What to try next?!

[littlen]

Hi,
This might be a long post sorry!

Last year I took on a horse that nobody else would. He was not in the best of conditions physically and mentally but he has recovered well.
I have worked very hard with him over the past year and have now somehow managed to get him handled on the ground, hacking reasonably well, popping a small jump and a few simple other things, but for us it is quite an achievement.

I decided last month that over this summer I was going to try and ask more from him. He is a talented horse with beautiful paces who tries his heart out when he wants too and I would love to take him places and enjoy him after a difficult start. I got an instructor who is helping me attempt to school him.

Now the problems have started to esculate again.
He is becoming much fitter, which in turn has made him incredibly strong and hard to handle. He has bolted a few times hacking and in the school which has scared me. He is also lazy and pretty much dead to the leg, if I ask for something he egnores me, if I tap with the whip he shoots forward which is pretty scary. He evades the bit by sticking his head right in the air and opening his mouth.
He will also not work in the school at all. He can not do a circle at all. If I ask for bend or a circle I get a buck or napping instead, on a good day he will walk a square but thats it!
He also rides everywhere with his head in the clouds, evading the bit and spooking at everything. He has actually headbutted me his head is so far up.
My instructor has been fantastic so far, and in lessons I do feel slight improvement, but when I practice it without her it all goes pear shaped and everything she taught goes out the window. He is knocking my confidence and I am nervous riding him, which he takes advantage of. My instructor rode him and agreed he was taking the P (spoilt and rude were her words!) and he went lovely for her which made me feel like it was my fault!

His back, teeth and tack have all been checked recently. He is in a french link snaffle at the moment.

Does anyone know of any schooling excersises to help him bend and flex more easily as I think he is finding it very difficult. He wont do a circle and all suggestions have been circles circles lol?
Will lunging help do you think, bearing in mind he does nothing but bomb about on the lunge?

Someone also suggested a running martingale to help with the head in the air. I would like to try it but I am worried its masking the problem not fixing it, do you think it will work?

Instructor also recomended a flash noseband, will this be effective?


I am feeling very down about it at the moment and I would appreciate some advice if anyone has any

 

[AmyMay]

Sounds like you have done a wonderful job with this horse - you should be really pleased with yourself. It does sound, now however, that you may be overhorsed.......

Does your instructor have a view on your compatibility??

 

[littlen]

Hi Amymay,

My instructor said the horse is basically rude and taking the mick. He has never been schooled before and is finding it hard but he will not try anything I ask.
She actually said she admires me very much for riding this horse, as he does go well for me when he wants to but I need to be firmer with him, but I find it hard as i know how scared he was when he first came if that makes sense. I suppose I have spoilt him too much.

I have worked really hard with this horse and I really dont want to sell him. I love him to bits and I know that he has loads of potential, I just wish there was some kind of way to hurry the process along a little! I am a confident enough rider, I am just exhausted with him at the moment and wish he could just be simple for once!

I am willing to work even harder with him, with my instructors help and if it takes 3 years then it takes 3 years, I just wondered if anyone had any new ideas to try with him.

 

[kylie88]

well done for coming so far with him, doesn't sound like its been easy.
I think maybe trying a flashnose band would be a good idea, it will help give you control as he won't be able to open his mouth.
If there is nothing medically wrong and he is just taking the p, then maybe you need to a be a little harder and make him respect what you are asking him to do. When lunging him do you use side reins etc..
have you done carrot stretches on the ground with him to see if he will bend

 

[littlen]

No I dont use sidereins at the moment but my instructor is going to come out next week to give a lunging lesson and try out some things on him so fingers crossed I get some tips from that

I have tried carrot stretches once but I am going to try then again!

He is definatley taking the P i think, as he can work well when he wants. My instructor rides him and he listens to her most of the time but she can work him through his tantrums better than me, as she is more experienced!

I will try a flash and see if that helps.

 

[CBFan]

Wow! sounds like you've come a long way together already - big pat on the back for you!!

when it comes to schooling, if he doesn't like it, try and keep sessions short and sweet, finish on a good note and then reward him with a little hack to cool down and chill out.

as for the bending... have you done any pole work with him? just working him over the odd pole will encourage him to use his back a bit more which will make it easier to bend... ride on a loose rein with your inside arm 'open' and held slightly away from his neck - inviting him to bend towards it... try riding loops, figures of eight and surpentines rather than circle acter circle... sometimes it is best to ride reall small cirlcles and get tough on them when they are resistant to bending as it tells them that you mean business!!

As for the flash... try it by all means but it might not help as sometimes they can make the horse tense in the jaw... at least without he can do as he wishes and is that bit more relaxed.

linge win sidereins and always using two lunge lines... one round the back of the horse... you will have so much more control.

 

[LauraWheeler]

Could your instructor not ride him a bit for you. That way she can work him through his tantrums you can watch and see how she does it. It may also help him incase you are giving him mixed signals. A flash noseband will help if he is opening his mouth to ignore what you are asking him to do.
Carrot streaches are a good idea.
Well done for getting him this far and not wanting to give up on him. It will all be worth it in the end. I know this better than most. Lucy was a compleat lost cause and it took years to get her right but it was so worth it in the end. I was only 14 when i took her on and had only been riding for 2 years. With a lot of hard work you'll get there.
I do think by the sounds of it you do need to be a lot firmer with him. you have gained his trust now you need to gain his respect.
Good luck. and Let us know how you are getting on.

