What would you do? Vet, ulcers, losing the will…

IrishMilo

IrishMilo

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Well Rocky and I had a good 12 month run before “It’s a horse who will inevitably break” set in. And he’s not broken, just NQR which is somehow more frustrating.

Quick backstory: 13 year old, broken at 9, full history known. Has had a very easy life pretty much pottering about until I bought him just over a year ago.

Noticed a few months ago he was dropping a hind limb on the lunge once or twice each session for about half a second, didn’t look lame but it was something new and not something I was willing to ignore so he went to the vets for a lameness work up.

Had the whole caboodle - vet was seeing a 1/10th lameness both hind limbs intermittently, hooked him up to the Equinosis that also detected a 1/10th RH and LH. Not exactly earth shattering stuff but we decided to try to locate where it was coming from.

Blocked both legs which didn’t change movement so X rayed feet, fetlocks, stifles and hocks. All clear apart from mild OA both hinds. Injected with steroids. Also x rayed back and both fronts for good measure, nothing of note.

So all in all pretty good stuff for a 13 year old in reasonable jumping work.

Came home and immediately noticed within a few days not himself - grumpy, trying to bite me and kicking when doing rugs. Absolutely not like him at all, spoke to vet and said I think he’s got ulcers, I’ve got some omeprazole and sucralfate already, planning to treat. Given go ahead to treat and reassess in 2 weeks. No change so scoped. Grade 3 ulcers. Started injections right away.

Within 1 injection slight improvement, 2 injections excellent improvement, 3, pretty much back to normal.

For the first 2 weeks I stopped riding to not aggravate him physically or emotionally. Spoke to vet after 2nd jab and said he’s back to normal handling wise so given green light to ride gently again.

Which brings us to now - with one injection to go, pony is back to his happy nosy self on the ground, no issues grooming or tacking up at all, but has now started getting his back up and planting.

If the behaviour on the ground was still symptomatic for ulcers I would understand but now I’m just bloody stumped. Am I expecting too much too soon?

His saddle was fitted by an excellent master saddle fitter 3 months ago and checked again today so don’t think it’s that.

He’s turned out any time from 4.30am - 6am and brought in between 5-6pm, in a small herd and has ad lib hay 24/7.

Feed is a couple of different chopped fibres plus salt, Vitamin E (2000iu), broad spec vitamin and mineral and at the moment sucralfate added in.

He is an extremely stressy thing, he weaves like a manic hence why he’s turned out so early but equally when he’s been out 24/7 he screams and paces if other horses are taken away so it’s not even as if finding somewhere he could live out would lessen stress.

I’m at the point of thinking physically he’s pretty much OK, what else can I do?

It feels like I’ve brought it all on myself by taking him to the bloody vet in the first place as that’s when the ulcer behaviours started.

What am I missing?!

Photo of the little blighter who has me wrapped around his little finger!

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TheMule said:
I would probably scan the hind suspensories and, if they are clear, stick some steroid in the SI and see if that helped
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Thanks! I forgot to say they were also scanned, they were normal aside from some inflammation at the top where they attach the hock which vet felt the steroid would treat.

Doing the SI is a really good call and for the sake of another couple hundred definitely worth a go.
 
Tiddlypom said:
I’ve had really good and long lasting results from SI steroid injections. They were done in conjunction with Arthramid in the hocks, as it was hock arthritis that was the primary problem, which had resulted in a sore SI area.

Good luck.
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Thanks @Tiddlypom, I think that’s absolutely going to be my next port of call.

I just don’t know whether it’s the ulcers still or not. Previous to him scoping positive for them I’ve never had any of this behaviour.
 
He may still be feeling sore all over as they become tight and hold themselves from the pain of ulcers.
Maybe physio or massage and a little longer off ridden work.
Perhaps do in hand stuff for now and see how he is in a few weeks.
Do you know what type of ulcers they were?
 
I honestly don’t know if you will like my reply, but I had a very similar horse. All I wanted was a happy horse who would go out to shows, do little dressage tests, maybe go out on hacks with friends etc.
However, I kept getting endless issues, lameness, ulcers, really hating travelling however hard we worked at it, and then last autumn, after a few days away on a course (which she clearly hated) she started Headshaking.
So, I decided to take all pressure off her, (I bought another horse to compete) and now only ride her at home or hack her out with another horse (ie not even the pressure of hacking alone). So far this has worked and she genuinely seems so much happier.
I think the point of this post is we can underestimate the stress some horses live under even if we are giving them what we believe is a good life, which just like humans always causes issues. And for some horses, even what we consider as a relatively normal life (ie being a one owner much loved all rounder) the stress is just too much.
Is there anyway you could just take all expectations off her for a bit and see if that helps?
Obviously you currently have some issues which need a medical solution, but if the horse is continuously throwing health niggles then maybe the route of the problem is they have a very low stress threshold?
And finally, I don’t think my horse holds muscle tone, if that makes sense, so if I do want to do stuff with her, I will have to take longer and work harder and getting her really really fit, to do what my other horse can comfortably do just being ridden a couple of times a week.
 
