When is enough enough

[jilly2024]

Hello, just joined today and jumping in with a big one.

My ID 7yo has been in rehab on/off (mostly on) for the last 2 years. At what point do I call it a day and just accept

I bought him in Aug 21, he was treated for ulcers in Oct 21 and again in Jan 22. He briefly came into work before starting to show lame in June
/July time- 1/5 lame left hind. He was referred for bone scan and it turned out he had a non-weight bearing fracture (of the 3rd trochanter, super unusual fracture) and the compensation had caused some changes to his SI.
He was given 3 months off, allowed turnout if he behaved, and then was long reined for 4 weeks. He was then given SI steroid injections and trot work started. We probably got 4 months of work slowly building up, and then i noticed he was a little off from time to time. 2 months later we were allowed a reinjection of his SI, and I dont see much response to treatment this time And has clearly been compensating for pain as he is very unevenly muscled.
We have been working with a chartered physio who does indiba treatment and its sort of been working i think along with her rehab plan of poles and walking, but then he took off full gallop on a hard surface and has been full of danilon and anger since then (10 days ago). He now drops his head and closes his eyes when he sees tack, like he is shutting down.
He is not easy, he is thran, he bites, he will throw the leg, he is a very obstinate and challenging horse. But I love him. He is dangerous at the mounting block, worse
if he is feeling off at all. So I cant get him going enough to build the muscle he needs to stabilise the SI because he is too sore to do anything so catch22 (and he he will bite if handwalked in the arena, and rolls on the long reins).
So i feel like my options are becoming limited. He has had teeth/saddle done recently, he has had 3 goes with the physio in 7 weeks. Ive the vet coming on Tues again to give him a once over and make sure there is nothing else niggling him like a sore tooth or a bean or a sore back, but if this is all SI related and related to that fracture, will he ever come sound and stay sound enough to do anymore than a 10 min walk round the arena. I feel so guilty and selfish but we are £1000s in now and his insurance doesnt cover much anymore (he has been diagnosed with and treated for equine asthma in the middle of all this too).
At what point do I just stop? Have I missed anything obvious to check? Am I completely deluded that this can end well

If you made it this far, thank you x

 

[Amymay Again]

How awful sad for you.

I'm afraid I give 12 months. And if the horse isn't then right it's adiós.

 

[jilly2024]

How awful sad for you.

I'm afraid I give 12 months. And if the horse isn't then right it's adiós.

I think I know thats probably the correct approach, its just so tough to not always wonder "what if I tried... xyz"

 

[Amymay Again]

I think I know thats probably the correct approach, its just so tough to not always wonder "what if I tried... xyz"

It's terribly hard. But I'm pretty pragmatic about these things.

 

[View]

If you’re asking the question, it’s probably time.

He sounds so miserable. Euthanasia is in itself never a welfare concern; in my opinion, releasing our wonderful friends and companions from pain is the final kindness we owe them.

 

[jilly2024]

It's terribly hard. But I'm pretty pragmatic about these things.

We have the vet one more time on tues, but I feel ill need to channel some pragmatism as well.

 

[jilly2024]

If you’re asking the question, it’s probably time.

He sounds so miserable. Euthanasia is in itself never a welfare concern; in my opinion, releasing our wonderful friends and companions from pain is the final kindness we owe them.

Thank you, aside from a miraculous change and steer towards being sound, I dont see how we can continue like this indefinitely

 

[SEL]

I'm usually one for pushing along with rehab but this sounds like he had a nasty injury and recovery to ridden work is going to be a stretch

I think an honest chat with your vet on Tues is the way forward but your boy sounds in pain and it isn't ethical to let that continue.

I'm sorry - it would be nice to think we can fix them all but realistically PTS is often the kindest way to help xx

 

[shortstuff99]

If I were you I would either PTS or chuck him out on a hill somewhere for a couple of years and then see what he is like.

 

[94lunagem]

If you’re asking the question, it’s probably time.

This tends to be my school of thought too.

Very sorry you’re facing this @jilly2024, it’s never easy and it’s the worst part of having animals we love. You’ve given him the best chance and sometimes PTS is the kindest and/or responsible thing to do.

 

[Zoeypxo]

Sounds really tough. I think you need to have a frank conversation with the vet about his quality of life. Its a horrible situation x

 

[Equi]

I would see what the vet says about how ethical it is to keep him going. If the vet thinks he can be salvaged I would be looking to turnout for a year in a stable herd.

 

[dorsetladette]

Firstly - welcome to the forum. Sorry it isn't under better circumstances.

We're quite a pragmatic (but caring) bunch here.

