what is 'groundwork'? and do you really need to do it?

Pale Rider said:
There are a basic seven things you should be able to ask your horse to do on the ground.
Parelli calls it 7 games and has patented the names of the games.
Liberty carries on from in hand work, but everyone should be able to do the 7 basic skills, before getting on.
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What on earth are you on about m'dear? :confused:

I've been (very sucessfully) backing & schooling horses & ponies since the late 1970's (and before if you count as a child!) as well as producing to top county level & selling to Europe & Australia........
Never in my life have I heard of 7 miraculous 'things' that have to be done! Must go & ask some of those who have helped me/ taught me along the way in the past..........

The world is going truely nuts! :eek:

TFF goes off shaking head in amazement :mad::confused::rolleyes:
 
Actually I would include stuff with the horse at liberty as groundwork too. Not 7 games etc. Just standard stuff like picking out feet, standing still to be groomed, tacked up etc without having to be tied up first. Just good manners really but could be described as groundwork with the horse at liberty.
( and agree with fuzzy furry re 7 games)
 
Fuzzy, not talking miracles or miraculous training methods. Just a few basic on the ground movements the handler should be able to ask and get.
If your as good as you crack up to be, you'll be doing them anyway.
 
Pale Rider said:
Fuzzy, not talking miracles or miraculous training methods. Just a few basic on the ground movements the handler should be able to ask and get.
If your as good as you crack up to be, you'll be doing them anyway.
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But why on earth would someone (attempt to) patent methods which have been carried out since time immemorial? And there are no numbered set of 'things' (as you call them) in groundwork.

I most definately would never do anything called 'games' with horses/ponies, I have however trained & schooled - tho have had a hand in Prince Phillip Cup games training with PC teams :)

We'll have to agree to disagree on this - and after re-reading your post, you mention a name which is very contentious to me, having had to re-fix 2 horses allegedly 'trained' (and I use that term 'trained' very loosely) by a teacher of those persons methods.

Time for me to shift off out & go & clean some tack methinks :)
 
My interpretation of it is that if i am teaching my horse to do something useful (walk beside me respectfully, not barge through a gate, stand still etc etc ) and my feet are on the ground - i am doing "groundwork" -of course the term can also mean very very basic work that you build everything else on. To me groundwork is not a new invention, its the commonsense stuff good horse handlers have done for years without even thinking about it.
 
The Fuzzy Furry said:
But why on earth would someone (attempt to) patent methods which have been carried out since time immemorial? And there are no numbered set of 'things' (as you call them) in groundwork.

I most definately would never do anything called 'games' with horses/ponies, I have however trained & schooled - tho have had a hand in Prince Phillip Cup games training with PC teams :)

We'll have to agree to disagree on this - and after re-reading your post, you mention a name which is very contentious to me, having had to re-fix 2 horses allegedly 'trained' (and I use that term 'trained' very loosely) by a teacher of those persons methods.

Time for me to shift off out & go & clean some tack methinks :)
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I read this with much pleasure! I don't get groundwork being taught by demo or in a book, but then I think breaking is for good breaking yards, or where there's been the opportunity for the trainer to have served some 'apprenticeship' and I accept I'm out voted these days. So much of groundwork is just learned from a person that can do it, over and over and over again. Any horse can be lunged well in a hour ot two over a day or so. Any horse already lungeing will long rein well, and so on. I can't even imagine tying a youngster up to tack them up - sounds bluddy lethal!

If it were up to me the dvds would get binned - no matter what disclaimer of 'don't try this at home' might be added it takes astounding ignorance to think it will not be the case.

Groundwork is not gimmicky, it's where both the horse and rider prepare physically and mentally for a day which is always a bit nerve wracking but magical. After that ground work continues for variety and often mutual pleasure.
 
