What's your view on PARELLI / NATURAL HORSEMANSHIP?

I'm afraid I always sit next to Shy on the straw while he's having his tea - there is just something so lovely about watching a horse eating. And of course, I'm handy to pick up any nugget he's dropped.....we check the floor together, then play the carrot game.

How very,very sad am I :o
 
KellyJoArnold said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRmxcASjR5s

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brilliant,:D i want to get myself one of them doozy headcollars, i rather liked her apple stick as well ;) and you learn something new everyday, i didn;t know that if a mummy horse and a daddy horse was both branded that their babies would be born branded too, :eek: how did i not know this before:o:D


Sorry OP i think your thread has gone a bit wayward, does the owner expect you to carry on with the parelli way? have you met the owner and ridden the horse, if you get on with both and aren't going to feel pushed into doing things you don;t understand or agree with then really the owners ideals shouldn't be a major problem.
 
alliersv1 said:
A lot of that pretty much falls under comon sense in my book.
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I agree with this quote. Alot of the natural horsemanship is just good horsemanship. It's not the horse you have to worry about but the owners who can sometimes be a bit OTT.

I know I am away to get slammed for saying that....
 
As others have said, this kind of subject always brings out a lot of strong opinions. However, I'm going to put my neck on the line slightly and say that, in moderation, I like 'natural horsemanship' type things. NOT the branded cult-like activities, but I enjoy groundwork - the stuff that is mostly common sense to me, with a few fun bits thrown in.

The majority of the people at my yard are against anything like that - but they frequently comment on how good my boy is now - he knows which way to turn around each gate, and goes where I point, and I can feed, groom, tack up etc 'at liberty'. To some people that might be 'parelli' or whatever - I call it groundwork :)

It really helped when I first got him, as he was a bit bargy and difficult to catch and I was pretty nervous of him, and I still do a session or two every week with him to maintain manners etc. I do a fair bit of densensitising, and have taught him to 'ground tie' and to stop if he feels something on his leg - to the point where if he beggars off (as they all will at some point!) with his leadrope on for whatever reason, as soon as he stands on it or it flaps on his leg he just stops and stands there :)

If the owner is very keen on a particular 'brand' then I would stay clear; if she wants you to do some groundwork with the horse then go for it - it helps them supple etc without a rider, and even if it does nothing for the horse's training, it makes you very aware of body language etc... In fact, whenever I have parents/non-horsey friends that aren't suitable/willing to have a sit on him, they have great fun getting him to change pace, stop, turn etc just on a rope in the school. Don't knock it till you've tried it! :D
 
Natural Horsemanship is just plain horsemanship, so old it predates any of the militaristic techniques touted by the traditional school.
I think the number of people who are following what is called Natural Horsemanship whether it is Brannaman, Parelli, Rashid is fantastic and the fact that these numbers are growing fast, year on year pleases me no end.
 
I did a stint of Parelli years ago when it first emerged. It was much simpler back then and far less commercialised! It did work wonders with my pony at the time (who happened to be a bolshy haflinger) but its not something I would do now.

I use some aspects but like others have said it really is common sense.

I have a friend who is training to be a Parelli Professionally at an astronomical cost to her self! Why? I have no idea but her horses are very well trained, but also very opinionated. Maybe its the animals, maybe its the way they have been trained? Who knows.

My other friend who does Parelli bought a 3 year old Sec D 2 years ago. She can have her horse do all manner of patterns figure 8's etc all at liberty, but she is still yet to back her... I agree that Parelli is used a lot with people who dont want to ride, but do want to train their horses.

I think if aspects are use its fine, but I would steer clear of anyone who uses it in a religious cult like way!

Good luck with what ever you do xx
 
Main problem with the whole NH movement is that it fosters a really, really condescending attitude to the rest of equestrianism. A shame really because making people think and question what they are doing can only be a good thing. The hardline Parelli followers in particular can be a nightmare,they come across almost brainwashed, repeating almost word for word what ever rhetoric has been drilled into them that week. They really do think they are the only ones who understand horses. I for one find this incredibly naïve and insulting to the many, many good horsemen and women that have come before them, how on earth did everyone manage their horses before His Highness Parelli existed I wonder?
Beware the false prophet.
 
lastchancer said:
Main problem with the whole NH movement is that it fosters a really, really condescending attitude to the rest of equestrianism.
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YES! Most people I know who are into NH do struggle not to be really patronising. I'm not sure if they mean it or what, but its how it comes across. There was that person who came on here the other week all militant about using bits etc, but there are plenty who just do what they do without preaching.