I'm a firm believer in a bit of Dr green (ie turn away/time) can fix a multitude of things. But he needs to be pain free/comfortable to be able to do that with your boy. I think a frank conversation with your vet about quality of life and then what the short and long term future looks like.

 

[9tails]

I think I know thats probably the correct approach, its just so tough to not always wonder "what if I tried... xyz"

Sounds like you've tried it all and he's still in pain. If he injured you, with his anger/biting/throwing a leg, who would look after him? If you have the resources to retire him and his attitude does a u-turn, then I would. Otherwise I'd PTS now.

 

[IrishMilo]

It's really easy to read something and say 'Well I know what I'd do...' but when you're in the situation day in, day out, it is really hard to come to a decision.

The SIs are always hard, they don't really come good permanently, just need really careful management. What were your plans for him? If you wanted a light hacker AND you really love him, then it could be worth persevering. Equally I think with this one you're probably on a hiding to nothing.

If you have deep pockets, then I'd retire him. If you don't, I'd put him down. Sorry you're in this position!

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I'm all for turning away if there is a good chance of the horse coming right with time. I'd rather do that than lots of invasive treatment. BUT it sounds as if your horse needs daily pain relief. Can you provide that and keep you both safe? If you can that's what I would do, otherwise , im sorry to say I think pts is in the horse's best interests

 

[misst]

Another echoing all the above. It's easy to get lost down a rabbit hole of trying this and that. If you can afford to allow him a retirement and can get him pain-free well and good but realistically it seems unlikely he'll do well long term even with retirement . I've been in your position and eventually pts. I regret not doing it sooner for his sake. Sorry you are in such a horrible position
X

 

[jilly2024]

Sounds like you've tried it all and he's still in pain. If he injured you, with his anger/biting/throwing a leg, who would look after him? If you have the resources to retire him and his attitude does a u-turn, then I would. Otherwise I'd PTS now.

The attitude is worse when he is sore, and its even worse when he has no job to do- like an understimulated toddler.
He is quite boistrous and I wouldnt risk retiring him out with my wee ottb so I couldnt expect other people to be happy with him being put out with theirs
Tuesday is looming, will let yous know what the vet says x

 

[jilly2024]

Thank you all for your replie, will drop a comment on Tues after the vet has been x

 

[jilly2024]

Just to update, vet confirmed 1/5 lame on left hind.
Blocked his suspensory and there was definite improvement although the referral vet saw the videos and agreed while left hind improved he then sjortened on right hind so probable bilateral issues.

My heart is broken. Vet is coming to ultrasound on Tues but in reality I dont know whether Id proceed with surgery (assuming he is a suitable candidate) given his other issues.

In my head, if someone could tell me "Yes, one more push, fix this issue, and he will be fine" then I would but I just feel its one thing after another. He is happy in himself and pottering around but I already have a field ornament, I dont think I can justify a second plus something to ride

Although Id consider turning away for a year and trying again but I dont know what good that's going to do other than delaying the inevitable

 

[misst]

He has had every opportunity and it's not worked. You've done your best. Horses are money pits and stressful much of the time if there are no good times to balance things I would PTS. Easy for me to say I know but there are worse things than PTS. It's a horrible position to be in. X

 

[Spotherisk]

I persevered after my five year old had probably AM which led to laminitis and foundered in all four. We went through months of box rest, and at the end of five years of constant worry, and him having a shitty time of living out clipped, naked, with a muzzle on, through the winder and still gaining weight and being footy I had one last vet check then pts. In those five years I barely rode, and my older horse retired, and now my hip hurts too much to ride anymore anyway. Maybe if I’d made the choice earlier I would still have a riding horse now - I don’t know. But my little horse went easily with his ears pricked, as if he knew it was his time. I couldn’t fix him, and maybe you can’t fix yours. Hugs, because it’s rubbish.

 

[IrishMilo]

It's an incredibly hard decision. However you've already given it two years - how much longer are you willing to spend on this horse? All the while using your emotional, physical, and financial resources? Is looking after him status quo bringing you joy? Or dare I say more likely, bringing you down?

I have a friend who has been in the same situation to you for the past 12 months - longer if you count the first year she had the horse where he constantly acted up under saddle but she didn't know why. He's been treated for ulcers twice (or three times, I've lost count), had his hocks done, had his SI medicated, has remedial shoes. He's had every supplement under the sun and his every single need catered to. However it's an endless loop of fixing one thing and then trying to sort something else. And then needing the treat the ulcers again. Frankly I have no idea how my friend stays sane.