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At a guess you changed his movement when you injected for the OA you could see. He’d been moving to compensate for that and now that feels better so you’ll have a new movement pattern, new muscle usage. That would have exacerbated any soft tissue issues and caused active pain. Ulcers would be historical from the pain you saw, now aggravated. I think you have something soft tissue that was caused by or in conjunction with the arthritis you injected for. Now one problem is solved you’re seeing the next one.
 
canteron said:
I honestly don’t know if you will like my reply, but I had a very similar horse. All I wanted was a happy horse who would go out to shows, do little dressage tests, maybe go out on hacks with friends etc.
However, I kept getting endless issues, lameness, ulcers, really hating travelling however hard we worked at it, and then last autumn, after a few days away on a course (which she clearly hated) she started Headshaking.
So, I decided to take all pressure off her, (I bought another horse to compete) and now only ride her at home or hack her out with another horse (ie not even the pressure of hacking alone). So far this has worked and she genuinely seems so much happier.
I think the point of this post is we can underestimate the stress some horses live under even if we are giving them what we believe is a good life, which just like humans always causes issues. And for some horses, even what we consider as a relatively normal life (ie being a one owner much loved all rounder) the stress is just too much.
Is there anyway you could just take all expectations off her for a bit and see if that helps?
Obviously you currently have some issues which need a medical solution, but if the horse is continuously throwing health niggles then maybe the route of the problem is they have a very low stress threshold?
And finally, I don’t think my horse holds muscle tone, if that makes sense, so if I do want to do stuff with her, I will have to take longer and work harder and getting her really really fit, to do what my other horse can comfortably do just being ridden a couple of times a week.
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I absolutely do think his stress threshold is extremely low - for example just to scope him he required 3 lots of sedation and the same when he needs his teeth doing - I can read him like a book but he’s a very sensitive and tricky character - definitely the most sensitive I’ve had yet, and I include OTTBs in there. If I have to retire him in order for him to be happy I would do so - I genuinely get as much joy from being around him as I do riding him - he’s hilarious!
 
I have one who did the dropping the hind things, started swapping canter leads, got progressively worse, occasionally headshaking,started planting. Did Bute trails, x rays, full head and body bone scan, found nothing you wouldn't expect on a 13 year old. Came back from the bone scan with ulcers, treated, and turned away for 3 months. Threw a splint during this time, but never lame, (and passed all neuro tests which we repeated during all the diagnostics). Eventually, someone mentioned ECVM,which I'd never even heard of, so we did the May-Davis protocol x rays and found that was indeed the problem. Currently been happily retired for 5 years. Very glad I'd taken out insurance, the most expensive horse with the shortest ridden career ...
 
TheMule said:
I would probably scan the hind suspensories and, if they are clear, stick some steroid in the SI and see if that helped
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I would definitely do this .
PSD can make horses show all of strange symptoms and l would guess the steroid has changed the feel of the lameness because the OA symptoms are being controlled.
 
Is it possible the steroid injections may have caused the ulcers, as a quick google shows this has been a talking point after joint injections in some horses.
That may explain the post injections flare of symptoms he never exhibited before, and behavioural change. Seems some horses are more sensitive to steroids than others.

Specific Anti-inflammatory Drug Risks: Scone Equine Hospital

Learn more about the specific anti-inflammatory drug risks associated with equine veterinary treatment before admitting your horse to Scone Equine Hospital.
www.sconeequinehospital.com.au www.sconeequinehospital.com.au
 
If he's a sensitive soul, do you think it might help to wind things down and take it easy for bit? Just to go at his pace and have no pressure.

I'm wondering if he had grade 3 ulcers, it's always said that they get ulcers as a secondary issue but if his legs were fine, would it be worth getting his back xrayed? I see you said about getting his SI injected which is a good shout to see how it goes and at least it rules it out if you still have the same issues.

He looks like a lovely boy. I hope you manage to work it out.
 
What is your turnout like? Is it large, pasture with hollows/hills - or flat agricultural? Can you try him in a barn/large pasture arrangement? The fact he weaves and stresses when horses move suggests he isn't quite happy. Sometimes unless you have experienced horses living out in truely proper 'fields' rather than ' paddocks' its hard to understand how much of a mental impace this can have on them
 
His back was X rayed, the only thing we didn’t do was knees, neck and head. There were two processes that were close but the vet said he wouldn’t be concerned about that, there was no remodelling and said he was completely non reactive to having a fairly severe amount of pressure applied to the area.

It doesn’t make sense to me that he would suddenly have a new issue that he didn’t have pre-work up which is why I’m wondering if I’m just expecting too much too soon under saddle re. The ulcers? He has always been super forward and has never gotten his back up before ulcer diagnosis.

Maybe I’m answering my own questions by writing it all down, I don’t know. It’s hard to see the wood for the trees when you’re in the middle of it!

Re. Our turnout; they probably have about 5 acres when the weather is good and during the very wet they go onto a track system.
 
PurBee said:
Is it possible the steroid injections may have caused the ulcers, as a quick google shows this has been a talking point after joint injections in some horses.
That may explain the post injections flare of symptoms he never exhibited before, and behavioural change. Seems some horses are more sensitive to steroids than others.

Specific Anti-inflammatory Drug Risks: Scone Equine Hospital

Learn more about the specific anti-inflammatory drug risks associated with equine veterinary treatment before admitting your horse to Scone Equine Hospital.
www.sconeequinehospital.com.au www.sconeequinehospital.com.au
Click to expand...
Thank you for this, I had no idea it could be a side effect and it would definitely make sense given this all started about 2 days post hocks being done! I’m seeing the vet on Monday so I’m also going to discuss neck and SI.
 
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