I've got no interest in Parelli 7 games and I wouldn't term teaching a horse to have normal good manners while being handled as groundwork. However I do get a lot of pleasure from working on what might be explained as dressage on-line, and to me it's just another discipline that I practise with my horses. Sometimes when I have the space and spare tape I will make a round pen and do some of that stuff with the horse loose as well. I think it just gives me and the horses a bit of variety. I love riding, and I love my "groundwork". I love doing different things with my horses and don't feel that I need to limit myself to riding. It's just personal choice.
I've got to be very clear though, what I do has nothing to do with Parelli "games" it's about working in a way that is physically beneficial to the horse.
The way I was taught to start a young horse, a bit of groundwork is useful, but obviously there are many ways to start a youngster. I'm talking about some work in circles and arcs - but with an eye to correct bend and carriage, and some suppling and yielding work. I wouldn't be disparaging about anyone who wouldn't include that in their repertoire, and I don't see why they should think there's anything to ridicule about the fact that I would.
 
Basic groundwork that I believe every horse should be able to do are, to stand both loose and tied and be touched all over.
Backup, draw forward, yield forequarters, yield hindquarters, move sideways, and circle.
If they can do this, on the ground, everything else is easy.
 
I was going to attempt to teach my horse the 7 games, but got stuck at 2 as porcupines aren't readily available in the UK. I know how insistent the Parellis are on the correct, exact equipment (carrot sticks and all) so I thought substituting with a hedgehog probably wasn't appropriate :(
 
Here we are then; in the interests of balance and fair play I will attempt to give you my simple BHS take on the 7 games.

grooming and basic handling
suppling exercises
lateral movements
lunging
loading

You're absolutely right Dorito it's just terminology.

Has Amandap had a melt down?
 
Ground work is working the horse from the ground, isn't it?

Lunging, long lining, free schooling, trick training, walking in hand, etc. AFAIK that's what its always been.
 
amandap said:
What is the 'proper' or old name for it then? I've only known ground work as ground work and it's for all horses not just youngsters. :confused:
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I've known ground work spoken about as several different meanings but all based around the same.

I class it as being able to walk, tie, not bite/kick at people etc. So basically handleable and manners. Some people see it as the whole lunging, long reining works.

So I'd say manners and any age, not just youngsters. A lot of older horses need basic groundwork readdressed even though they're good to ride!

Pan
 
rhino said:
I was going to attempt to teach my horse the 7 games, but got stuck at 2 as porcupines aren't readily available in the UK. I know how insistent the Parellis are on the correct, exact equipment (carrot sticks and all) so I thought substituting with a hedgehog probably wasn't appropriate :(
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Didn't mean to crash your joke.

I thought the thread was dead too;)
 
rhino said:
I wasn't joking :cool: Though I have tried riding carrying a hedgehog before and that was difficult enough. I obviously lack the 'skillz' :rolleyes:
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Never mind, there'll always be a job for you on Springwatch.

I understand the Parellis are big on hedgehogs. Pat's got one under his nose.
 
Pmsl at hedgehogs. My daughter has a cuddly toy one that I can lend any of you misguided people? Pm for address then send a s.a.e. with a none returnable pack of smarties.
 
rhino said:
I was going to attempt to teach my horse the 7 games, but got stuck at 2 as porcupines aren't readily available in the UK. I know how insistent the Parellis are on the correct, exact equipment (carrot sticks and all) so I thought substituting with a hedgehog probably wasn't appropriate :(
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YOU...






























just made me giggle mrs!! :D
 
dorito said:
Some of you may find it laughable of me, but serious questions - I don't think it existed back when I first got into horses.:D
Now it seems to be regarded as quite a standard practice...is it just a fancy name for basic handling?...does it come from the NH school of thinking?
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Groundwork is something good horse man have always employed over the years. Think Spanish Riding School. It is not new or invented by NH, they are utlising something that has been learnt off there grand fathers and great grand fathers.

It is preparing your horse on the ground so that it can better understand what is required before you get on. Common sense really. Teach it on the ground, so that you lessen the risk of being injured, so that you improve communication and understanding between you and your horse and also trust.

Do you really need to do it. You might get away without it with some horses, some of the time. Good horseman utilise ground work consistently throughout their training and education of all horses, and I think they get better and more consistent results.
 
I have negotiated on your behalf rhino, you are only a pack of jelly tots away from a hedgehog & a properly trained horse!
 
images
 
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