 

[littlen]

Thankyou everyone

I have tried polework, unfortunatley he is scared of the poles so thats another thing I am working on. I am currently trying to get him lunging over poles and in a nice circle but he is finding it all very difficult!

My instructor does ride him on occasion, but to be honest I prefer her to teach me on him so that we both learn what we are doing wrong! Its nice to have someone pointing out my faults so I know where I am going wrong.

Laura- Hopefully mine will be worth it too, one day he might be a normal sane horse lol!

 

[NeedNewHorse]

QR; Hi, Well done and please don't be disheartened! The course of true love never runs smoothly ... lol Things will definitely get better as you have the determination. It's times like these when things get tough that you need to solider on!

Firstly - You say he is lazy and dead to the leg but bombs off. What makes him bomb off? Is this just out hacking? Are your schooling sessions varied? does he react when you put your leg on? (I would try a whip whop on this i think, it's a bit of rope that you swing over their neck like the cowboy's do, the swishing sensation gets them moving away from it) do this if you don't like using the whip, it's non-offensive. BUT be prepared for him to move off pretty sharpish. Grab the mane if you need to. You need to get him moving. forwards, forwards forwards is the key. If he is not moving forwards you cannot bring him into any type of outline! Please do try this as it does work. Pm me if you want any more info on it.

Next is hacking, again getting him forwards. What type of hacking do you do?

Pole work is very good for school work. Getting him moving in and around and over the poles, gets him interested and makes schooling fun! Do this, you can literally come up with thousands of exercises using poles.

I would lunge him/long rein him a few times a week and work on getting him stretching down over his back. Start of with 5mins and then increase and do this several times a week. If you say he bombs around then you first need to address this before you use a chambon or something similar with the lunge work. What exactly does he do when you lunge him...? What do you do?

Handling.. what is he like for you to handle? Does he respect you?

Feed, what is he being fed? How many times a week do you ride him and what do you do and how long for?

XX

 

[littlen]

QR; Hi, Well done and please don't be disheartened! The course of true love never runs smoothly ... lol Things will definitely get better as you have the determination. It's times like these when things get tough that you need to solider on!

Firstly - You say he is lazy and dead to the leg but bombs off. What makes him bomb off? Is this just out hacking? Are your schooling sessions varied? does he react when you put your leg on? (I would try a whip whop on this i think, it's a bit of rope that you swing over their neck like the cowboy's do, the swishing sensation gets them moving away from it) do this if you don't like using the whip, it's non-offensive. BUT be prepared for him to move off pretty sharpish. Grab the mane if you need to. You need to get him moving. forwards, forwards forwards is the key. If he is not moving forwards you cannot bring him into any type of outline! Please do try this as it does work. Pm me if you want any more info on it.

Next is hacking, again getting him forwards. What type of hacking do you do?

Pole work is very good for school work. Getting him moving in and around and over the poles, gets him interested and makes schooling fun! Do this, you can literally come up with thousands of exercises using poles.

I would lunge him/long rein him a few times a week and work on getting him stretching down over his back. Start of with 5mins and then increase and do this several times a week. If you say he bombs around then you first need to address this before you use a chambon or something similar with the lunge work. What exactly does he do when you lunge him...? What do you do?

Handling.. what is he like for you to handle? Does he respect you?

Feed, what is he being fed? How many times a week do you ride him and what do you do and how long for?

XX

Hi!

Well, If I ask for anything schooling wise he does not listen. If I apply leg to ask him to trot/canter he egnores me. He needs leg on every stride or he will fall out of trot/canter etc. He is not particulally forward going at all and needs alot of encouragement. My instructor says he is lazy and cant be bothered as its too much effort. If I pick up a whip he instantly picks up, but if I do use it he shoots forward. He is a very strange horse to ride, he has a huge bouncy trot and canter and I find it hard to sit to when I am having to kick him along constantly.

He does not work in an outline. He is above the bit constantly. If i ask him to lower his head or give him some rein he uses it as an excuse to take the mick and nap to the gate or stop.

We hack most days, mostly in walk or trot. He is very spooky alone, he is also very backwards thinking and slow. If I take a whip he is more forward but he gets to a point where he just stops listening regardless.
I also hack in company and he is fine in all situations except canter. If the other horses break into canter he takes it as an excuse to go at a flat out gallop past everything and he will not stop or slow down. He also canters sideways rather than forwards when hacking (instructor thinks its because he is stiff on one side so sort of tilts his body one way, if that makes sense?)
His head is right int he air above the bit so I have no control.

When I lunge I tend to just ask him to go around in walk/trot/canter in a circle. He will not do this without a fight. He will go in a sort of circle but he is not bending or working properly just going in the right direction. He will go faster and faster and not stop. I will ask him to slow down with voice and body language/wip in front of him etc.

To handle he is fine, no problems there really. He did suffer really bad with seperation anxiety last year but its improving no end! He is never bolshy or bad mannered on the ground, only ridden.

He is ridden about 4-5 times a week for around an hour, mainly hacking in walk and trot. He also gets a half hour schooling session every week as I dont dare school him on my own.
He gets no hard feed (cruel I know, but I cant have him overweight!) He is out all day on a bare field, with haylage at night.