Posh Porsche
Member
Please can anyone identify the make of this saddle, the nameplate which was attached to it is the only clue I have.
I'm grateful for any information
I'm grateful for any information
What Make Of Saddle Is This Please?
- Thread starter Posh Porsche
- Start date
stormox
Well-Known Member
It looks like a cheap foreign make to me.
SpringArising
Well-Known Member
Yes, I thought this too. The leather and stitching look very stiff.
Posh Porsche
Member
The leather is actually beautifully soft and supple and smells and feels like English leather and the saddle is extremely comfortable. The front girth strap on each side is also on a separate piece of webbing to the two rear straps, I thought the foreign imports normally attached all three straps to the same piece of webbing?
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Fifty Bales of Hay
Well-Known Member
Have you got a picture of under the flap - and the underside showing the panels. This might give more of a clue as to whether English or Foreign? Where did you buy it from and how much was it, that will also give an indication?
Posh Porsche
Member
I have managed to discover that it came from Kallquists Hastutrustning AB (Kallquist Equestrian) in Sweden who also supply Pessoa and Lippo saddles. Has anyone heard of them or got any information about Kallquist?
Fifty Bales of Hay
Well-Known Member
No sorry not heard of them - but Pessoa saddles are lovely saddles. Try contacting Pessoa and see if you can find out anything.
cremedemonthe
Well-Known Member
Not familiar with the make but as a general guide, if you can see stitches along the top of the skirts, it's a massed produced machine made saddle, which means a cheaply made one.
If no stitches are visible, it means the skirts have been hand sewn to the welts and seat hide. This usually means a better quality of saddle and care to detail. No gussets at rear usually (but not always) means a cheaply made saddle too.
Stirrup bars too are a good clue to the quality of the saddle.
Although, there are "quality" English made saddles that I would throw in the bin and have done so as they are made badly!
If no stitches are visible, it means the skirts have been hand sewn to the welts and seat hide. This usually means a better quality of saddle and care to detail. No gussets at rear usually (but not always) means a cheaply made saddle too.
Stirrup bars too are a good clue to the quality of the saddle.
Although, there are "quality" English made saddles that I would throw in the bin and have done so as they are made badly!
Posh Porsche
Member
Thank you for that cremedemonthe, but where did you hear about the stitching along the top of the skirts theory? Both my Kieffer and my County both have stitches along the top of the skirts, and I just asked my friend to look at her £3,000 Hermes saddle and, yep, stitches along the top of the skirts... these are all quality saddles and certainly not cheaply made. I agree with you about the stirrup bars and I've seen the ones on the cheap imports, but this saddle's stirrup bars are of good quality and are the same as on my County.
Posh Porsche
Member
Here are a couple more photos of the stirrup bar and the sweat flap if it helps, I'd really appreciate anyone's help in identifying the make of the saddle
pootler
Well-Known Member
It might be worth emailing Kallquists Hastutrustning with the links to the pictures. They should be able to identify it for you if it is one of theirs or made on their behalf.
Alec Swan
Well-Known Member
Today the stitching along the top of the skirt is just about always machined. The stitching through the 'twist' however, where there is a raised welt, actually looks quite neat. Without seeing the saddle and handling it and inspecting the panels and the general finish, it is very difficult to tell.
The saddle has a seat which whilst flat, seems to be rather strangely shaped, the edge of the cantle seems to be rather 'thick', and to be a very poor imitation of what we once called a Hermes Cantle, but the real giveaway is the label, it smacks of seriously cheap and nasty. No maker of any quality would stick such an abomination on their work! Sorry if that's not what you wanted to read. Tell me that you haven't bought it!
Alec.
The saddle has a seat which whilst flat, seems to be rather strangely shaped, the edge of the cantle seems to be rather 'thick', and to be a very poor imitation of what we once called a Hermes Cantle, but the real giveaway is the label, it smacks of seriously cheap and nasty. No maker of any quality would stick such an abomination on their work! Sorry if that's not what you wanted to read. Tell me that you haven't bought it!
Alec.
Posh Porsche
Member
Thanks Alec, the cantle is thick because of the soft padding on the seat, it's actually extremely comfortable to sit on, I am familiar with Hermes saddles and the influence that they have had on saddle design. The saddle is actually very neatly made and the leather is beautifully supple which is why I'm also surprised at the label, I have to say that it was only glued on and I was able to pull it off without much effort. If it weren't for that label, I wouldn't have been suspicious as it actually appears to be a nice saddle otherwise.
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Posh Porsche
Member
Pootler, I think I will do as you say and email the pictures to Kallquists Hastutrustning and see what they say
cremedemonthe
Well-Known Member
It's not a theory, it's from 27 years experience in the saddlery trade, stitches seen means the skirts are machined on which does not compare in any shape or form to hand sewn. We hand sew our skirts on and they outlast any machined work.
Just because a saddle costs a small fortune does not mean it is well made, I have written articles on such which I have on my website with the evidence for all to see. Have you ever seen the plastic on top of Keiffer panels when you strip them down?
Cheap and cheerfully made inside where you can't see.
To be fair even hand sewn skirts are no guarantee of good quality workmanship inside, there's a lot of surprises when you start delving deeper.
Some of the most famous expensive brands use a cost cutting practice of using cut off webbing for front girth straps tacked up into the tree with either a few nails or staples, which is dangerous as the webs can pull off the tree with force.
We have come SO far away from traditional saddlery because companies want to mass produce saddlery to save money and make lots of profit, this is why many traditional saddlers and saddleries have or are going out of business. I hear through the saddlery trade grapevine of court cases becoming more common place due to saddlery failing through design.
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Posh Porsche
Member
Thank you cremedemonthe for your insight and knowledge. I agree with you totally about the far superior traditional methods of saddlemaking not being cost effective any more because of cheap mass production and I find it very sad. I had no idea just how far down the hill modern methods had come though, but after reading what you say about Keiffer and about the webbing not going all the way over the tree... I expected it from cheap copies and imports, but not the well known, expensive brands... shocking. It's such a shame that everything is just about profit these days, there's no pride or care any more.
cremedemonthe
Well-Known Member
I couldn't agree with you more, it's sad that standards have dropped so much in all walks of life. I'll send you a link to my article on badly made English saddles, it's a real eye opener with plenty of photos. Oz
LeannePip
Well-Known Member
can you post the link here cremedemonthe? would be really interested to read it
twiggy2
Well-Known Member
me three
cremedemonthe
Well-Known Member
sent!
Meowy Catkin
Meow!
CDM - would you please PM me the link too?
twiggy2
Well-Known Member
received and replied-thank you