I don't like Parelli these days at all, but as already said there are loads of things involved in 'NH techniques' that are plain old common sense to someone who actually likes their horse and keeps it as a pet rather than a working animal. I do like training and groundwork, I hardly ever tie a horse up unless it will bog off and I do like just 'hanging out' with my horse when I am supposed to be poo picking etc, and I am just there so why not?

I do notice NH often does apply to people who don't ride, fair enough. I have been off for ages having broken my arm and waiting for the saddle I ordered, so I had to do something and I don't mind not riding. I also notice however that their horses are often rude and don't seem to respect them, which I thought was the whole point... I'm not sure these days as I don't have time to read up on all the various horsemanship celebrities.

As said on other thread my haffy has done some Parelli, I don't really treat her any differently, just bear it in mind and expect that eventually she will get used to things. She has previously turned aggressive and I am wary of this, but she seems OK now we have got an understanding again. She does follow me around endlessly on a loose lead rope... kind of useful I guess, just not when I want to lunge her!
 
The Parellis give me the creeps. I don't like their ways or attitudes, the jerking at ropes, poking with whips etc.

i know one or two people who are obsessed with it all, and are great proselytisers for the whole 'experience'. The interesting - well obvious - thing to me that shows up is that the Parelli horses are brain-washed. I have very occasional reservations about onty Roberts, but he and his horses really bond; and he leaves them with a mind of their own.
 
I don't really like parelli. I have something against it after seeing a picture of the bloke himself making a newborn foal scramble over a log the same size as it...


but natural/intelligent horsemanship saved my pony's life. She had a LOT of problems, due to old physical pain..Once this was sorted she still had the pain memory and was a v. severe napper/rearer (ended up with someone getting on = vertically rearing until person got off/fell off/she flipped over.

After exploring every option we could think of, we sent her to a more "normal" schooling place...she was sent back after 2 weeks when her rider broke his leg :s After a LOT of searching, we found an intelligent horsemanship person who would take her (a lot wouldn't touch her as she was too dangerous). She was there for 4 or 5 months and she came back a different horse.

Still took 3 years to get her where she is now (95% well behaved, schools, jumps, hacks alone/company, v. v. rarely rears although still very excitable, fizzy and high strung).


To be honest though....most of it was just common sense. She was restarted with a dummy, they used pacifiers (blinkers that also don't let them see above them) and a whip whop rope as she can't be ridden with a whip. When she reared/planted herself she was constantly kept moving even if it was just a step from side to side ect. Lots of long reining..

It didn't 'fix' her, but it...gave us an opening. She came back still nappy, still played up in the school often and would rarely jump without an explosion. But there was enough of an opening in her mindset (if thats the right word), and I knew what technique would eventually work, tha\t if she did start her napping/rearing/spinning/tanking business, I was abe to EVENTUALLY (i.e. 20-30min) work through it.

To be honest, the main "difference" between that and what normal people may do is less smacking, although she will get a wallop with the whip whop rope, but it works a little differently, and using a dually headcollar on the ground (she can be bargey too). The rest is common sense.

It worked for her. It was a last resort, if that place hadn't worked she'd probably have been pts.
 
I hate it when people follow it in a 'cult' like fashion.
Not everything will work for you and your horse. Don't follow a particular horsemanship blindly like a sheep, while forgetting the bigger picture- Is your horse happy?
 
There is a lot of twaddle posted on every forum discussing Parelli. Most of the posters are making judgements based on one incident - and most posters have no idea of what Parelli or nh is!! Most posters are basing their judgements on learner horsemen or prejudiced media reports......when someone who has achieved a level of competence based on the programme - preferably the original programme - and they criticise it then I will listen to their arguments.....when I studied the original programme back in 1998 everything the instructor said resonated with things my mentors had said back in the 1950s....it is horsemanship and every technique was built in a logical sequence.....I think it is a shame that the Parellis egos and public perception has destroyed their original programme which was excellent. I am sure everyone reading this would agree with the keys, principles, responsiblilities and qualities.....if they knew what they were!!
 
Now I struggle to know what the difference is, between the NH approach and regular everyday horsemanship.
So far the examples given about manners, leading, tieing up and smacking as a correction for example aren't differences.

I know a few (put out to pasture, long in the tooth) old jockeys who have trained and worked in a traditional and business orientated environment with horses, and yet, their approach, shows more knowledge and empathy than some twit jumping round with a carrot dangly and a bemused horse.