 

[Exasperated]

If I were you I would either PTS or chuck him out on a hill somewhere for a couple of years and then see what he is like.

Yes, except that Jilly doesn’t seem the sort of owner who would be able to step back like that.
Plus, still have costs of his field and hay etc - because there’s no way she’s just going to let him ‘take his chance’ on the fells.
Even if this happened, there’s a strong chance the horse will be physically no better, his behaviour more feral.
Poor horse is very obviously miserable, so is the owner, both been miserable for a long time, with the financial and emotional toll becoming prohibitive.
I think that sadly, PTS is the most positive realistic outcome, and sooner rather than prolong more misery.
Difficult, painful, ultimately the responsible action - and NOTHING to reproach, at all.

 

[jilly2024]

He has had every opportunity and it's not worked. You've done your best. Horses are money pits and stressful much of the time if there are no good times to balance things I would PTS. Easy for me to say I know but there are worse things than PTS. It's a horrible position to be in. X

Thank you for this. I think I know ultimately thats probably what the outcome will be

 

[jilly2024]

Yes, except that Jilly doesn’t seem the sort of owner who would be able to step back like that.
Plus, still have costs of his field and hay etc - because there’s no way she’s just going to let him ‘take his chance’ on the fells.
Even if this happened, there’s a strong chance the horse will be physically no better, his behaviour more feral.
Poor horse is very obviously miserable, so is the owner, both been miserable for a long time, with the financial and emotional toll becoming prohibitive.
I think that sadly, PTS is the most positive realistic outcome, and sooner rather than prolong more misery.
Difficult, painful, ultimately the responsible action - and NOTHING to reproach, at all.

So, our yar has just startes offering grass livery. So yes Id have additional costs but that is an option and Id still be there to check him etc but I dont know really is that just delaying PTS anyways but throwing 6 - 12 months additional cost on top before doing so?
It will be suggested as an option on Tues but I suspect I know the outcome now x

 

[jilly2024]

It's an incredibly hard decision. However you've already given it two years - how much longer are you willing to spend on this horse? All the while using your emotional, physical, and financial resources? Is looking after him status quo bringing you joy? Or dare I say more likely, bringing you down?

I have a friend who has been in the same situation to you for the past 12 months - longer if you count the first year she had the horse where he constantly acted up under saddle but she didn't know why. He's been treated for ulcers twice (or three times, I've lost count), had his hocks done, had his SI medicated, has remedial shoes. He's had every supplement under the sun and his every single need catered to. However it's an endless loop of fixing one thing and then trying to sort something else. And then needing the treat the ulcers again. Frankly I have no idea how my friend stays sane.

Am I your friend? Do we know each other Lol sounds almost identical except my boy is barefoot.
Yeah its a wild time, very emotional and very draining. I love seeing his little face every day but Ive started to resent not riding and I am boring myself now talking about him over and over again when people ask x

 

[jilly2024]

I persevered after my five year old had probably AM which led to laminitis and foundered in all four. We went through months of box rest, and at the end of five years of constant worry, and him having a shitty time of living out clipped, naked, with a muzzle on, through the winder and still gaining weight and being footy I had one last vet check then pts. In those five years I barely rode, and my older horse retired, and now my hip hurts too much to ride anymore anyway. Maybe if I’d made the choice earlier I would still have a riding horse now - I don’t know. But my little horse went easily with his ears pricked, as if he knew it was his time. I couldn’t fix him, and maybe you can’t fix yours. Hugs, because it’s rubbish.

I am so sorry you went through all that, but sounds like he had a peaceful end at the end x

 

[Highmileagecob]

Friend's mare has had suspensory injury. Box rest, walking in hand, surgery, box rest, small pen turn out, hand walking.....fourteen months down the line the mare is still 3/10 lame at anything other than walk. The vet has now said that's about right, as only around 30% ever come back sound. If you can ask your vet to be totally honest and rate his chances of soundness, given the number of cases he/she must have been involved with, it would give you a clearer picture. Unfortunately, the stock answer seems to be ah well, they all heal differently, and it depends on your expectations of soundness. I hope it works out for you. Hugs.

 

[myheartinahoofbeat]

Can you get him comfortable enough to be turned away in a field for 9-12 months? I'd want to try that before PTS if you have the means.We had one with PSD in a left hind, was very lame, not a candidate for surgery but vet suggested other treatments but we'd spent so much just getting a diagnosis!. We turned away against vet advice and he came sound in about 10 months. He's been back in work since May, slow rehab and he is now a very sound, happy hacker. Might be worth a try but I would totally support a decision to PTS now.