set his record, it meant he was the first cold blood trotter to run a race under 1.20,0. Järvsöfaks had been very close several times, but annoyingly for us Swedes, the Norwegian was the first to actually do it. On the other hand, Järvsöfaks was the first cold blood trotter to run under 1.18,0, and still holds the record.

If anyone wants to see Järvsöfaks record race

I think he was driven quite nicely.


By the way, we also have quite a few amateur trotting races for ponies. There's 2 classes, Kat A = mainly Shetlands, and Kat B = mainly Gotlandsruss. There's races both in harness, and monté. Not sure there's any age restrictions on the ponies, but I know there's rules about the humans.
You're allowed to compete with a Kat A pony in trotting from when you're 8 to 15 years old, and with a Kat B pony from when you're 13 to 25 years old.

Here's a Swedish Monté Championship Kat B video from a few years ago

Thank you, very interesting!

I saw a video of a Shetland in a sulky once, looked quite competitive. I’m presuming that was also Sweden then.

Do you have any pacing races in Sweden or is it all trotters?

 

[Gloi]

Many years ago I worked on a small harness racing yard and all the horses that were owned by the trainer were broken to ride, with half of their exercise work done under saddle. It meant that when they finished their career they had a good chance of being sold on as decent riding horses (they were all bomb proof on the roads). All the horses were pacers (not trotters), but under saddle they trotted and cantered like "normal" horses. The horses owned by other owners weren't traditionally backed, so it was less clear where they went.

I do think people in the UK are really missing out by not working on getting a nice four beat riding gait from some of these horses.

 

[silv]

Actually I have to say if it's well supervised and kindly done there are a lot worse things that could happen to them.

Yes I would have to agree, it is such a waste as generally they are very healthy types with great feet and most thrive under one to one care as basically they are pretty kind. Nowadays they are breeding some really lovely ones and are promoting showing with their own classes. Many are absolutely stunning.

 

[stangs]

What I find fascinating about Standies is that, in the UK, everyone also finds gaited breeds so interesting, everyone wants to try riding a Icelandic or Paso Fino, and yet no one wants a pacer.

When I was maybe 8, I rode a Standie off the track that came to my RS. One of my favourite horses that I’ve ever ridden. There’s a picture of little me somewhere with my legs shorter than the saddle panels, and just this humongous trot stride underneath me. Never managed to get him to canter, and never cared about it because his trot was just that fun. He then followed me around the field after the lesson and made me fall very in love with the breed. So now whenever the racing season’s over, I spend hours on DD and FB pages telling myself I’ll buy one eventually.

 

[Widgeon]

Oh what gorgeous, kind lovely, horses to deal with. They aren't pretty, but I love their faces, bumpy noses & all. Absolutely love a standie.

This was my experience when we had one on the RS as a teenager. He probably wasn't conventionally beautiful but I adored him. He would give anything a try and despite essentially being an ex racer who hadn't really been reschooled, he was still safe for a teenager to gallop. He is my "one that got away". I still think about him now :-( I would have another without thinking twice. He lived out with the ponies and was tough as anything.

 

[Glitter's fun]

This was my experience when we had one on the RS as a teenager. He probably wasn't conventionally beautiful but I adored him. He would give anything a try and despite essentially being an ex racer who hadn't really been reschooled, he was still safe for a teenager to gallop. He is my "one that got away". I still think about him now :-( I would have another without thinking twice. He lived out with the ponies and was tough as anything.

Was he never happy unless he got to the front of the ride though?