There is no shortcut to knowing horses, doing a course, or poncing about with string halters doesn't make horse's lives better.
Putting the time and sweat in, does. Riding day and after day, many different horses, sitting in stables at night with the sick ones, and developing a eye for the way a horse moves and an inexplicable 'knowing'.

NH is as open to abuse as any other approach, you can't give common sense to stupid people and there's plenty of stupidity around horses already.

Just as barefoot extremists take a few good core basic truths and ruin the good elements, so the NH extremists relabel the things many of us have been doing for years without the price tag.
 
horserider said:
Now I struggle to know what the difference is, between the NH approach and regular everyday horsemanship.
So far the examples given about manners, leading, tieing up and smacking as a correction for example aren't differences.

I know a few (put out to pasture, long in the tooth) old jockeys who have trained and worked in a traditional and business orientated environment with horses, and yet, their approach, shows more knowledge and empathy than some twit jumping round with a carrot dangly and a bemused horse.

There is no shortcut to knowing horses, doing a course, or poncing about with string halters doesn't make horse's lives better.
Putting the time and sweat in, does. Riding day and after day, many different horses, sitting in stables at night with the sick ones, and developing a eye for the way a horse moves and an inexplicable 'knowing'.

NH is as open to abuse as any other approach, you can't give common sense to stupid people and there's plenty of stupidity around horses already.

Just as barefoot extremists take a few good core basic truths and ruin the good elements, so the NH extremists relabel the things many of us have been doing for years without the price tag.
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Exactly.....but the first key is 'attitude' and that is self-explainatory!!!
 
A novice friend recently acquired a horse who she's been practicing parelli with. Last time we spoke she was telling me how she was teaching it to turn by hitting it on the side of its head with the carrot stick :confused: I thought seat and legs were to teach a horse to turn! I'm surprised it hasn't freaked out yet or reared, given its history for rearing too!
 
I have a lots of experience of being round Parelli people and the more I see the more creepy I find it. It's not for people who like riding; if you like ground work and have a rude horse you are scared of it could just be the thing for you. I have a beautifully behaved horse who I love riding so have no need for it.
 
Alyth said:
There is a lot of twaddle posted on every forum discussing Parelli. Most of the posters are making judgements based on one incident - and most posters have no idea of what Parelli or nh is!! Most posters are basing their judgements on learner horsemen or prejudiced media reports......when someone who has achieved a level of competence based on the programme - preferably the original programme - and they criticise it then I will listen to their arguments.....when I studied the original programme back in 1998 everything the instructor said resonated with things my mentors had said back in the 1950s....it is horsemanship and every technique was built in a logical sequence.....I think it is a shame that the Parellis egos and public perception has destroyed their original programme which was excellent. I am sure everyone reading this would agree with the keys, principles, responsiblilities and qualities.....if they knew what they were!!
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I strongly agree with what has been said here.
I think I've heard every 'carrot stick' joke going now.
Most people seem to have formed an opinion on Natural Horsemanship on someone they know at 'our yard' who is obviously a knob, and no advert for NH.
Parelli have probably done a good job in getting Natural Horsemanship a wider stage, though people who dislike the Parelli's, their egos and the way their company is portrayed probably have some valid points.
I think that Natural Horsemanship is in fact horsemanship, passed down through the generations and there have been various blips as things went along as one or other trainer or technique became fashionable. I'm sure when Philip II of Spain decreed that gentlemen could only ride stallions, the number of carriages increased overnight.
As far as the current crop of NH trainers go. Most like to link themselves with people like the Dorrances. These people sort of did things with the horse and for the horse rather than at the horse and to the horse.
What Bill and Tom Dorrance taught hasn't really altered much. I find it quite amusing how trainers are desperatly trying to come up with things that make their program different or unique, but, they just cannot do that.
My biggest criticism of Parelli is the drip feeding of information at such a cost. I like to think people can go from wanting to start with their horse to be at a fairly high level within a few weeks, and there is no reason why you shouldn't.
English equestrianism, took a right bashing at the start of the 20th centuary. We lost millions of horses and hundreds of thousands of horsemen. Basically, horsemanship was killed off in the UK, a few old timers may have struggled on, but mechanization in agriculture saw the last of them off. What replaced it? Militarism, The Pony Club and BHS were founded and run by ex cavalry officers and their equestrian practices are based on Cavalry techniques, which are ok when you want a one size fits all, and I have a piece of tack which will cover up that problem.
Natural Horsemanship is just Horsemanship, Horsemanship is like baked beans, lots of people put a label on the tin, but at the end of the day, they are still baked beans.
 
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